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Crowds, cottages and farms. Advice for a new guy.

Discussion in 'Civ4 - General Discussions' started by infernon, Nov 9, 2005.

  1. infernon

    infernon Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2005
    Messages:
    5
    I'm curious as to know when it is time to build cottages or when enough farms have been built. I understand that the cottages generated commerce which in turn provides wealth, but I'm not sure how this plays up against making sure that you have enough farms available and when exactly enough is enough. Is this something that you should be determining via the city screen (what each tile yields)?
    Also, my main city at the moment (I'm playing on warlord, not doing very badly, but a bit cornered in by the Romans and Indians) is filled to the brim with angry citizens who cite crowdedness as the source of their aggravation. What can be done to reduce crowds other than building "happy" improvements to offset the angries?
     
  2. Yuri2356

    Yuri2356 Test Screening

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2004
    Messages:
    3,415
    Location:
    Great White North
    "Overcrowding" is just the natural unhappiness caused by population growth. Now way arround it except building :) things. (Temples, theatres, ect) One thing that helps is getting a city with multiple religions, so you can build each one's respective holy buildings.
     
  3. Mewtarthio

    Mewtarthio Emperor

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2004
    Messages:
    1,930
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't the Holy Buildings only improve happinness if you have their respective faiths as your state religion? Granted, you still want them for the +50% culture, but you only get one +2 :) per city.
     
  4. WuphonsReach

    WuphonsReach Prince

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2005
    Messages:
    426
    For every religion that is spread to your city, you can build a temple (which gives +1 happy). Plus, you can build the monestaries for +culture points and the ability to spread more missionaries.

    Personally, I play as agnostic (no state religion, ever) and push for Freedom of Religion in late game. If I've paid enough attention to religions in my cities, most of my cities will have 3+ religions in them and get a big boost from Freedom of Religion.

    I plan on focusing a bit more on religion in my next game, this last game was the first one where I actually built and spread missionaries.
     
  5. infernon

    infernon Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2005
    Messages:
    5
    Thanks for the help on the second part of the question. How about the first part about building farms and cottages? Do cottages help to offset the unhappy count for those that complain about being overcrowded?
     
  6. Yoshua

    Yoshua Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2005
    Messages:
    44
    Cottages improve the commerce value of a tile, nothing more. Farms improve the food value a tile produces and nothing more. Though if you have tiles available to be worked, and citizens who are available but not working those tiles, you can make them happy by putting them to work on those tiles.

    I don't know why it happens or what causes it. But I have had games where I will notice a city is unhappy, and when I check the city screen I have a bunch of peasant specialists I didn't assign as specialists. If I put them to work on tiles, it usually makes them happy and things go back to normal. Normally the game assigns peasants to jobs automaticlly according to your preferances or whatever the default behavior is (think if you don't choose a preferance, it just tries for the best balance). Why I just get idle citizens now and again I don't know (well not idle, but specializing peasants for production is a waste most of the time, working production tiles is much, much better).
     
  7. Good Omens

    Good Omens Warlord

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2005
    Messages:
    120
    Location:
    Witch City, USA
    I'm working on getting into the habit of controlling city size by moderating food production, both through selecting which tiles to work and also by making specialists. When I see a city that is about to grow which will end up in unhappiness, I generally make changes in that city to prevent the growth until I can improve the happiness situation (build a temple or whatever). Better to change a citizen into a specialist, so that he's accomplishing something.
     
  8. weasel77066

    weasel77066 Prince

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2005
    Messages:
    488
    Location:
    houston tx
    The book says that any excess population will automatically go into the citizen specialist (a kind of slush pool) If the city is working all necessary tiles and has extra POP, it will defaullt them into that category. If you make a specialist later on, it will come from the citizen group first, before it comes from "labor" POP.
    Also you can use this to control your growth. If you cant make any more specialists, or if the city is low on porduction, you can make citizens which will give you +1 production (and gobble up that extra food)
    You can also replace farms with workshops, which will lower your food intake and add a shield. Play with each city to balance out production with growth. Ideally you would want production OVER food... With gold as the staple.
    A city is no real use if population 27 and only 2production a turn. Production has no real advantage if your science (gold) is low.
     
  9. Grunthex

    Grunthex Prince

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2001
    Messages:
    366
    Location:
    Calgary, Canada
    Early in the game, a well developed cottage (village or town) is better. It's gonna give you 3 or 4 bonus commerce, as opposed to 1 food. (This presumes I don't need that extra one food to work a hill tile, or something).

    After Biology, everything changes. 2 bonus food from a farm means I can support a specialist. A specialist is worth more than a town, even with the civics that boost them. Especially if I have Representation, a scientist is worth 6 science and 3 culture (I think, might be 3 gold instead). That's 9 commerce. A fully developed town is only going to give me 7, and a production even with civics.
     
  10. atc_chief

    atc_chief Warlord

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2005
    Messages:
    105
    Location:
    CT
    ...Luxury Resources! Thinks like gems, furs, dyes, etc all provide :) to cities tied to your trade network.

    You'll probably need a combination of all these items, but a single luxury resource will provide happiness to ALL cities in the trade network. This is a very powerful, quick, and inexpensive tool.
     
  11. BeefontheBone

    BeefontheBone Windbag of the sea

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2005
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    2,018
    If you're short on luxuries, trade with other players for them. If it's just one city you're having trouble with, bung in the Globe Theatre (I'm going to spell it properly, even if the game doesn't).
     
  12. rkyte

    rkyte Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2004
    Messages:
    72
    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    If your cities are getting too large, either redo your tiles/specialists manually or use the city advisor to stop growth. One of those buttons in the lower right of the city screen does this.

    The other option is to use the slavery civic and rush something. This uses up population.
     
  13. Multiplicity

    Multiplicity Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2005
    Messages:
    60
    What I usually do it check and see which tiles can generate surplus food and tiles which do not. Like for a hills/plains tile, it doesn't generate food, so I try to make up for it by farming a food plains tile. In effect, the farmed food plains tile will generate enough food to support the worker on the hills/plains tile and the worker working the farmed food plains tile. I hope this example is clear for you.
     
  14. Ravinhood

    Ravinhood Warlord

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2005
    Messages:
    180
    The key to success and building a large city of success is "zoning" your city when you first get it. Analyze what size it can grow to or you want it to grow to vs the amount of production and commerce you want it to generate also.

    1) A city cannot grow without excess food (farms)

    2) Commerce cannot increase without commercial property. (cottages and land near rivers/water) or special people and heroic people.

    3) Production cannot grow without industrial property (mines).

    4) Trade cannot be present without goods of trade and (plantations).

    5) Health is a direct product of several things, forest and rivers being very important along with trade goods.

    6) Happiness is a direct product of several things as well, buildings that produce happiness, balancing population limits, culture, trade goods that produce happiness, civics, peaceful times, military occupation/police.

    7) Science is a direct product of some buildings, special people, heroic people, commerce and trade.

    So, if you really want to get the most out of your city. You should "zone" it. Spend some time using a graph piece of paper and chart/zone out every square into what it should look like and be cultivated into for maximum growth, production and commerce. ;) (Heh, I wonder how many people actually do this or just play willy nilly until they realize it can't grow anymore or produce anymore and becomes stagnant?)
     

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