Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Berzerker, Jan 24, 2022.
This confirms what I’ve said and contradicted what you said.
The problems with masks were described on a few pages and I said the link didn''t contradict him.
"I didn't see a study on the long term effects of breathing thru masks related specifically to particles getting sucked inside."
you quoted that and then accused me of trying to hide it.
From the link:
How does that contradict me?
now Gorbles will show up to accuse me of cherry picking quotes
If people seriously think wearing masks outweighs not wearing them they will continue to wear them. There will be a subset of people who continue to wear masks for a variety of reasons (feel safer physically, feel safer emotionally, strong fear of diseases, etc.). It's a free country, people should be allowed to do whatever they feel like to make themselves feel safe as long as they aren't infringing on the rights of others.
North Korea Reports 8 Deaths As Kim Laments Virus Response
State media didn’t specify how many of the fever cases and deaths were confirmed as COVID-19 cases.
May. 15, 2022, 08:49 PM EDT
EOUL, South Korea (AP) — North Korea on Monday reported 8 new deaths and 392,920 more people with fevers amid a growing COVID-19 outbreak as leader Kim Jong Un blasted officials over delays in medicine deliveries and ordered his military to get involved in the pandemic response in the country’s capital, Pyongyang. The North’s emergency anti-virus headquarters said more than 1.2 million people fell ill amid a rapid spread of fever since late April and about 564,860 are currently under quarantine. The eight new deaths reported in the 24 hours through 6 p.m. Sunday brought its death toll to 50. State media didn’t specify how many of the fever cases and deaths were confirmed as COVID-19 cases. Experts say North Korea likely lacks testing supplies and equipment to confirm coronavirus infections in large numbers and is mostly relying on isolating people with symptoms at shelters.
Experts say the failure to slow the virus could have dire consequences for North Korea, considering its poor health care system. Its population of 26 million people are believed to be mostly unvaccinated after their government had shunned millions of shots offered by the U.N.-backed COVAX distribution program, likely over concerns related to international monitoring requirements. North Korea acknowledged its first COVID-19 outbreak last Thursday when it announced that an unspecified number of people in Pyongyang tested positive for the omicron outbreak. It had previously held for more than two years to a widely doubted claim of a perfect record keeping out the virus that has spread to nearly every place in the world.
Kim during a ruling party Politburo meeting on Sunday criticized government and health officials over what he portrayed as a botched pandemic response, saying state medicine supplies aren’t being supplied to pharmacies in time because of their “irresponsible work attitude” and lack of organization, the North’s official Korean Central News Agency said. The Politburo had issued an emergency order to immediately release and quickly distribute state medicine reserves and for pharmacies to switch over to 24-hour shifts, but Kim said such steps weren’t being properly implemented. Kim ordered that the medical units of his military to get involved in stabilizing the supply of medicine in Pyongyang, KCNA said.
State media had previously said a workforce of more than 1.3 million – including public health officials, teachers and medical university students – were mobilized to find people with fevers or other symptoms so that they could be quarantined. North Korea’s claim of a perfect record in keeping out the virus for 2 1/2 years was widely doubted. But its extremely strict border closure, large-scale quarantines and propaganda that stressed anti-virus controls as a matter of “national existence” may have staved off a huge outbreak until now. While North Korea could suffer huge fatalities if it doesn’t quickly receive international shipments of medical supplies, it’s not immediately clear whether the North’s admission of the outbreak communicates a willingness to receive outside help.
Rival South Korea has offered to send vaccines and other supplies, but Seoul officials say the North has not made such a request. But some experts say Kim’s comments last week during another Politburo meeting, where he praised China’s pandemic response and urged his officials to learn from it, suggest that the North could be more willing to accept help from its major ally. Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson Zhao Lijian said last week that Beijing was ready to offer North Korea help but said he had no information about any such request being made.
Even as he called for stronger preventive measures to slow the spread of COVID-19, Kim has also stressed that the country’s economic goals should be met, which likely means huge groups will continue to gather at agricultural, industrial and construction sites. While accelerating his missile tests in a brinkmanship aimed at pressuring the United States for economic and security concessions, Kim has been grappling with domestic challenges at home as pandemic-related difficulties unleashed further shock on an economy broken by decades of mismanagement and crippling U.S.-led sanctions against the North, pushing him to perhaps the toughest moment since he took power in 2011.
Yep. And asbestos is the miracle insulator. And people think Roundup causes cancer. There's lots of fun stuff like that.
Those reasons are kinda dismissive - one could just wear a mask because of a dislike of being sick, and their legitimate protective value. Some people have lives that are amenable to this. (i.e. they don't have activities that extensively put them in public contact, so wearing a mask when they are in public isn't much of a burden.)
That being said, for that, you practically need to wear an N95/N99/P100 mask. I see a ton of people wearing masks that are effectively not useful for disease prevention. I expect the reasons for that are generally, in descending order: ignorance of the relative effectiveness of masks, theatrics, trolling. (I mean really, what reason other than trolling is there to wear a mask that doesn't cover your nose if there's no mask mandate?)
Personally, I have "compliance" masks, that are comfortable linen that I don't expect are particularly effective at filtration, and a 3M half facepiece respirator that I use with P100 filters (and that doesn't filter exhalation) for use in situations where I actually care about my air being filtered.
The Ancient Greeks Knew of the dangers of Asbestos
Thats why they used slaves to mine that stuff as they died like flies
Well, it's not like mining asbestos has stopped even if they don't hand it out for science experiments in middle school like they did with dad.
Want to prevent pandemics? Stop spillovers
What can we do to stop zoonotic (from animals) pandemics in the future?
First, the G20 group of the world’s 20 largest economies provisionally agreed last month to create a global fund for pandemics.
Second, commercial markets and trade of live wild animals that pose a public-health risk must be banned or strictly regulated, both domestically and internationally.
Third, biosecurity must be improved when dealing with farmed animals. Among other measures, this could be achieved through better veterinary care, enhanced surveillance for animal disease, improvements to feeding and housing animals, and quarantines to limit pathogen spread.
Fourth, particularly in hotspots for the emergence of infectious diseases, people’s health and economic security should be improved.
I read your link.
Sadly I fear most of the proposals won't work in practice.
I suspect the best that can be managed is detecting it
earlier and then applying more effective containment.
The problem is that is contrary to the main thrust of the
article which is about containing this bad from globalisation
that is itself globalization by centrally imposing more rules.
THE MAGNITUDE OF THE country’s loss is nearly impossible to grasp.
More Americans have died of Covid-19 than in two decades of car crashes or on battlefields in all of the country’s wars combined. Experts say deaths were all but inevitable from a new virus of such severity and transmissibility. Yet, one million dead is a stunning toll, even for a country the size of the United States, and the true number is almost certainly higher because of undercounting. It is the result of many factors, including elected officials who played down the threat posed by the coronavirus and resisted safety measures; a decentralized, overburdened health care system that struggled with testing, tracing and treatment; and lower vaccination and booster rates than other rich countries, partly the result of widespread mistrust and resistance fanned by right-wing media and politicians.
The virus did not claim lives evenly, or randomly. The New York Times analyzed 25 months of data on deaths during the pandemic and found that some demographic groups, occupations and communities were far more vulnerable than others. A significant proportion of the nation’s oldest residents died, making up about three-quarters of the total deaths. And among younger adults across the nation, Black and Hispanic people died at much higher rates than white people. Understanding the toll — who makes up the one million and how the country failed them — is essential as the pandemic continues. More than 300 people are still dying of Covid every day.
“We are a country with the best doctors in the world, we got a vaccine in an astoundingly short period of time, and yet we’ve had so many deaths,” said Mary T. Bassett, the health commissioner for New York State. “It really should be a moment for us all to reflect on what sort of society we want to have,” she added.
THE FIRST WAVE OF DEATHS was concentrated in the Northeast, especially New York City and its suburbs. No one knew much in those early months. Doctors were not sure how best to treat the disease. Hospitals were overwhelmed. Deaths climbed sharply. New York City was hit harder in March and April 2020 than any other city in the country has been during the pandemic. At the height of this outbreak, a New Yorker was dying of Covid almost every two minutes — nearly 800 people per day, a rate five times as high as the city’s normal pace of death.
Among them was Dr. Jay Galst, 69, an otherwise healthy ophthalmologist in Manhattan, who most likely contracted Covid from a patient. His widow, Joann Galst, blamed President Donald J. Trump, who sought to quell concern about the virus in early March, asserting that it would go away with rising temperatures. She also blamed federal health officials, who declined to recommend masks for the public in those earliest days.
“Does it give me consolation that he was doing the work that he loved?” Dr. Galst asked of her husband’s death. “That he was following preventive measures that we both thought was the best he could have done at the time? Not really, since I now know, had we been honestly informed of the immense danger we were all facing in New York City, we could have and would have done more.”
The article is longer and excellent with very cool graphics to go with it.
yes but what about the masks
They are in her emails. Catch on, man!
I haven't been on in a while.
My Mum caught COVID-19 last week after I helped her with a RAT and she tested positive. Somehow, after 5 negative RATs, I have not caught COVID-19 from my Mum.
Looking at Worldometer stats, I am starting to see the end of COVID-19. Case numbers are back to where they were before Omicron and the daily death rate is the lowest it has been since March 2020.
Best Korea, always looking to beat USA!
North Korea on brink of Covid-19 catastrophe, say experts
Number to have fallen ill reportedly at almost 1.5 million as country grapples with what it calls ‘fever’
North Korea stands on the brink of a Covid-19 catastrophe unless swift action is taken to provide vaccines and drug treatments, experts have said, as the number of people reported to have fallen ill rose to almost 1.5 million.
The isolated country reported another big rise in new cases of what it continues to refer to as “fever” on Tuesday, days after it admitted it had identified Covid-19 infections for the first time since the start of the global pandemic.
It recorded 269,510 additional cases and six more deaths, bringing the total number killed to 56 since late last month. About 1.48 million people have become ill with the virus since the first case was reported last Thursday and at least 663,910 people were in quarantine, according to official figures. The outbreak is almost certainly greater than the official tally, given a lack of tests and resources to monitor and treat the sick.
A significant Covid-19 outbreak could unleash a humanitarian crisis in North Korea, where the economy has been battered by the pandemic-enforced closure of its border with China – its main trading partner – natural disasters, and years of international sanctions imposed in response to ballistic missile tests.
The regime is not thought to have vaccinated any of its population and does not have access to antiviral drugs that have been used to treat Covid-19 in other countries. Its hospitals have few intensive-care resources to treat severe cases, and widespread malnourishment has made the population of 26 million more susceptible to serious illness.
“It looks really bad,” said Owen Miller, a lecturer in Korean studies at the School of Oriental and African Studies, London University. “They are facing the rampant spread of Omicron without protection from vaccines, without much – if any – immunity in the population and without access to most of the drugs that have been used to treat Covid elsewhere.”
Offers of outside help have so far been met with silence. Instead, there is concern that the country’s leader, Kim Jong-un, may be willing to accept a large but “manageable” number of cases and deaths to avoid opening his country up to international scrutiny.
Since it reported its first cases last week, North Korea’s propaganda machine has portrayed the virus as an enemy that can be defeated through lockdowns, quarantine and greater vigilance. The state-run KCNA news agency has reported the delivery of unspecified drugs – “the elixir of life” – to pharmacies by army medical units, and public health campaigns calling for mask-wearing and social distancing.
But testing levels are far below what is needed to form an accurate picture of the outbreak and to quickly identify and isolate patients. Some observers speculated that authorities were deliberately underreporting cases to ease the pressure on Kim.
North Korea has tested just 64,200 people since the start of the pandemic’s start, according to the World Health Organization, compared with 172 million in the neighbouring South.
“We were talking about a 0.1% fatality rate for Omicron in South Korea, but that’s going to be significantly higher in North Korea, possibly even reaching 1%, although it’s difficult to make accurate predictions at this point,” said Jung Jae-hun, a professor of preventive medicine at Gachon University.
Kim, who says the outbreak is causing “great turmoil”, finds himself having to balance public health measures with efforts to revive the crumbling economy.
A ruling party member in North Hamgyong province said people were still going to work and markets remained open, reported the Japan-based Asia Press. “There are no bans on going outside. However, we’ve been ordered to double mask,” the unidentified official told the website, which receives information from citizen journalists equipped with contraband Chinese mobile phones.
“People are going to factories and to their places of work as normal. The authorities don’t want work to be disrupted. People get fever checks when they go to and from work.” The official said people were more concerned about being locked down and prevented from working than catching Covid-19. “People are worried about how to survive.”
Some initially interpreted North Korea’s admission that it was battling the virus – after two years of denying it had found a single case – as a plea for help. But it has already refused millions of vaccine doses via the UN-backed Covax scheme, while South Korea says it has yet to receive a response to its offer this week of vaccines, drugs and medical staff.
“I’m sure the North Koreans will still be very wary of accepting major international aid and going back to the situation of the 1990s, when there were multiple different aid agencies operating in the country and this was felt by the leadership to be humiliating and potentially destabilising,” Miller said, adding that the regime was more likely to turn to China for medical aid.
The Omicron variant has caused significantly fewer deaths and serious cases than previous strains in countries with high vaccination rates, proper medical services and previous exposure to Covid-19.
But that pattern is unlikely to be repeated in North Korea, said Kim Sin-gon, a professor at Korea University College of Medicine in Seoul. “North Korea has many vulnerable people who don’t have strong immune systems,” he said. “Its official inoculation rate is zero and it has no Covid-19 treatment pills.”
Without urgent international help, Kim added, “North Korea may end up with the pandemic’s worst death and infection rates in the world for its population size.”
@Takhisis I saw this in the Japanese news yesterday:
A few parts:
The Rodong Sinmun (state newspaper) on the 17th said that General Secretary Kim Jong-un ordered on the 16th the Korean People’s Army to Pyongyang in order to stabilize the supply of medical equipment to the city.
Following the 16th, state television began broadcasting early from 9am on the 17th, “using the media to educate on the omicron variant” and to call for the populace to take precaution.
(South) Korean media reports the 17th that multiple North Korean planes have landed in Shenyang, China, appearing to load up medical supplies for the country.
I'm pretty sure NK won't even make an effort to count the dead. Kim is lucky it is omicron and not delta or original flavor.
At the risk of sounding callous it will be an interesting test case to see if Coronavirus Fast-Acting will really be less dangerous than Coronavirus Classic or Coronavirus Plus.
And also in a non-immunized population.
Would be better if there could be more accurate data than satellite images of graves though :/.
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