Cowboy and Vaquero units instead of Light Dragoon

[plasmacannon]

In my current game, I am playing America in version 3.3.

The Light Dragoon is listed as a Range mounted unit, yet the picture in the Civilopedia shows it as a sword using mounted unit. So, I am guessing this is an error and would be corrected eventually.

Might I suggest that since this unit is upgraded from the "New World Pistolier" and upgraded to the "Reconnaissance Car", that the American & Texan versions have their names changed to "Cowboy" or American Cowboy" and their picture changed to carrying two revolvers and wearing a cowboy hat.

It would be an authentically American style of unit.
It would be a fun unit to have and appeal to pre-automobile American culture.

The Aztec and Mayan version would be called Vaquero and be similarly designed but with a larger rimmed hat.

 

[Walter Hawkwood]

Hey! Thanks for feedback. Let me try to clarify a bit.

Firstly, regarding the Light Dragoons. Indeed, they and about a half of other hussar-class units have sabers and melee attack animations. We thought that at this point in the tech tree, it is safe to assume that all hussar-class units are armed with either pistols or a carabin in addition to their sabers, so we can use either animation to show their attack. I could probably go about hussars adding those (and their respective animations), but I feel that it would take a lot of effort for what is ultimately a cosmetic change (though I may still ensure they have at least ranged weapons slung to their saddles at some point in future).

Secondly, regarding your suggestion. You are right that American civ is tricky to work with. Since we can only talk of independent USA for the last ~250 years, actual American units would only get us so far. But you should keep in mind that:

1) The iconic revolver-wielding cowboy is a product of XIX century, which is way too late for pistolier unit class (that mostly represents XVII century light cavalry). So doing this would simply be historically inaccurate.

2) Cowboys are cattle herders, not military. The popular image of a gunslinging cowboy is very much an exaggeration produced by Western movies. They were never employed as a regular fighting force - and when enlisted into military, they'd of course wear the military colors, not denim and cowboy hats.

I am not even sure if we'd be able to find an accurate depiction of a pistolier for USA, but if we did, that would be something firmly pre-independence, maybe a century or so earlier.

And the light dragoons we use currently are, for a change, historically accurate - so they don't really need to get replaced. They are actual historical US military units.

 

[plasmacannon]

Thanks for the quick response.

Yes. I realize they would be earlier than when they would have actually occurred.
It is around the time that the U.S. Cavalry is still in use. So, not too far off.
At the moment, we have what looks like European Light Hussars working with U.S. Cavalry around the Civil War period? That seems strange and inaccurate. I've never seen hats like that before on American military photos.

With the Reconnaissance Car as the upgrade, a Cowboy unit would idealistically appear after the Light Hussar and before the Reconnaissance Car.
However, I didn't expect a new unit to be inserted just for the American Civ.
That's why I was suggesting changing the Light Hussar image, as it looks nothing like what an American, Texan, Aztec or Mayan Civ would actually use.

I was trying to simplify things and just group them up into 2 groups.
American and Texan are close enough that using the same unit makes sense.

Aztec and Mayan could have either feathers on it's Light Hussar/Vaquero unit or a sombrero on it. Depending on whether you wanted a more Aztec or Central American flavor to the unit.
Since, Vaqueros were around in Mexico as early as 1687, before America existed, they should be around the right time period.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaquero

Yes, they were both ranchers and not primary military. The Union Cavalry would still be the primary mounted unit most would build. Seeing the other in would be for variety.

You are right, Cowboys are primarily a book, television western and spaghetti western style creation. They have become such an iconic mounted pistol using unit, that it seems difficult to imagine an American Civ without it. Just not a UU, as they were never that common everywhere.

The Reconnaissance Car pictured isn't something I recognize either.
I believe the info on it said it was originally a Russian vehicle at the time. I forget the year of it's use, but such a Cowboy unit could replace it instead if the year is closer to accurate.

Another option could be that Ranches provide a small terrain defense bonus.
Right now, they only earn +1 commerce after the Stock Exchange tech has been researched.
Which doesn't seem like much, compared to other Civ's Unique Improvements.

I love the Continental Army Fusiliers, Union Riflemen and Union Cavalry names. Those are historical correct and definitely give the immersive effect.

I hope these suggestions are in the right place. I wasn't sure if it was best top post here or the download thread. Here seemed to make more sense.

 

[Walter Hawkwood]

Despite them being not so well-known, US Light Dragoons are actually an accurate unit for the era. They kept their uniforms throughout most of XIX century, despite it looking outdated by comparison with other units of US army. But interestingly, that can be said about light cavalry and dragoons from most European countries too - their hussars mostly kept their Napoleonic-era uniforms for a very long time. For example, French dragoons were fighting in Franco-Prussian war in basically the same uniforms as they wore during the times of Napoleon.

Here's a picture of one dragoon regiment around the time of American Civil War:

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/04/b2/8c/04b28c065d9d6c67a72dd3f7769ff1a2.jpg

As you can see, they pretty much kept with Napoleonic uniform styles.

Oh, and Texan spawnable civ already uses the Rangers as a unit, because unlike cowboys, those guys were in government service and fighting was basically their main purpose.

 

[plasmacannon]

I found a photo of the Cowboy. They were first called Florida Crackers. Then Florida Cowmen. Then Cowboy.
"The first of these arrived in 1763 after Spain traded Florida to Great Britain following the latter's victory over France in the Seven Years' War."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_cracker
So, they have been around quite a while.

Rangers really? That sounds interesting.

By the way, I rarely see the spawnable non-player races in the game. Is there a way to increase their likelihood?

I was thinking it might be the 'take over AI option' in the game setup that might be blocking them from appearing. Is that right or is there something else I have to do?

My resent game is over a LAN, Huge map, has 6 continents, 3 Civs on each, with myself and a friend on different continents. Whoever wipes out more Civs wins.

I never see Israel, Babylonians, Dutch or any of the Indian tribes for example.

 

[plasmacannon]

Perhaps, "Outlaw" should be the term. I found a lot of them in appearing in the 1800s.
http://www.legendsofamerica.com/we-outlawindex.html
There are several sites dedicated to that western history.
Gunslinger would work too.
I admit I am not overly knowledgeable of the subject.
The idea of someone riding a horse and wielding a pistol isn't new in American History and isn't solely a dime novel, television, or movie phenomenon.

Sure some were not regular military units, or were light cavalry. "New World Pistolier" doesn't sound like a military unit either, but it's included.
I find a pistol using unit more plausible than a sword using one for America, even if some military personnel actually did carry a sword. The Marines today can get a sword. It would be rare if they ever used it though.

I did find the armored cars of WW1. Wow, did most of those look bad. The WW2 ones looked a lot better.
Yea, can't replace those.