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Dawn Of The OverLords

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Modpacks' started by keldath, Aug 7, 2007.

  1. keldath

    keldath LivE LonG AnD PrOsPeR

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    not sure thats bad or good :)

    oh my,
    deadly indeed.

    ill post a new dll tomorrow,
    the collateral dmg you spoke of and some more should be better.
    plus some more tweaks.
     
  2. LeBashar

    LeBashar Warlord

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    I don't succes do adjust damage correctly. I don't inderstand how it's work exactly, I'm afraid I need the human traduction of the source code.

    I have try to give a 100% bonus combat mod against siege unit to a destroyer, and it nearly do nothing to the damage the catapult done. :?

    ps : what I want is the ranged strike do good damage to units of the same era, very good damage against unit which are vulnerable against siege unit (if we use the combat mod tag), and bad damage against more advanced units. A catapult of 5 power should do nearly nothing to a 30 power destroyer (event if we don't boost it against olders units).
     
  3. keldath

    keldath LivE LonG AnD PrOsPeR

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    hi,

    i updated the dll , some new fixes from advc .
    also some changed to ranged:
    changed the odds calc for ranged attack...i hope for the best.
    did some tweaks to collateral damage.
    ranged units can after attack will end movement + cannot attack again.
    game option to allow sea units to use one of the two attacks, remain.

    ((GC.getDefineINT("RANGE_COMBAT_DAMAGE") * (iOurStrength + iStrengthFactor)) / (iTheirStrength + iStrengthFactor))
    its the RANGE_COMBAT_DAMAGE % multiple by the % of the power rate between the enemy to attacking unit
    affected by city strength => std::max(0, (pPlot->getPlotCity()->getBuildingDefense() + 100)); the higher - the lower the damage output
    divided by
    (50 + GC.getGame().getSorenRandNum(100, "RandomHit"));
    which is a random hit factor.

    thats how i understand it...anyways.

    we can do trade off - increase the RANGE_COMBAT_DAMAGE to be always 100%, but make the random hit chance higher - less chance of a hit.

    you set this
    <iCombatLimit>50</iCombatLimit>
    to 100 right?

    maybe we can use these:
    <UnitClassTargets/>
    <UnitCombatTargets/>
    <UnitClassDefenders/>
    <UnitCombatDefenders/>


    well - think its not hard:
    use this:
    <UnitClassAttackMods/> --> set damage bonus vs specific class units
    <UnitClassDefenseMods/> --> defense.
    <UnitCombatMods/> ---> vs unit combat

    we can use negative values.

    also i can add these 2 tags:
    https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/modcomp-unit-combat-attack-defense-mod.378607/#post-9578190

    we can change unitcombat settings - lets say unitcombat_siege_early unitcombat_siege_late - and adjust values accordinally vs these,
    like early will have negative bonus vs late or vice versa.

    what do you think we should do?
     
  4. LeBashar

    LeBashar Warlord

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    I've done some tests with advciv (where the range strike do always the same damage, never miss, far more easiest to testing)

    catapult Vs destroyer in mod Advciv, without bonus malus, RANGE_COMBAT_DAMAGE = 40, power 5 (aircombat) Vs 30 : always 18% damages
    -> against catapult = 40% / tank power 28 = 19% / tank power 40 = 17%

    catapult Vs destroyer in mod Advciv, without bonus malus, RANGE_COMBAT_DAMAGE = 40, power 4 (aircombat) Vs 30 : always 17% damages
    -> against catapult = 37% / tank power 28 = 17% / tank power 40 = 16%

    catapult Vs destroyer in mod Advciv, without bonus malus, RANGE_COMBAT_DAMAGE = 40, power only 1 (aircombat) Vs 30 : always 14% damages
    -> against catapult = 20% / tank power 28 = 14% / tank power 40 = 14%

    catapult Vs destroyer in mod Advciv, 500% bonus VS siege for the destroyer, RANGE_COMBAT_DAMAGE = 40, power 5 (aircombat) Vs 30 : always 14% damages !...

    So, it is useless to try to adjust this with units bonus, because the formula make the damage always far more heavy than a 1 power ground unit will do against a 30 power ground unit.
    We need to compare the ground combat formula to the range combat formula to see how make the second more close to the first. Without that the work is impossible, we can adjust nothing.

    what is iOurStrength ? iStrengthFactor ? iTheirStrength ? how is all of this be calculated exactly ? I understand the words but I need to do the maths for see what it really does, and decide if it is acceptable or not (for now, it is obviously not, there is some caped damage which are far too high for the minimum damage)
    the RANGE_COMBAT_DAMAGE affect far more the result that the real power of the units, it's not good because the range_combat_damage is a unique variable which affect all ranged strike. It could be ok if there is, like in the vanilla's, only 2 units who do ranged strike, and they have close power, but it will not work with ranged strike goes to catapult to battleships.

    ps : interesting the news tag for combat bonus, but usless for ranged strike with the current formula.
     
  5. keldath

    keldath LivE LonG AnD PrOsPeR

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    Hey,
    Writing frim work so I'll be brief for now,

    Tge ranged in adcv and civ4, are baseg off air combat, in doto, its on regular combat + modifiers.
    So i think using the xml tags,
    Like vs unit class desroyer - 20% def or so,
    Will help.
    Or the other way,
    Defense vs catapult of 20% right on a destroyer.
    Like this we can scale range damage according to unit era tech.

    The RANGED COMBAT DAMAGE, acts as a reducer in the damage output.

    The code tags, ill try to understand their math later and write it for you.

    Ill continue later
     
  6. LeBashar

    LeBashar Warlord

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    Your message make me test in Doto also :

    catapult Vs destroyer in mod Advciv, 500% bonus VS siege for the destroyer, RANGE_COMBAT_DAMAGE = 40, power 5 (ground power) Vs 30 : 14% damage...
    against a yamato destroyer without bonus against siege = 15% damage...
    Other damages against a catapult, a 28 power tank and a modern tank are, when the strike don't miss, and with a silght variability, same as in advciv.

    so It seem it is not the power value which are in involved, but really the formula.
     
  7. keldath

    keldath LivE LonG AnD PrOsPeR

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    thats prerry strange.

    i will have a look at the formula and test as you did.
    ill compare ti other damage from other attacks. see how its done there.
     
  8. zildcav

    zildcav Chieftain

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    download link isn't working for me
     
  9. keldath

    keldath LivE LonG AnD PrOsPeR

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    Hi,
    Ill take care of it later today.
    Whixh version did you try? 1,04?
     
  10. zildcav

    zildcav Chieftain

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    It's already working now, kinda strange. Earlier it said that the download is blocked.
     
  11. keldath

    keldath LivE LonG AnD PrOsPeR

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    Oh nice,
    Ill be very appreciative for any game play features,
    Specifically on the ranged attack.

    Thank you.
     
  12. zildcav

    zildcav Chieftain

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    I'll give my feedback after a few games, maybe next week. Although I don't know if my opinions are valid because i can only play prince at standard bts
     
  13. keldath

    keldath LivE LonG AnD PrOsPeR

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    cool,
    im greafull for anyone who can provide feedback.
     
  14. keldath

    keldath LivE LonG AnD PrOsPeR

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    hi all,

    once adv mod will be up to version 097, ill issue a Doto update as well.
     
  15. LeBashar

    LeBashar Warlord

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    Hello keldath, can you investigate the damage formula for the ranged strikes and why promotions bonus affect it so little ?
     
  16. keldath

    keldath LivE LonG AnD PrOsPeR

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    Hey,
    I will,
    Just began updating to a development versio of 097 advciv, lifechanging ai.
    It will take me some time.
    I plan on working on the ranged after wards more.
    If ill have time, ill check 104 ranged again.
     
  17. Conqueror Worm

    Conqueror Worm Warlord

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    How is the update coming?

    I've only played various updated versions of K-Mod for years now. I really appreciate the work all the modders on these modmods have done. I know that you are one of the best and most active.

    I have always wondered why so few mods include a component like Rise of Mankind's Increasing Difficulty. I also remember there was a K-Mod modmod quite a few years back now, I forget the title, but it also included a component entitled Dynamic Difficulty, I think it was. These components seem so wonderful to me, yet so few mods include them. Could you possibly explain why you have chosen to opt out on this kind of component as well. If you have the time to comment, I'd love to hear you thoughts. And thanks for all you and f1rpo have done of late. Once again, I am much looking forward to playing the 097 version!
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2020
  18. keldath

    keldath LivE LonG AnD PrOsPeR

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    hi,

    its tough, im working almost everyday, with the guidance of f1rpo.
    it will take a while to finish. sdk is the hardest.
    xml some python are les hard.

    but, i cant release until f1rpo will officially release his version of 097.
    so we'll wait and see.

    thanks for the interest :)
     
  19. f1rpo

    f1rpo plastics

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    I've been tracking down a couple of potential OOS issues in the last few days :badcomp:, and everything seemed quite stable. I imagine that you'll do some tests yourself with the DotO code. Once you have something that you think is an improvement over the current DotO version, you don't need to wait for me to finish up. That said, if you don't wait for me to finish the city trade code, then you may have to disable city trades somehow.
    It's a question for keldath, but here's my take: v0.97 will probably include an XML option for a tech cost rubber band. It might also be possible to achieve a similar effect by configuring a low iAIHandicapIncrementTurns value in CivHandicapInfos.xml (named iAIPerEraModifier in BtS). Personally, I prefer not to play on Immortal or at least not on Deity because the AI modifiers become too implausible for my taste. If I were to start on Prince or Monarch, I expect that the difficulty would have to go up to Deity eventually, considering how crucial the early game is.
     
  20. keldath

    keldath LivE LonG AnD PrOsPeR

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    oh you edited your post Conqueror Worm,

    well, im light years form being best, but active,yeah, been since 2005, checking fanatics on a daily / hourly basis ...
    thanks.

    i like having various options that allow a player can style a really varied game each play.
    until i started to get guidance from f1rpo, i was strictly a merger of mods. most times didnt understand one line of code. so i avoided mods i got stuck with merging.
    that changes as i learnt some JavaScript and started to understand basic codes . f1rpo also took the time to explain to me logic and stuff.
    today, im more inclined to add in some good interesting options in. that said, i only wish to keep one ultimate standard, that the mod comp will be , multiplayer compatible.
    dynamic difficult, was in revdcm i think, created originally by kael (ffh creator). i think it had MP issues at a time, probably not anymore.
    right now the effort of updating to advc is challenging, consume much of the little time i have.
    in between versions, when i dont need to update, i try to push in new stuff (such as the ranged bombardment i added in for version 1.04).

    ill be happy to check the possibility to add the dynamic difficulty, if ill find that mod :), once i can have a stable version.
    only issue is that im modding along, which takes time...not much civ4 modders or players left.


    never played a game above prince, won maybe, 1...

    oh, well, theres been good reports by my self and another that mp is stable,
    but i did saw 1-2 OOS none reproducible in my game though. im certain youll have it fixed.


    of course, im eager to test thupdated 097 doto...sometime in the future...

    i always prefer to be aligned...

    well, ill cross that bridge (meaning bug you :)) when we'll get there...
     

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