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[R&F] Cree First Look

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by bite, Jan 2, 2018.

  1. isau

    isau Warlord

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    I think the UU will likely be pretty weak. Not telling for sure of course until we can play it, but just looking at it, it's one that I'll be looking into modding straight away (note that in my combined tweaks mods Scouts already get a free promotion, so at a minimum I'll be adding something else to the special Cree scout).

    The main issue though is that the upgrade path is just not there for Scouts, and in nearly any situation I can think of you'd be far better off spamming a unit that can upgrade to something stronger.

    What I think would have been much more interesting would have been if this unit was instead not a combat unit at all but some kind of Support that could boost regular Scouts or other units. That's probably the direction my modding will head in.
     
  2. SammyKhalifa

    SammyKhalifa Warlord

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    Do you place any value on being able to find "all the stuff" before other civs do?
     
  3. Sagax

    Sagax Chieftain

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    In 9 games out of 10, I would aggressively expand and conquer in the early game, only to discover that my lands don’t have a single source of Iron. Hell yeah will I use and promote those Warrior Scouts!
     
  4. SammyKhalifa

    SammyKhalifa Warlord

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    It just seems like dismissing them because they won't be a killer front-line attack unit might be missing the point.
     
    Quintus of Mund and ombak like this.
  5. nzcamel

    nzcamel Nahtanoj the Magnificent

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    I don't think that's what Sagax meant...
     
  6. SammyKhalifa

    SammyKhalifa Warlord

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    yeah, I didn't mean tomake it sound like that, was more agreeing with him
     
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  7. nzcamel

    nzcamel Nahtanoj the Magnificent

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    I think it will be one of the best units in the game. The number of times your scout finds islands with barbs and goody huts on it is often. Sometimes the scout can get in and out; but often the likelihood of him being overwhelmed and killed by barbs is high... if there's any interior to the island. These guys will likely handle that scenario far better.
     
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  8. God of Kings

    God of Kings Ruler of all heads of state

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    It would have been interesting if the Cree could gift their scout units to Sumeria.
     
  9. Yokel

    Yokel Chieftain

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    Two words: Era Score.

    From what I've seen of the Era Score system, Scouts, and especially the UU version that can handle more damage, are going to give you a lot of points in the early eras, with discovered natural wonders, new cultures, and probably bonuses to tech, production, and pantheon from goodie hut boosts.
     
  10. Kimiimaro

    Kimiimaro King

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    I don't know if you heard it in your games, but Kongolese soundtrack has one really nice piece that includes singing. It's called Mama Munu Dile, and don't worry, it isn't as superjolly as Brejeiro or Banaha, but it still can make one happy :p

    Sorry for getting off-topic :mischief:
     
  11. blackbutterfly

    blackbutterfly Chieftain

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    Yeah you could use scouts to garrison, but you should be using them for exploration, getting goodie huts, possibly taking out barb scouts if they're strong enough and to squat/fog bust. If you fortify a good spot to settle the AI won't go there usually.

    Garrison cities with old military units. Ones that you can't afford to upgrade and those you wanna keep for corps & armies. Or for sentimental reasons.
    But after that policy expires, you wanna upgrade those units. In your case you'll have a bunch of scouts with no purpose in life :rolleyes:

    In particular for The Cree, their recon units could most certainly take out barbs and capture settlers. Really in the early game, you wanna avoid having too many occupied cities, if you wanna play a strategy that lends itself to better mid-late game diplomacy (and alliances).
     
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  12. KayAU

    KayAU Chieftain

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    I think the UU is going to be excellent. There has been a lot of talk about its viability as a front line fighter, but this is just one of the possible uses, and not really the primary one. The key here is versatility. Although I am repeating myself a bit (this is a long thread), these are the 3 primary roles I see the Cree Scout being able to fulfill:
    1. Scouting. The initial promotion is going to let this unit get around the map much more quickly than a regular scout, and the higher (double!) combat strength is going to do a lot for its survivability. Judging it for its primary role, scouting, it is a huge improvement over the regular scout.
    2. Mobile defender/Barbarian exterminator. This unit is as strong as a Warrior, but can get around much faster. It will be able to get to where it needs to be, and it is strong enough to finish the job. The Discipline policy card or Oligarchy will help it further in this role.
    3. Front line fighter. Yes, it can do this too. Sure, there is a big gap in the upgrade path before it becomes a Ranger, but if you can manage to get it to the Ambush promotion, it can be a strong player at the front line for at least the first 2 or 3 eras. Getting it there is more viable than you might think, because: A) It gets the first promotion for free. B) It is a faster scout, which will get XP for scouting. C) It is able to do more combat than the regular scout. D) There is a policy card (Survey) which can double its XP gain. E) It is going to be around early, giving it time to gain XP. F) You could try to go for the Terracotta Army wonder.
    This is a very exciting unit. It may not be the strongest UU, but it is probably the most versatile. It is great at its primary role, and potentially very good at the other two.
     
  13. Lily_Lancer

    Lily_Lancer Chieftain

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    Only the name "scout" suggests us to use them for exploration, but the unit itself is designed to be cheap garrison.

    I think it's a crazy and ridiculous idea to use scouts for exploration in Civ6. The use of units shall be based on their game property instead of their names.

    Also, since the player always have dozens of cities, I don't think there's enough obsoleted units for your to make garrison.
     
  14. ArcadeBears

    ArcadeBears Chieftain

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    Nah nah, identity is a form of loyalty.
     
  15. Eagle Pursuit

    Eagle Pursuit Scir-Gerefa

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    A dev posted here to tell us that "identity" was an obsolete name for loyalty.
     
  16. nzcamel

    nzcamel Nahtanoj the Magnificent

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    Well, that is one use. But I think most of us see the skills of scouts as mostly lending to...scouting. i.e. exploring, and fog busting.
    Unless you're running the garrison = amenity policy, I don't see having a unit in each city as a priority.
     
  17. blackbutterfly

    blackbutterfly Chieftain

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    Yeah, the early warmonger can't be beat: Alexander, Gilgamesh, Cyrus, etc.

    But sometimes you wanna play differently cos it gets boring. And on some maps, early rush is hard to pull off. Especially as Firaxis have made civs spawn further apart since the Fall '17 patch and even further in R&F.

    In particular on Scrambled North America


    Even though since then I've refined the map and it's much flatter now, though still densely wooded mostly, rushing is difficult. On this map you need the trade route/road to mobilise an army to your neighbours. So unsurprisingly The Cree are going to play very well on this map :D
     
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  18. DeutschDachs

    DeutschDachs Chieftain

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    Any indication to whether the Cree might start with one of their UUs rather than a Warrior?
     
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  19. Sagax

    Sagax Chieftain

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    You.....haven’t fully read my comment?:)
     
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  20. AvianBritish

    AvianBritish Chieftain

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    I don't think there have been any indications; but it would be interesting to see how that plays into the Era Points system because you get bonus era points for building your unique unit. So if you do get it at the start of the game (along with the Aztec's Eagle Warriors), you won't get the era points until you build one after the free one provided? Either way, in the first look the player got era points from build "a" unique scout.
     
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