Corruption

Gavrilo Princip

Chieftain
Joined
Feb 17, 2002
Messages
21
Location
Dallas
Excuse me if this is a worn out rant, but I can't seem to search and thereby look for old threads on the subject.

Corruption is taking the joy out of playing this game. I don't want to limit my civ to thirty-odd cities in close proximity. I want to conquer the world.

I have far-flung cities for which I have done everything in the book to improve corruption, but they remain at the maximum rate.

I've seen the mods that hack the corruption rate. But I want to know why this particular algorithm is in place. What does it signify? And don't tell me 'the inability to govern at a distance.' That's what a democracy is supposed to address.

Maybe the pedia should say 'at a certain point there's not one thing you can do about corruption so don't even try.'

But that's just my opinion...
 
I still completely agree... the high corruption slows down the game and takes away options. It makes your starting position extremely important -- if you start in the center of a large continent with plenty of resources nearby, corruption won't really bother you. But start on an island, on the edge of a continent, or in an area without resources (so you are forced to grow away from your capital to get resources) and you'll find yourself in a position where you have two choices: 1) Try to conquer everyone before corruption catches up to you and grinds your science to a halt or 2) restart the game.

I've had enough... I'm going to check out the corruption-lowering mods.

Jon
 
Nooooooooooooo!!!!!!!:eek: Not again. Make it stop. Please I can't take it anymore!

Oh. Sorry. Corruption is good. It is a Platonic form. The truth of it will blind us all. It also makes the game more challenging, but for very boring thread topics.

No offense to the two people who have posted here. It is nothing personal, but this topic really irks me.:mad:

Do a search for corruption and resurrect one of the old flamewars, but please don't create another one of these monsters. Just let this thread die. Please.:)
 
First of all, shouldn't your name be Gavrilo Princip?? Not "Princi".


As for "challenges", try playing the game standing on your head with one eye closed. That's a "challenge". And about as smart as the out of control corruption in Civ III.

Go into Editor and make temples, cathedrals, and maybe banks corruption reducers. Lower the cost a bit for the palace and move it to a central location. Lower the cost for the Forbidden Palace and built it in the area that most needs it. There will still be corruption, but it will be reasonable.
 
Eyrei is right, this topic has been beaten to a corrupt and wasteful death; possibly undeath as it seems to have arisen from its grave. Yah, its horrible in vanilla Civ3 but there are lots of ways in the editor to manage it and they have been discussed between fireballs in many, many other threads. Zouave, that was almost positive about Civ3; however, I disagree about Cathedrals - by the time religion got organized to that extent, historically it was a net contributor (increaser) of corruption and waste. I prefer libraries and marketplaces and promise never, ever to respond to another corruption thread.
 
Gavrillo,simply use the Editor,under optimal number of cities set the value to 999 for every map size,this should eliminate all of your corruption probems.

This is an auto generated message,no reply necessary.

:)
 
I can see both ways on corruption. I think it need to be in the game for sure, especially at the lower government settings. As a despot, you know the governor or whoever that is 1000 miles away from you is gonna be lining his own pockets and not giving you jack. On the other hand, I dont think the extreme rate of corruption in Civ3 is historically accurate. I mean, Britain still got a lot of good use out of all of her colonies, and they were all over the globe. You never hear of 90% or higher corruption in her colonies.
 
>Excuse me if this is a worn out rant, but I can't seem to search
>and thereby look for old threads on the subject.

See, that's why I prefaced it the way I did. I knew a flame was coming. I was kinda hoping an admin might fix me up.

Fine, kill the thread. I don't care.

And yes, the name is wrong. I guess I just screwed up.
 
Originally posted by Gavrillo Princi
>Excuse me if this is a worn out rant, but I can't seem to search
>and thereby look for old threads on the subject.

See, that's why I prefaced it the way I did. I knew a flame was coming. I was kinda hoping an admin might fix me up.

Fine, kill the thread. I don't care.

And yes, the name is wrong. I guess I just screwed up.

I resurrected one of the more useful corruption threads. Also, in the Strategy and Tips section, there was a thread called "Official Corruption Solutions Thread" that was also kind of useful.
 
Thank you all for your helpful advise. I can now search and have indeed found many threads on the subject.
 
I am really reluctant to post re corruption/waste again; in fact, in another thread I promised I wouldn't. So let me start with a preamble on what this is and isn't. I am not soliciting opinions on corruption/waste; I am asking a question about changes after the patch (1.17). I am playing my first game under 1.17 and have noticed that corruption/waste starts much earlier (my 3rd city, 4 tiles from the capital was losing 1 shield/1 gold at pop 3). I play fully expanded maps so it is going to to take me days to get to the end of the game - and only that short a time because my wife is in NZ on business. It is also only my second game on emperor, so my questions are:
1. Has corruption/waste been tweaked in the patch to set in earlier or is it just one of the increased difficulties on Emperor?
2. If the former, is it worse all the way through or has more early corruption been traded for lower later on?
3. Am I just imagining the whole thing and neither the change in version or level have affected this?
 
Originally posted by RX2000
I mean, Britain still got a lot of good use out of all of her colonies, and they were all over the globe.

Actually, India did not send manufactured goods to Britain, only resources and luxuries. The British sold these items to other Europeans and back to the colonies for cash. The British made laws against local manufacturing in the colonies, which was one of the gripes of the American colonialists in particular.

The game simulates this aspect of trade quite well. I sell resources and luxuries and usually get quite rich playing Civ3.
 
Originally posted by Gavrilo Princip
>Excuse me if this is a worn out rant, but I can't seem to search
>and thereby look for old threads on the subject.
See, that's why I prefaced it the way I did. I knew a flame was coming. I was kinda hoping an admin might fix me up.

Corruption can be pretty much turned off, but it is a feature worth playing.

Most towns never produce Cathedrals or Battleships. Once you accept this fact, it is quite easy to maximize your potential income and production.
 
Originally posted by eyrei
Nooooooooooooo!!!!!!!:eek: Not again. Make it stop. Please I can't take it anymore!

Oh. Sorry. Corruption is good. It is a Platonic form. The truth of it will blind us all. It also makes the game more challenging, but for very boring thread topics.

No offense to the two people who have posted here. It is nothing personal, but this topic really irks me.:mad:

Do a search for corruption and resurrect one of the old flamewars, but please don't create another one of these monsters. Just let this thread die. Please.:)


eyrei-

No offense meant man, but you know, IF YOU JUST DIDN'T OPEN A THREAD WITH A TITLE LIKE "CORRUPTION" YOU MIGHT JUST BE ABLE TO AVOID GETTING IRKED LIKE MAD BY READING IT. It's true that perhaps newbies SHOULD search on a topic before posting but hey, I bet WE never ever failed to do that before throwing out a question, did we? It's pretty natural for a newcomer to react to the same things we reacted to when we started out, right? SO, just avoid those threads that are old hat to ya.

(btw, there are reasonable people who are irked by endless 1 shield cities on distant continents, you know. AND other then Zouve, too.)

Sorry, wasn't trying to bait you there. Peace, ok? Personally, I no longer read post about how horrible the Naval aspects is, as I'm not going to see anything new- I already KNOW the Naval game is frelled.

Enjoy Civ3, man!
 
Thanks to all for the good advice and useful threads. I don't spend a lot of time on these boards and didn't know corruption was such a big, worn out topic when I replied to the first post.

I can really see both sides of this issue. As an experienced civ2 player, I definitely want a challenge. The truth is I could usually win any civ2 game - it was fun but not always a challenge. I've found Civ3 to be much more difficult (although maybe not as much fun). Corruption/waste is a big reason for that.

But as much as a love a challenge, I still want good gameplay and realism. As someone already posted, I think the key is giving the player options to control corruption/waste. We already have the Forbidden Palace, courthouse, and police station. But when your city only produces 1 usable shield it takes quite a while to build these improvements.

I'll try some of the suggestions and mess around with it further. I'm not ready to uninstall civ3 and play civ2 just yet.

Thanks again!

Jon
 
Originally posted by royfurr



eyrei-

No offense meant man, but you know, IF YOU JUST DIDN'T OPEN A THREAD WITH A TITLE LIKE "CORRUPTION" YOU MIGHT JUST BE ABLE TO AVOID GETTING IRKED LIKE MAD BY READING IT. It's true that perhaps newbies SHOULD search on a topic before posting but hey, I bet WE never ever failed to do that before throwing out a question, did we? It's pretty natural for a newcomer to react to the same things we reacted to when we started out, right? SO, just avoid those threads that are old hat to ya.

(btw, there are reasonable people who are irked by endless 1 shield cities on distant continents, you know. AND other then Zouve, too.)

Sorry, wasn't trying to bait you there. Peace, ok? Personally, I no longer read post about how horrible the Naval aspects is, as I'm not going to see anything new- I already KNOW the Naval game is frelled.

Enjoy Civ3, man!

No offense taken. I think you missed some of the intended humor in my post though. I have, on occasion, had several cities which I could not get past the 1 shield level no matter what I did to them. But, this is rare since the first patch. Most any city can get to the point where it produces 5 or 6 shields if time and money is spent tweaking it. Most peoples complaints, I think, come from cities taken in conquest, and very far from their capitals. In my opinion, it makes a great deal of sense that these cities are corrupt.

Damn, I didn't actually want to post again on this thread, but my fingers just would not stop.:confused:
 
How to Manage Corruption 101:
- Go to completed mod packs forum and install LWC erp5 (maybe 6 if you are brave)
- Go to editor, improvements folder, give Shrine (from LWC mod) anti-corruption effect (put tick in box); Cheap improvement, doesn't bankrupt you to rush - and as stated earlier by Zachriel, do rush it - gives +1 happiness, -1 corruption/waste. Big boost. You can just add Shrine using the hacked Editor but LWC offers many other advantages as well.
- Add anti-corruption effects to whatever improvements that you want/can rationalize (temples - god will get the lawless, libraries - education reduces corruption, market places - good white markets reduce bad black markets, etc)
- Go to map size folder and increase the optimal city number (remembering that you won't be able to build the FP 'til you reach half of whatever number you put in; you'll know when that happens because Sid - I think its Sid - will pop up and tell you the people want the FP). The optimal city number is way out of whack for the larger maps (10 times the area, double the city number; no way if you like large maps and empires).

You will still have corruption and waste, but you will be able to manage it and eventually even those far off cities will become very productive.

On the other topic on this thread - the British Empire should be the model for developing a civ in this game and the game should allow it to work (which unmodded, it really doesn't). Found colonies where there are valuable strategic or luxury resources (Canada was founded for fur by the French and trees (for masts) by the Brits); some will grow into full productive provinces of the Empire - like Canada or Australia; others will be essentially trading posts - like Hong Kong. People have suggested that such Provinces should have some probability of breaking away from the Mother Empire after they hit a given critical mass. This would be more realistic but is unimplementable given the current editor and would make a lot of people unhappy (go to any of the Culture Flipping Threads). If a single city flipping causes that level of reaction, imagine what losing a whole section of your civ would cause.
 
I always make my own maps to play on for this very reason. If you set the number of cities to something very high the corruption is not quite as bad. I keep mine at 60 cities.

I plan to make an attempt at finding a good solution for the corruption issue. I hate trying to build on another piece of land. Some of the improvements will take 80-120 turns to complete. Almost impossible to build up the new land easily. I plan to make something like the forbidden city available to all cities to build. I hope this works out. I heard of someone making a bunch of buildings to help reduce corruption that are cheaper too build. Anyone think this will work? :confused: :scan:

Desert Fox :p

After I posted I noticed the above post. He has a better solution accept I keep having trouble with lwc version 6. 5 crashed on me during the modern times once too. :cry:
 
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