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Deity Balance.. Domination victory Happiness thread

Discussion in 'General Balance' started by MichaelCIV5VP, Oct 21, 2019.

  1. MichaelCIV5VP

    MichaelCIV5VP Chieftain

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    I have a serious bone to pick with how happiness works in VP. IF i task my city to produce science it shouldn't raise my "total science need." Like lets say its tun 280 I have all my buildings, and im trying to motor through to information era to get the Sydney opera house. I have 4 cities. each city pumps out now over 100+ extra science per turn, the extra scince from production SHOULD NOT GO TO CALCULATING THE TOTAL SCIENCE to the be averaged, because then when I task my cites the then build a building when i get a new tech that upper bar now has 100 science that is impossible, and i get so much unhappiness. ESPECIALLY during the worlds fair pumping out culture. just before the fair i have like 5 unhappiness from boredom. then after 20 turns of the +33% culture and my cities producing culture for 20 turns, when the fair is over I task it to build buildings I unlocked in those 20 turns, my boredom for the rest of the games now rests at 30. The "total yield" that's used for calculating unhappiness should not include the yields that is produced from city production. that is all. That one simple change is key. Or then for like a period of 40 turns ill just build units then delete them. rather than raise the total yields and end up with happiness for the rest of the game. Also yields from corporations should not be calculated in the total yield. on diety you basicaly have 50 turns with your corporation. turn 250 when you build your first corp then turn 300 when the AIs inevitably sanction you. and then because your city once had either +60 science, gold, culture, you now have unhappiness because your city lost it. So i find my self just picking 2kfoods instead, all internal trade routes to not spread my corp that much, then when i get sanctioned at least i have the -5% to all needs and 10% growth bonus (which is huge). its the only corp that still benefits you after sanctioning.

    to sum:
    1) yeilds from city production should not be used to calculate the average yield or how ever its done, that calculation should only be from what it would be like if building a unit or building.
    2) yeilds form corporations should not be used

    ALSO THIS: "Unhappiness begets unhappiness". Ex. im at 20 happiness, I get declared war on, I now have -20 unhappiness from pillaged tiles and 5 from war weariness after some turns. so I should be at -5 right? WRONG I"M AT -20!!!!!!!!! the -1% for each point away from +10 happiness.. is brutal. I get it makes sense to take away from culture science and gold yield your empire produces, BUT it then effects the your happiness because now at -5 I have -15% culture science and gold which because those yeilds drop by 15%, my unhappiness drops because of that, spiraling down even more, past -10 which then add an additional -5% to those yields which then spirals down further. SO the total yields reduction from happiness makes sense, BUT its should not affect the total unhappines calcualtion. for example: I have 100 base science from a city. with the +10% if im above 10 happiness I have 110 science. If you fall below 10 unhappiness with -10% your science is now 100. BUT the needs calculation is based on the upper bar of 110, but you now only have 100, so yet get EXTRA unhappiness BECAUSE YOU HAVE UNHAPPINESS, which then lowers its further to -2 unhappiness then you now have 98 science etc. etc. this needs to be fixed. I get the minus to total yields but the feedback loops are ridiculous (both ways). in the -20 scenario i was first describing, i have no gold anymore so i couldn't buy luxuries so i traded away every single strategic resource for 2 luxuries and then poof im at +8 happiness again a difference of 28 from 2 luxuries (which is insane) because the happiness from the luxuries raised my happiness, and because it raised my happiness the yields modifier improved, which raised my happiness, which then improved the yield modifier... WHICH RAISED MY HAPPINESS. The feedback loop need to be dealt with.
     
  2. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch Supporter

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    Happiness medians are a global factor, and they're smoothed to about a 5% potential increase per turn. A single city changing its yields will not immediately affect the median on the next turn.

    G
     
  3. MichaelCIV5VP

    MichaelCIV5VP Chieftain

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    I BEG TO DIFFER
     
  4. MichaelCIV5VP

    MichaelCIV5VP Chieftain

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    What you said maybe true, but here i had 20 turns of worlds fair culture production in my cities 20 turns. so while i'm producing culture my city culre need decreses by 25%... but i produced 33% more culture onto of the 33% additional form the additional 150 from production right? so 150*1.33=200 culture. so my needs is now up by 200 culture, plus the extra 33% from my base culture. so easy numbers my new culture need goes up by 250 to be averaged. so when i switch out form the fair, while producing culture decreased my culture needs by 25%, now thats gone and i have new needs based of the additional 250. even if it goes up by 5% 20 turns makes it go its it maximum, then i have a ridiculously high culture need.

    IDN exactly how the math works.. but seriously 2 things need to change 1) If i produce a yeild through city production (gold or science or culture) that should not go into calculating the total number that is to be "averaged" or however it works. it should strictly be based on the "base yields" of what the people produce, like the yields of a city if i were building a building or unit. 2) the yields from corporations need to go as well, because once sanctioned what ever need that corp was producing, my unhappiness for that yield is abnormally higher for that specific need category.

    I dont really want to dive into the math or really want an explanation.. but I hate the happiness swings. idn how to tell you but i play deity quit often and i quite often swing high to low low to high turn after turn after sometimes. its just annoying. and you may say feedback cycles are not a thing but for my experience they are very real and occur all the time. I even prepare for it. like if i know im going to get hit with unhappiness ex. a trade deal that wont get renewed especially if i'm resting at 10 happiness, i wont just got to like 3 or 2 happiness i go to -6 or -8. the feed back swing is there. its a problem.
     
  5. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch Supporter

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    Considering that I wrote the code, I can assure you 'maybe' is an understatement. It's most certainly true.

    G
     
    vyyt and andersw like this.

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