[C3C] COTM160 Rome Demigod

Captain_Jack

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I wasn’t expecting much when I sent Romulus and Remus on their adventures, and I was even less optimistic when my vaunted legionaires were killed by barbarians. I should have paired them up and put them defense only. But still.

I was glad to have iron, but the entire game was a struggle for coal and horses. I was also very weak in the luxury department, but I did not fight any wars to expand so that is what you get. When I eventually had two rubbers late in the game I was able to trade very successfully with Germany:

RubberBounty.jpg


Saltpeter was in Greek territory and I had a city flip to them costing me any chance of getting it. My legionaires held off the enemy until I could get Riflemen bypassing the muskets altogether:

St. Peter's Hope.jpg

I kept expecting to die, but I kept paying little tributes of 20 or 30 gold pieces to my betters and I eventually survived to the end of Sid Time. By the end I did have a tidy little empire, but if anyone had a violent urge towards Rome I might have been in trouble. I think the Ai also doesn’t differentiate between defensive units and perhaps it confused my aging horde of legionaires with mechanized infantry.

Anyway, it was a fun game and I enjoyed staying alive. I will look forward to an easier rendition of Rome sometime and spread my Latin love over the globe. Thanks to Templar_X for creating the world.
 

Quintillus

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Spoiler Mid-Industrial Ages, 1770 AD: Socialist Realism :
In my last update, it was 1690, and we were facing a potential loss to Germany in let-me-count-how-many ways... I think it wound up being five? But Cultural 100K was the most pressing.

Starting in the early 1700s, I kept detailed notes on how much culture Germany was gaining, and how much we were gaining. We invested heavily in Socialist Realism and improved education, and wound up increasing our per-turn culture gain by more than 50% between 1710 and 1768, which was on top of gains prior to 1710. Despite losing a couple cities, Germany made some cultural gains, though more modest, during that time as well. It felt like we were catching up, but we were not confident that they wouldn't surge ahead, and when they added 27 culture-per-turn between 1740 and 1752, we were concerned they recognized our threat to meet 50% of their culture and were making their move.

All this time, we'd been consolidating the 4-city island southeast of Greece. We also got Replaceable Parts, and thus Artillery, upgrading our Cannons but letting our Rifles largely remain as-is.

Meanwhile, the Byzantines and Egyptians fought to a stalemate, and Persia annoyingly kept bombarding our coastline, occasionally causing craters. Our Frigate Factory at Knossos let us stay in a naval duel with Germany, but we couldn't afford to build enough of them to fight off Persia's Frigates too. I seriously considered researching Ironclads just to deal with them.

But instead, in 1754 or 1756, we made peace with Persia, for a nominal tribute and the cessation of Frigate bombardment. We expected that they would declare war on us as soon as we landed on the one-city island Germany controlled (formerly Babylon, formerly us, formerly Babylon again, originally Greece, named Thessaloniki). But they had canceled their MPP with Germany.

Instead, in 1757, Persia declared war on Germany! :eek: We were the only country at war with Germany at the time, so it was purely of their own volition!

This was of great concern, because the one surefire way for Germany to boost their culture was by capturing more cities and thus building more Temples and Libraries. Just when we were getting close enough to be more confident we could catch them, too! Eight cities onshore would be 40 culture per turn, plus two offshore, it could be 50 fairly easy. Byzantium had managed to make peace with Germany while they fought us, but Persia would feel their wrath...

Even if we stayed close enough in culture, conquering Persia would give Germany close to 50% land, and a great Histographic advantage. We'd only just taken one hard-fought island from them, and while they couldn't gain against us, they could rack up a lot of points if they took over other civilizations, making Histographic or Domination defeats going concerns.

So, we gave Persia Electricity + Replaceable Parts for Democracy, Free Artistry, 15 GPT, a World Map, and all their money. We then gave them Rubber (which they had in their territory, but had not connected) for an alliance against Germany and a Mutual Protection Pact. The latter designed so that they'd have to join us against Egypt when we decided to conquer them.

Persia took one German (formerly Zulu) city on the turn they declared war, so their mediocre Musketmen + Longbowman + rare Cavalry invasions of my land weren't their strongest troops. They'd lose it two turns later, but we hoped they might not fall entirely, with upgraded Infantry in their cities... not that the Zulu implosion despite our supply of Riflemen gave much confidence...

Thus, in 1760, we formulated a plan to invade Germany and disconnect their Rubber. Surprisingly, they had only one source:

1658477963599.png


Our brand-new Infantry Army would do the honors. We agreed to pay Theodora 15 GPT to keep her embargo against Germany as insurance, and with Babylon lacking Rubber and Egypt having but one source, we were confident that if no resources changed locations, we could keep Germany from building any more Infantry, and later on, Panzers, unless they captured Persia's not-yet-roaded island Rubber resource. Would that be enough to save Persia? Maybe, maybe not, but it would give them a better chance.

After that, we'd send engineers to build a star fort at the indicated location, and once it was ready, move our army behind it to take Rhodes, and let Germany slam their army against the fort. Or what was left of it after fighting Persia, however that went.

In 1763, Germany fell into Anarchy just as Persia became Fascist, and in 1768 Germany emerged as Fascist themselves. Other than the formerly Zulu city changing hands once each way, no other cities have been captured. Momentum seems to be swinging in our direction, enough so that we've even taken Egypt's last mainland city (again) and invaded their formerly-Byzantine lands. And we have confirmation, thanks to Dortmund flipping, that Germany can't build Infantry anymore.

But that doesn't mean it will be easy. German Cavalry could yet crush Persia. German science is up at least The Corporation on us, and likely Refining and perhaps Steel, though we have the lead on Atomic + Electronics + Hoover. They may get Destroyers soon and Bombers first as well. We're only safe from a UN vote as long as Persia is alive, oddly enough!. At least Domination no longer appears to be on the table; our 42% pop (to Germany's 35%) is likely to grow once we research Sanitation, and at 33% land area, we only need slightly more land to guarantee that we don't lose that way. But Germany still has a considerable score lead of 4500 - 3500 on us, for Histographic, and that is likely stable for the time being.

On Monarch, I'd be confident the score gap, and Germany in general, could be overcome, but on Demigod... let's just say we're really curious what our spies will report about Germany's army once we build the Intelligence Agency in 5 turns. Our Military Advisor considers us to be weak compared to Germany, and that seems entirely believable.
 
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Captain_Jack

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Spoiler Mid-Industrial Ages, 1770 AD: Socialist Realism :
In my last update, it was 1690, and we were facing a potential loss to Germany in let-me-count-how-many ways... I think it wound up being five? But Cultural 100K was the most pressing.

Starting in the early 1700s, I kept detailed notes on how much culture Germany was gaining, and how much we were gaining. We invested heavily in Socialist Realism and improved education, and wound up increasing our per-turn culture gain by more than 50% between 1710 and 1768, which was on top of gains prior to 1710. Despite losing a couple cities, Germany made some cultural gains, though more modest, during that time as well. It felt like we were catching up, but we were not confident that they wouldn't surge ahead, and when they added 27 culture-per-turn between 1740 and 1752, we were concerned they recognized our threat to meet 50% of their culture and were making their move.

All this time, we'd been consolidating the 4-city island southeast of Greece. We also got Replaceable Parts, and thus Artillery, upgrading our Cannons but letting our Rifles largely remain as-is.

Meanwhile, the Byzantines and Egyptians fought to a stalemate, and Persia annoyingly kept bombarding our coastline, occasionally causing craters. Our Frigate Factory at Knossos let us stay in a naval duel with Germany, but we couldn't afford to build enough of them to fight off Persia's Frigates too. I seriously considered researching Ironclads just to deal with them.

But instead, in 1754 or 1756, we made peace with Persia, for a nominal tribute and the cessation of Frigate bombardment. We expected that they would declare war on us as soon as we landed on the one-city island Germany controlled (formerly Babylon, formerly us, formerly Babylon again, originally Greece, named Thessaloniki). But they had canceled their MPP with Germany.

Instead, in 1757, Persia declared war on Germany! :eek: We were the only country at war with Germany at the time, so it was purely of their own volition!

This was of great concern, because the one surefire way for Germany to boost their culture was by capturing more cities and thus building more Temples and Libraries. Just when we were getting close enough to be more confident we could catch them, too! Eight cities onshore would be 40 culture per turn, plus two offshore, it could be 50 fairly easy. Byzantium had managed to make peace with Germany while they fought us, but Persia would feel their wrath...

Even if we stayed close enough in culture, conquering Persia would give Germany close to 50% land, and a great Histographic advantage. We'd only just taken one hard-fought island from them, and while they couldn't gain against us, they could rack up a lot of points if they took over other civilizations, making Histographic or Domination defeats going concerns.

So, we gave Persia Electricity + Replaceable Parts for Democracy, Free Artistry, 15 GPT, a World Map, and all their money. We then gave them Rubber (which they had in their territory, but had not connected) for an alliance against Germany and a Mutual Protection Pact. The latter designed so that they'd have to join us against Egypt when we decided to conquer them.

Persia took one German (formerly Zulu) city on the turn they declared war, so their mediocre Musketmen + Longbowman + rare Cavalry invasions of my land weren't their strongest troops. They'd lose it two turns later, but we hoped they might not fall entirely, with upgraded Infantry in their cities... not that the Zulu implosion despite our supply of Riflemen gave much confidence...

Thus, in 1760, we formulated a plan to invade Germany and disconnect their Rubber. Surprisingly, they had only one source:

View attachment 634707

Our brand-new Infantry Army would do the honors. We agreed to pay Theodora 15 GPT to keep her embargo against Germany as insurance, and with Babylon lacking Rubber and Egypt having but one source, we were confident that if no resources changed locations, we could keep Germany from building any more Infantry, and later on, Panzers, unless they captured Persia's not-yet-roaded island Rubber resource. Would that be enough to save Persia? Maybe, maybe not, but it would give them a better chance.

After that, we'd send engineers to build a star fort at the indicated location, and once it was ready, move our army behind it to take Rhodes, and let Germany slam their army against the fort. Or what was left of it after fighting Persia, however that went.

In 1763, Germany fell into Anarchy just as Persia became Fascist, and in 1768 Germany emerged as Fascist themselves. Other than the formerly Zulu city changing hands once each way, no other cities have been captured. Momentum seems to be swinging in our direction, enough so that we've even taken Egypt's last mainland city (again) and invaded their formerly-Byzantine lands. And we have confirmation, thanks to Dortmund flipping, that Germany can't build Infantry anymore.

But that doesn't mean it will be easy. German Cavalry could yet crush Persia. German science is up at least The Corporation on us, and likely Refining and perhaps Steel, though we have the lead on Atomic + Electronics + Hoover. They may get Destroyers soon and Bombers first as well. We're only safe from a UN vote as long as Persia is alive, oddly enough!. At least Domination no longer appears to be on the table; our 42% pop (to Germany's 35%) is likely to grow once we research Sanitation, and at 33% land area, we only need slightly more land to guarantee that we don't lose that way. But Germany still has a considerable score lead of 4500 - 3500 on us, for Histographic, and that is likely stable for the time being.

On Monarch, I'd be confident the score gap, and Germany in general, could be overcome, but on Demigod... let's just say we're really curious what our spies will report about Germany's army once we build the Intelligence Agency in 5 turns. Our Military Advisor considers us to be weak compared to Germany, and that seems entirely believable.
Quintillus, you play at a much higher level than I do. I would never think to give vital research to the enemy of my enemy, and I would never keep physical track of the culture other nations are producing per turn. I know I must to survive at this level, but I am impressed with your performance and your write-up.
 

Quintillus

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Quintillus, you play at a much higher level than I do. I would never think to give vital research to the enemy of my enemy, and I would never keep physical track of the culture other nations are producing per turn. I know I must to survive at this level, but I am impressed with your performance and your write-up.

Thanks! Though I should note that my usual level is Monarch/Emperor. I might have won on Demigod on a Tiny Archipelago once? And that extra movement point for the Legionary was clutch. In retrospect I should have pressed Egypt when I had the advantage instead of trying to slingshot the Great Library... but without the extra movement I might never have been able to overcome their War Chariots in the first place. That movement point (and the civ being Rome) was part of why I decided to try this one at all.

It's also the first time I've kept that close of track of culture. It was actually while writing up the 1690 write-up that I realized things were bad and I needed to speed up culture ASAP. Now it's 1800, and I've stopped tracking it so closely since we're above 50%, and gaining at about 75% of the German rate. Still, it helped figure out how long I needed to heavily prioritize culture over military production.

Supplying the enemies of my enemies is my preference to micro-managing my own cities' production, which is traditional at these levels from what I've read, but which I don't have the patience for. I think the only "traditional" micro I did was intentionally slowing down Rome's production to prevent it from completing its Theory of Evolution prebuild a turn too soon. I guess you could count the fact that I'm building Infantry in 45+ shield cities and 30-39 shield cities, but leaving 40-44 shield cities for Cavalry, as micro, but with the "Always Build Previously Built Unit" option, it doesn't add overhead to maintain.

----

Spoiler 1800 :

As predicted, Persia has lost all their mainland cities, though it took until the mid 1790s, 20 turns or so. They still have Nicomedia, home of their rubber.

I've taken three Egyptian cities on the Byzantine island, and one on the three-city island west of Greece (south of Egypt), which also houses Nicomedia and a Babylonian city. Egypt now lacks Rubber, but still has enough Infantry that Byzantium has only taken one city from them (two remain on their island).

We took Rhodes as planned, and then moved to take Ganges, the German rubber city.

In 1780 we planted spies everywhere except Byzantium (caught, no war). This revealed that German had almost 150 Infantry, 20 Riflemen, and 48 Cavalry. A significant number, even without the ability to build more Infantry. Their navy was smaller than Persia's, however, and smaller than ours. We were researching Ironclads to gain the naval advantage more decisively, after finishing Sanitation.

Taking Ganges was successful, but Mark Antony's Infantry Army was targeted by the German Cavalry, and despite felling 15 Cavalry, eventually was defeated. :eek: Germany's Cavalry count only fell to 45, and this a couple turns after they had 48. It was clear that while we were busy building Hospitals, they were able to replenish their losses as quickly as we could ours. Maybe not if they lost 15 Cavalry per turn, but we didn't have infinite Infantry armies. At least they didn't attack the barricade outside Rhodes.

And this is where it may have been a mistake to cut their source of Rubber. Not being able to build Infantry, they built more Cavalry, which meant fewer losses to Persia as they could retreat and return later, and quicker advances. In theory Persia could counter-attack better, but in practice Persia was too weak for that, and as we saw at Ganges, when Germany recaptured it they just moved up a couple Infantry from the reserves to form its new garrison (plus a couple Rifleman conscripts). We subsequently razed Ganges.

The traditional, and perhaps correct, approach here would be to grind forward from Rhodes, starting a war of attrition and counting on superior positioning and tactics to win. However, I'm planning a different strategy. Germany already is up to 75 Cavalry, and it would be a long slow journey, especially at the start.

South of Berlin is Germany's main source of Furs. Four Roman Armies are now en route to land at the isthmus (2 tiles wide) that connects Berlin to that area. With Armies on the isthmus, we'll block reinforcements, and then take Bonn and the Cottbus, the city with the furs, securing a luxury. This will boost our score, and reduce Germany to one source, hurting their exports. If that succeeds, we're considering a 20-turn peace, to allow our cities to replenish our armies after finishing their hospitals. Then, hopefully, we can advance towards the fine German wines near Kongisburg, east of Berlin, prior to taking Berlin itself.

At any point, we should be able to send in the Cavalry to pillage German's rubber. We might also have to take Nicomedia if they take it from Persia. But the idea would be to boost our score with Furs now, replenish, and then renew the offensive.

Risks: Germany will get more Infantry. And they might get a few Panzers, though we should be able to stop production of more at nearly any time. Our commissars just stole The Corporation, and learned that Germany is researching Combustion. So they could get Mass Production or Flight within the next 20 turns. But that they are about to leapfrog us on the seas is also a reason to seek a pause while we catch up. We have an advantage for now with superior Frigate numbers and a few Ironclads, but Destroyers could threaten our reinforcements very easily. Better to secure a couple more ports and reinforce while at peace while they have superior ships.

That will also give us a chance to figure out where the Oil is. I doubt we'll be able to disconnect it, but it's worth examining. Also worth figuring out if we can cut their Horses or Saltpeter - again unlikely, but we'll consider all resource-denial or luxury-acquisition strategies that might help.

Long term, our economy is now better than Germany's, in commerce and production, so we expect to fully catch up technologically. I'd love to have Computers, then we could dominate both their Cavalry and their Panzers. But we probably won't wait that long before challenging them again. In the meantime? One of Babylon's old cities just flipped back to them, so I think we know where our newest troops will be going. :trouble:
 

Quintillus

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Spoiler 1826; The Phony War :

The war with Germany continues, having become an ideological struggle, the glorious Roman Red Army fighting for the proletariat, while the German Fascists fight for world domination. True, you might point out, the Romans would achieve world domination by winning as well, but we can actually say we conquered the world in self-defense (of ourselves and our allies) if this were to happen.

The problem is how do we deal with Germany's ever-increasing number of units? It's become an arms race, to see whoever can reach the Civ3 limit of 8192 units first. Germany has 229 Infantry and 9 Riflemen; we have 62 Infantry and 26 Riflemen, but could afford to upgrade instantly. Germany has 118 Cavalry; we have 50. Germany also has 38 Guerillas; we have 39 Artillery.

We went ahead with Project Warm Coat, to secure furs. Octavian (Crusaders) and Titus (Riflemen) blocked off the area, and we now have a nice little colony in the south.

1658616472625.png

In a turn we'll have Furs, and we've been preparing to meet Germany here as well. We have a pretty secure way to convoy over more troops (and are building more Ironclads every turn; we have 25 now, some on this front, some elsewhere), and while it took a few turns to establish that, we'll have 20 Infantry in Bonn by the end of the turn. We decided Bonn was a good city to defend, as it is on Hills, and with Walls + Civil Defense, it can make a very stout defense indeed.

Thus, the plan is bombard all the roads between Salzburg and Konigsberg to slow the Germans down, use our 4 Armies in the area to ward off Cologne, use our Legionary Army to defend the Mountains north of Bonn to funnel troops in via the tile NW of Bonn, and to put as many Infantry and Artillery in Bonn as we can. At 10 * 2.75 (hills + walls + civil defense + fortify) = 27.5 defense for the Infantry, the Cavalry ought to bounce off of them, and then be retreating when the Infantry and Guerillas arrive; meanwhile our troops should have had time to heal.

20 Infantry probably isn't enough, though, even with all those defensive bonuses. We recently realized we could let the Germans approach Rhodes for a turn without them actually reaching it.

1658616759062.png


They promptly sent in 104 Cavalry, 59 Infantry, 26 Guerillas, a Rifleman, and a Settler (give or take on the higher numbers). Cincinnatus, leader of our Army in the area, may have a lot of firepower backing him up, but even if we had walls in Rhodes, he would need a defence of legendary proportions to stand a chance. Like, legendary enough that we'd have to name a city after him...

So the question is, do we send our 7 Cavalry in Rhodes to try to reduce Germany's Cavalry a bit? We have Artillery too, but on a stack of 104 Cavalry, it will make no impact whatsoever - and wouldn't even if all our Artillery were in Rhodes. By comparison, we have 13 Cavalry outside Cologne, whose job will be counter-attacking the Germans once we let them attack there.

The other question is soon to be, do we research Flight or Mass Production next? We decided to steal Steel and Refining, but had the money to steal Combustion several turns before Germany finished it, which they just did. Their tech rate has noticeably slowed. We're leaning towards Flight, as Bombers would allow us to target Germany's two oil reserves from the air.

1658617201267.png


In theory we could target the one near Isandhlwana near the sea, but it's been tough progress on the sea in that theater. But with a range of 10, we'd need to build a city west of Hieraconpolis (which is range 11), or perhaps build an Airfield on the island by Tyre. Can you bomb out a colony from the air is the other question? I don't think I've ever tried, because when are there colonies by the time you get Bombers, and even if there were why would you need to try to bomb them? But Germany's army is too string to land troops in such a flat area, they aren't going to culturally expand there due to xenophobia, and that resource *is* important, so I guess I'll find out.

If we are able to take out their Oil, combined with using an Army to take out their Rubber (I guess that's the other way I could get to their Oil...), then defeating Germany should be fairly straightforward. I'm considering playing a bit more honorably than just Army-pillaging the Rubber though, the poor AI doesn't know it should defend it, let alone that while they may be strong, my Armies aren't actually invincible outside of cities. Though I will continue the isthmus-blockading; I do want to win the game, after all!

Germany leads by 949 points currently (down from about 1000); I am unsure whether I would catch them with no more land gains, although the furs next turn should help. We have 38/49 land/pop; Germany has 40/40.


Spoiler 1842, Naval Supremacy :

The last 8 turns have been spent upgrading Ironclads to Destroyers, Galleons to Transports, and building up our Bonn defense. We want it to be as good as possible when we open the floodgates... which will be in just a few years when the Civil Defense finished. We sped it up by joining an Indian workers to Bonn (no German workers! although I guess it wouldn't matter with as many defenders as we have, it won't flip regardless). We could have sped it up more by disbanding, but by next turn will have 60 Infantry and 27 Artillery defending Bonn. If Germany threw everything at us, they might still win against those numbers, but considering that they'll surely leave some defenders, we think we stand a good chance or repelling their expected 200 or so Cavalry, Guerillas, and Infantry.

We've also determined that we're gaining about 50 points per 8 turns. We're down by just over 900, which means we need 18 more sets of 8 turns, or 144 turns. It's turn 386, which means we'll tie Germany's score around turn 530, also known as 2040 AD. Not a lot of wiggle room! And if Germany ever researches Sanitation and boosts their population, we might not catch them in time. So to have a safe Histographic, we have to add more land. We could make peace and try for a Minimal Histographic, but I'd rather not lose again!

Our first Bomber just got finished, and those should prove useful in denying Germany Oil, and also Rubber, since we realized we can't move our Army without losing Rhodes. Germany is researching Flight as well (per our spies), and may get a few Bombers or Fighters. But it looks like we should be able to turn the tide just soon enough to prevent Panzers, and with them the German Golden Age. Which is almost disappointing, a late-Industrial tank war would have been a fitting end to the saga. Maybe we'll let them have just enough to play around with, since whatever happens, by 1900 we will have the Mechanized Infantry, and they will not.
 
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Quintillus

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Spoiler 1842 to 1876, Storm of Steel :
I think it was 1848 when we opened the gates to Germany reaching Bonn. It took two turns just for them to move close enough to launch an attack after our 1852 turn, so devastated was the nearby countryside. But eventually, they arrived.

On the first turn, 45 Cavalry died attacking our defenses, and 57 more Cavalry retreated. One Roman Infantry fell in the defenses, an even better result than predicted. I think this is because the 10 vs 27.5 stats applied for each round, and thus our overall odds were better than that. We also had Artillery helping us, though not against all 102 troops. Was it the largest single-turn attack I've faced in Civ? Possibly so; the screen saver, on a five-minute timer, kicked in twice while the Germans were attacking.

We'd use everyone we had, including the Cavalry who arrived between 1848 and 1854, to defeat all of the Cavalry that had retreated on our subsequent turn, the German Infantry not yet having arrived to cover their retreating forces. Germany's cavalry corps was absolutely devastated, and for a moment it looked like our plan would work.

But Germany adjusted. They would attack again, with Infantry and more Cavalry, and with slightly better luck. But they never attacked with all their troops. This meant that after 1854, they always had cover on their retreats. They also remained strong enough that advancing all of our forces was a very risky proposition; without that defensive bulwark, they might yet force us off the landmass.

And thus the war ground on. Germany would send in troops fairly consistently, but always seemed to have more to replace them. From spy reports, we would later deduce that Germany must have mobilized their economy for the war effort. Eventually, we saw that they only have 4 Infantry and a Guerilla covering a Cavalry retreat on a mountain, and used our artillery, Armies, and Cavalry to take the mountain. Our plan was to use Flavius Aetius's Infantry Army to take the neighboring Grassland and trap a large part of Germany's army, but we never had an opportunity; there were always 30-40 troops on that tile, and it was too far from Bonn to bombard safely. And even if we'd tried to use our Mountain troops, Germany was bombarding our Cavalry Army with artillery to wear it down and make it too risky to use on offensive operations.

By this point we'd exceeded our free support limit, but it mattered little; Germany still outnumbered us on the front. It was truly a stalemate.

Though we did have Bombers, they could do little against so many troops. Instead, most of them focused on resource denial, both strategic and luxury, including using some medium bombers from aircraft carriers to reach deeper into German land. But in the 1860s we found Germany building more destroyers again - they'd reconnected their oil.

This was the potential flaw in the "deny them Panzers" plan. Our Bombers could hardly be everywhere, even as their number grew, and Germany's workers were quite efficient. We sent a few back to disconnect the oil again, but also realized that we'd bomb their rubber one turn, only for them to reconnect it the following turn. Thus we had to expand our bombing operation to cover neighboring tiles as well, and whether that will remain sufficient or we'll have to keep expanding the radius is anyone's guess.

We did get the first Tanks to the front around 1870, and they are allowing us to launch more counterattacks against German troops in forests. It's a single-digit number of Tanks at this point, but there is hope that in sufficient numbers, they might break through Germany's lines and allow us to push towards Berlin.

Looking forward, we have one plan beyond "more tanks" and "mech inf" (which is due in one turn). That is "strategic bombing", focused on factories. Germany's workers are repairing the rail network at a dogged rate, but as Germany is mobilized, they won't be able to rebuild Factories that are destroyed. And they can't demobilize until the war ends. Thus, we see a way to reduce their industrial capacity enough that perhaps eventually, they won't be able to resupply so quickly.

Germany still leads by 803 points; we were previously gaining 50 points per 8 turns, but recently gained 97 points in 17 turns, a lower rate. At that rate, we'll lose by 18 points if the trend continues, a concerning proposition. The lower rate of catch-up could be due to Germany having recovered from the city pop penalty on switching to Fascism, or perhaps they've simply force rushed less since mobilizing, increasing population as well as happiness. We're tied at 40% each in Land Area, and lead 50% - 38% in population, so we're still gaining... just not quite fast enough. Thank goodness we connected Furs!

Our records indicate we've defeated 89 German Infantry, 139 Cavalry, and 13 Guerilla so far in the war. 243 Infantry, 45 Cavalry, 44 Guerillas, and more every turn remain. 8 Infantry, 3 Cavalry, and 1 Tank have been lost on our side. The Power Histograph definitely shows progress, but it's been 50 years (25 turns) since we took a city. Germany hasn't been a pushover.

The front:

1659236256255.png


Don't let that Guerilla in Salzburg fool you, there's plenty of German Infantry nearby...
 

templar_x

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Rome in 10ad...
1659423972321.png
 

templar_x

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Not sure if I will be able to ever finish a game these days. But I tried this one and pulled off quite a good start, I think. Comparison will show... ;)

However, I messed up the 1000bc save and stats, so I played until 10ad and post my notes and a picture of my empire now.

at 10ad, Egypt has long been eliminated. 3 pop factories are running. i am in a war for the rest of my continent, and while i intend to keep Greece and Babylon around, I want their cities and their land. and their wonders. Even though the best wonders were built somewhere else.

with so many Sci nations in the game, I decided to go for a science game, even though not being Sci ourselves.

very enjoyable game so far, but now the chores of a long game lie ahead. ;)

t_x
 

templar_x

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write-up:

Move legionaries to both mountains, find 2nd cow, draw a start excel for the first time in a long time. After considering 3 different starting locations, I settle in place and come up with quite a strange pattern:
Rax, worker, granary (depending on whether i get POT by trade! So quite a risk on archi, but we have 2move-start units, so when risk this if not here?), combo-factory!

4000
Discover coast (!) to the NW, another river in the S
found
Full steam on WRI
3950
First both units go east, next turn one will start the arch N and one S
3900
Find 1st lux and a first hut, don´t open those with units
3700
Find 2nd lux and 2nd hut
3650
Barracks!
3550
Haven´t met anyone, but there´s a lot of land, so hopefully i will get POT???
IBT i meet Greece! But they do not have POT. Seems they do not know yet anyone else…
3500 also meet Egypt!!! But they also lack POT yet! L
3500 worker
3450 too good a deal… trade WC+ALPHA with Egypt for MAS+2 slaves+10g… hopefully Greece gets POT ;)
3400 have to abstain from a similar deal with Greece so to keep the chance alive
3250 the gamble pays off: Greece has POT and the deal goes: MAS for POT+45g (then POT for CB with Egypt)
3000 „greek“ legionary returned, but „Egyptian“ legionary to my surprise finds Greek borders! So that is still no ocean to the west?
2950 granary + ready for combo factory right away!
2900 warrior, then settler, starting combo cirle!
2850 finally reduce time on WRI!
2750 meet Babylon, trade MAS for BW+3g
First settler!

2670 found 2nd town 699, dyes have a worker on them
Useless hut gives maps L
Barb notification on F3 for the first time, I´m happy i brought 1 legionary back
2590 barb appears from north; dyes connected
2550 2nd hut to the SW gives barbs. Greek warriors were there so i decided to open it myself…
Northern barb warrior withdrew again
2470 found 3rd town 211
2310 4th town 8777
2190 WRI in, i abstain from all trades, CoL next
2150 5th town 2333
2110 2nd win against a barb warrior promotes my homeguard legion
1990 6th town 444
1830 66699 for the first town by the real sea
1700 889 as future SF
Curraghs start to roam the mare nostrum and the „Atlantic ocean“

1675 Greece and Babs have Writing, I trade it with Egypt for IW, the deal I abstained from until now so to keep WRI a monopoly for alap. Find iron next to Rome, nice, and of course next to that strangely planted Egyptian town to the NW.
Leading in most of the important stats.
1625 CoL in, Philo next
1600 trade CoL for Maths with Greece (to practically gift it around), get Myst+TW and some gold. No horses nearby, however, no need for horses in this game either. ;)
1550 curragh meets Celtic warrior to the east, no trades yet, has yet to survive the IBT
Settle silks in the north, they have yet to get connected though
1525 it survived. Meet Zulu and also see colors of a 3rd culture!

1450 Philo in, and I am first to it! Choose Rep, Lit next
1425 have some builds finish and revolt only this next turn

7 turns of anarchy :(

1325 meet India, assume there are also 3 civs on that land mass, so trade Philo for HR + quite some gold
1275 Republic, finally
1225 2nd lux eventually connected
1125 Lit in, Curr next

1000bc… i forgot that one completely ;( sorry, guys, no dates this time.

975 prepared a little war with archers against Egypt, declare
950 take their iron town
Meet Byzanz and trade them HR for quite e few coins
825 war not exactly going as hoped, and my curragh sinks seeing new shores and civ colours. L
750 peace has been made with Egypt, not much gained, not much lost, but the others on the continent are in a war with each other and waste their GAs. My rep is busted though (not that this worries me too much).
2 turns before I would research it myself, i can trade for Con as the last obligatory AA tech. Enter the MA, everyone else behind me (2 unmet, so i am guessing there ;)).
Start slow on Eng, the tech i at this moment desire the most. Want to trade with the scientifics for their freebies before i commit more.
690 kill a landed Bab unit, then decide to trigger my GA
Gift them up. Greece gets Mono; Babs draw Eng; Byz gets Feud. Nice.
650 IBT Greece blackmailed me and i declined. They declared. I upgraded my warriors to legionaries this very turn.
Lots of barbs molesting my borders, after i have not seen a camp in ages L

Meet Persia
1t-legionaries in Rome
Some progress against Greece, then

530 LoD on Egypt, we are at war again!
470 meet Germans as the last civ
430 Theo in, Edu next
390 bring Rome to size 12 and 40spt in the GA!
Also finally trade for Feud this turn and trade it around. Nets me some money and a lux from Babylon. Edu in 5 now, with an instant varsity in Rome on the way. Lux to 10% temporarily.
370 FP built by hand
350 temporary peace with Egypt for their island town, they´ve got 5 towns left
330IBT Babs build the Gardens, painting a nice fat cross on their head. ;)
Declared on Babylon, but miscalculated that i could get Greece in. I couldn´t. rep loss weighed too strong. L
290 last IBT Edu was in, first varsity already built.
Together with Greece, I take out Egypt.

130bc Astro in, capital switches to Cope´s
30 Cope´s finishes, let´s build a few 1t-horses in Rome now.
10bc
Revert the alliances, since i could not get Greece into an alliance agains Babylon… LoD for some Greek units, gaining my first MGL (finally) and getting Babylon into a war with them
Also, Banking in… hoped any of those DG civs may come up with Inv… don´t look like it.

10ad but this time i do have notes (!):
6 cities, no 1 in all important F11-Stats. 150g. know all civs. 2 galleys, 1 cara. 1 army! 14 legions. 2 MIs. 1 horse. 2 pikes. 2 archers.
1 settler, 33 workers.
WH from Greece + Zulus
3 pop pumps.
some little cash.

E vics
IIIII IIIII IIIII IIIII IIIII III 1st MGL 10bc
it took a while but then I got my first Leader to form an army! that will come handy when I will take Greek cities soon - Greece has only archers in the offense, but hoplites in towns are another story. and they have the Great Wall (and I do not want until Metallurgy before I start to conquer them, as that would be to close when I need Alexander around for the next era tech circus).

t_x
 
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templar_x

usually walks his talks
Joined
Jun 15, 2008
Messages
2,747
Location
on a learning curve
Anyway, it was a fun game and I enjoyed staying alive. I will look forward to an easier rendition of Rome sometime and spread my Latin love over the globe. Thanks to Templar_X for creating the world.

it wasn´t me. :) but Green Bear!
t_x
 

Più Freddo

From space, earth is blue
Joined
Jan 26, 2005
Messages
2,138
Location
Vienna, Austria
i intend to keep Greece and Babylon around, I want their cities and their land. and their wonders. Even though the best wonders were built somewhere else.

with so many Sci nations in the game, I decided to go for a science game, even though not being Sci ourselves.
Great minds think alike. I made the same plan! I guess it's time to make a write-up...
 

Maduin

Chieftain
Joined
Jun 1, 2007
Messages
3
Hey all!

Random post here, but just felt like making it known to the world that I am competing in this challenge. Never too late for your first COTM am I right? I've never beaten Demigod before (but probably only tried two or three times over the last 20 years). Also never done no reload, extra challenge! The starting 2 Legionnaire's and nice starting spot help mitigate that a bit though.

I'm taking notes and screenshots on my major moves and decision points. It's going decently so far. Looking forward to learning a whole bunch along the way, here's to hoping I make it past the Middle Ages!
 

Lanzelot

Moderator
Moderator
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Jun 25, 2007
Messages
6,092
Location
Heidelberg
The game crashed on the victory screen. I know this can sometimes happen with the space race victory, when it can't play the movie, but I won via Conquest?! Any idea what might be the problem here?

I am replaying the last auto-save now on a different computer and will make a .sav, before hitting end of turn. If it crashes again, I can then perhaps submit the .sav on the turn before victory?

Edit: ok, on my desktop, the victory screen played successfully?! :dunno:
 
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Quintillus

Archiving Civ3 Content
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Supporter
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Mar 17, 2007
Messages
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Ohio
After a couple weeks away from Civ (and an unsuccessful attempt to play the Civ4 BOTM in time, these 3-month windows are nice), I've resumed the game. It's slow late-game.

Spoiler 1884, the Age of Mechanized Infantry :
In 1878, we research Computers, and have the money to upgrade about a dozen Infantry right away. Already, our 59 Artillery (+captured) and increasing numbers of Tanks were starting to turn the tide. But Mechanized Infantry would entirely end Germany's ability to pin us down.

In 1880, a Roman Cavalry force would take Salzburg, the first city to be taken on the mainland in decades (a minor island was taken in 1876). Germany would re-take Salzburg as only one Tank was able to help a couple Cavalry defend it, but in 1882 a dozen Mech Inf, along with scores of Artillery, would reach Salzburg. Germany's counter-attack would be entirely ineffective against this force.

Rather than trying to bombard Germany's factories out of existence as theorized by our strategic bombing advocates, I've switched to splitting up Germany's lands via targeting railroads. By using aircraft carriers with bombers on them, aided by the occasional offshore bombardment from a Destroyer, we have split Germany's rail network into several pieces:

1660627093214.png


The green lines are where we've bombed the network into separate pieces. It takes Infantry two turns to cross either of these; Cavalry can traverse one-and-a-half of them. Conveniently, Byzantium brought Persia back into the war, and Persia landed a couple Infantry on the far eastern edge of the continent, drawing way more forces than Germany should have sent. Now these forces are stuck heading back west slowly, and as a result Germany's counter-attacks have not only been hopelessly obsolete, but not even that large.

Soon, we plan to start fanning out our Mechanized Infantry to form an impenetrable wall. We might lose a few, but it should be worth it to allow our Tanks to advance more quickly without risk of being attacked. Germany is still building a lot of Cavalry, which threaten Tanks but won't do anything to Mech Inf.

We now only trail by 767 points. At this rate we'll catch up in 86 turns, or 2003 AD. I think our luxury-resource-bombing strategy is starting to lower Germany's score, and our score also increases as our population increases (now 52%, or 50 million Romans) and we build Marketplaces and Colosseums. One could make an argument for turning off science and turning up the lux slider now that we have Mech Inf, and laying back and basking in happiness to boost our score. That would likely work, and could allow for a victory with less time playing the game, but we didn't fight this war just to stop outside the gates of Berlin. At the very least we need to take Konigsberg (east of Salzburg) and its Wines.
 
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