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Crosses

Discussion in 'Civ4Col - Age of Discovery II' started by PrinzMyshkin, Mar 29, 2009.

  1. PrinzMyshkin

    PrinzMyshkin Chieftain

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2009
    Messages:
    285
    Location:
    Antarctica
    Crosses are overpowered during the early game, and underpowered in the end game.

    Yes, theocracy or separation seem cool, but do they really help? Maybe in the last 5 turns... but does this justify their purpose?

    I think, no.

    In the end game, it is better to turn FBs into FCs, because they consume the food enough to spam plenty FCs, only to bring a single one at the European docks...

    I think they should be given some additional bonus. I propose to generate gold to reflect the donations of the pious peasants to church.

    The gold should be in relation to the cost of a FC, the food they consume and in the timeframe this food would generate a colonist.

    So this is:

    300 food / 2 food (FB consumes 2 food per turn) = 150 turns (Every 150 turns an FC)

    1100 gold (cost to buy a FC) / 150 turns = 7.33 gold per turn.

    Let us say 8 gold per FB per turn in a church, and 12 gold per FB in a cathedral.

    This would give FBs a purpose during the endgame, and better justify their role.

    Thanks
     
  2. PrinzMyshkin

    PrinzMyshkin Chieftain

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2009
    Messages:
    285
    Location:
    Antarctica
    Which is the limit for preachers they have no point to preach any more? Depends on how pious the colonists are... (^^,)

    But if you like the math approach, check below...

    Spoiler :


    The following tables apply to all nations. For England the crosses requirements are 25% smaller, but the crosses limit will be the same.

    How to use?

    Sum up the (%) bonuses and calculate the crosses per specialist, or non-specialist. If the crosses per turn are less than the cross limit shown below, it doesn't worth it. Take the preacher out of the colony and a FC will spawn faster. (^^,)

    To help you, you are looking for Thomas Hooker +50% bonus, Lord Baltimore tax rate bonus and RS work bonus of the colony. Hence the bonus can be anything between 0% and 199%.

    Fixed bonuses are irrelevant (eg. +1 cross per townhall), as they count anyway on their own.

    Food for Colonist to Spawn: 300
    Food Colonist Eats 2
    No. of turns FC spawns 150

    RS bonus =0-50%
    Thomas Hooker: +50% crosses
    Lord Baltimore: +0-99% tax rate bonus

    Table of Crosses Produced per non-specialist

    Bonus Chapel Chruch Large Church Cathedral
    2 3 6 9
    0% 2 3 6 9
    10% 2.2 3.3 6.6 9.9
    20% 2.4 3.6 7.2 10.8
    30% 2.6 3.9 7.8 11.7
    40% 2.8 4.2 8.4 12.6
    50% 3 4.5 9 13.5
    60% 3.2 4.8 9.6 14.4
    70% 3.4 5.1 10.2 15.3
    80% 3.6 5.4 10.8 16.2
    90% 3.8 5.7 11.4 17.1
    100% 4 6 12 18
    110% 4.2 6.3 12.6 18.9
    120% 4.4 6.6 13.2 19.8
    130% 4.6 6.9 13.8 20.7
    140% 4.8 7.2 14.4 21.6
    150% 5 7.5 15 22.5
    160% 5.2 7.8 15.6 23.4
    170% 5.4 8.1 16.2 24.3
    180% 5.6 8.4 16.8 25.2
    190% 5.8 8.7 17.4 26.1
    199% 5.98 8.97 17.94 26.91

    Table of Limit Crosses per non-specialist

    Bonus Chapel Chruch Large Church Cathedral
    0% 300 450 900 1350
    10% 330 495 990 1485
    20% 360 540 1080 1620
    30% 390 585 1170 1755
    40% 420 630 1260 1890
    50% 450 675 1350 2025
    60% 480 720 1440 2160
    70% 510 765 1530 2295
    80% 540 810 1620 2430
    90% 570 855 1710 2565
    100% 600 900 1800 2700
    110% 630 945 1890 2835
    120% 660 990 1980 2970
    130% 690 1035 2070 3105
    140% 720 1080 2160 3240
    150% 750 1125 2250 3375
    160% 780 1170 2340 3510
    170% 810 1215 2430 3645
    180% 840 1260 2520 3780
    190% 870 1305 2610 3915
    199% 897 1345.5 2691 4036.5


    Table of Crosses Produced per specialist

    Chapel Chruch Large Church Cathedral
    4 6 12 18
    0% 4 6 12 18
    10% 4.4 6.6 13.2 19.8
    20% 4.8 7.2 14.4 21.6
    30% 5.2 7.8 15.6 23.4
    40% 5.6 8.4 16.8 25.2
    50% 6 9 18 27
    60% 6.4 9.6 19.2 28.8
    70% 6.8 10.2 20.4 30.6
    80% 7.2 10.8 21.6 32.4
    90% 7.6 11.4 22.8 34.2
    100% 8 12 24 36
    110% 8.4 12.6 25.2 37.8
    120% 8.8 13.2 26.4 39.6
    130% 9.2 13.8 27.6 41.4
    140% 9.6 14.4 28.8 43.2
    150% 10 15 30 45
    160% 10.4 15.6 31.2 46.8
    170% 10.8 16.2 32.4 48.6
    180% 11.2 16.8 33.6 50.4
    190% 11.6 17.4 34.8 52.2
    199% 11.96 17.94 35.88 53.82

    Table of Limit Crosses per specialist

    Bonus Chapel Chruch Large Church Cathedral
    0% 600 900 1800 2700
    10% 660 990 1980 2970
    20% 720 1080 2160 3240
    30% 780 1170 2340 3510
    40% 840 1260 2520 3780
    50% 900 1350 2700 4050
    60% 960 1440 2880 4320
    70% 1020 1530 3060 4590
    80% 1080 1620 3240 4860
    90% 1140 1710 3420 5130
    100% 1200 1800 3600 5400
    110% 1260 1890 3780 5670
    120% 1320 1980 3960 5940
    130% 1380 2070 4140 6210
    140% 1440 2160 4320 6480
    150% 1500 2250 4500 6750
    160% 1560 2340 4680 7020
    170% 1620 2430 4860 7290
    180% 1680 2520 5040 7560
    190% 1740 2610 5220 7830
    199% 1794 2691 5382 8073



    Don't know about you, but I was always hitting this limit in my games.
     
  3. Dale

    Dale Chieftain

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2002
    Messages:
    6,986
    Noted .
     
  4. PrinzMyshkin

    PrinzMyshkin Chieftain

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2009
    Messages:
    285
    Location:
    Antarctica
    Note that if you are below the limit for both expert and non-expert preachers, you can have as many as you like, in as many churches as you like. This table just tells you if it's worth the effort, or not. If it's worth it for one, it's worth it for as many as you can!

    The moment you hit the limit for non-experts, there is no point for having a non-expert preacher.

    The moment you hit the limit experts, there is no point for having an expert preacher....

    An advice, as in most games the bonus you will have varies from 50% to 150%, it seems it does't worth it to heavily invest on preachers. Just live on what comes at the docks, or maybe buy one at the early game. :)
     

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