Deity best civ?

[KingKong76]

Just won my 1st Deity game!
After like 30+ more than 100 turn games.
Playing Poland
Trad
Honor left
Rationalisim
Autocracy
Went for mid game war with Cavalry and Artilery took 2 cities from my 1st neibor including his capital and then turtled to sience victory.

That said conditions were simply perfect. Had 8 salts plus 3 other lux, pastures, iron, and every single strategic needed. etc etc etc Not mentioning the fact Hawatha could have win the diplmatie, but for any reason he decided to sit on his 25K goldand wait for cultural vic.
Even pcked up mother earth and manage to keep my religion for the whole game.

Now im looking to pick a new civ.

Thinking of Austria... Aztec...any suggestion witch a short strategy path?

 

[danaphanous]

8 salts? :O

...I have never seen a start that good in my life lol no wonder it was a winner! You got pics?

Top Deity-level civs are usually listed as:

Poland, Babylon, Maya

Basically you want civs with early bonuses to close that gap to the Deity AI. I usually attempt to steal 1-2 workers from an AI of choice as well. If you can pull this off it'll jump-start your economy and create a weak neighbor AI to later conquer or use as a target for the other AI if there are a lot of warmongers. Civs that play best with larger empires, more land, or late in the game are generally not recommended without a lot of experience as the Deity AI are pretty warlike and have huge armies. You want early advantages more then late ones.

I'd add a few of my own choices:

Shoshone, Ethiopia, Egypt, Celts

Anything with an early building, extra territory, or advantage to founding a religion will help. The safest Deity game is one where you are at peace with the majority of neighbors so you can catch up on science from all the early trade routes they send you. But some games go to hell if you have a higher amount of warmongers which is why it is good to weaken a neighbor as a buffer. that's my strategy at least.

 

[KingKong76]

8 salts? :O

...I have never seen a start that good in my life lol no wonder it was a winner! You got pics?

Top Deity-level civs are usually listed as:

Poland, Babylon, Maya

Basically you want civs with early bonuses to close that gap to the Deity AI. Civs that play best with larger empires, more land, or late in the game are generally not recommended without a lot of experience as the Deity AI are pretty warlike and have huge armies.

I'd add a few of my own choices:

Shoshone, Ethiopia, Egypt

Anything with an early building, extra territory, or advantage to founding a religion will help but don't expect to spread it far. Deity AI are very aggressive at spreading their religions. This makes tithes less powerful. The safest Deity game is on where you are at peace with the majority of neighbors so you can catch up on science from all the early trade routes.

hahaha yeah indeed!
I still have the save so yeah.. Ill post one tomorow.
I used Legendary start tho. But still, That was an amazing one. 3 salts in cap... 1 in my second city along side with incense and Marble, 2 in my 3rd city + peals, and 2 in my 3rd city! That was something special. PLus I manage to snatch 1 worker from Inca and a bit later I got his 1st settler. Got 2 from babarians aswel. So... well....it was more of a confidence booster making me want to stay at diety and not go back to immortal than a real victory!! lolll

I think Ill folow your advice and stay with the obvous... Babylon and Maya... I like Etiopia aswel. Thats my second closent victory. Miss the sicence vic by 2 turns.

 

[danaphanous]

I think Ill folow your advice and stay with the obvous... Babylon and Maya... I like Etiopia aswel. Thats my second closent victory. Miss the sicence vic by 2 turns.

Yeah if you can beat Deity consistently with those guys then you can try a few more difficult civs. that's my advice at least!

When are you launching the spaceship out of curiosity? Do you save your scientists to bulb through the info era? On deity it is better to save them and stay behind the AI a bit longer as you get free science from their trade routes, can steal more, and better benefit from RA's. AI does not save their scientists so you can rocket past them for the win if you have a few saved to jump forward and claim the hubble telescope. Losing hubble is the most surefire way to lose SV as the AI gets 2-3 free techs from building it.

 

[KingKong76]

off!! Really? Never EVER tought about that! That smart...
That said it dosent leave you to much behind in science when it comes to upgrade you millitary?
Cause from what I can see, as soon as they see you are a bit late in the milltary they jump in your face like a bob cat on cocaine...

 

[danaphanous]

haha, yeah their bulb output is the average over the past 8 turns or so, so saving them works well.
You shouldn't need to bulb early scientists to catch up, especially with the 3 top civs. If you get an early 1-2 it might be better to create the academies though for that extra science in your capital but between the trade routes and stealing you should catch up ok.

You should still be ok on military. Just overbuild it a bit. The AI doesn't consider your tech level directly only your military score. Just keep a good defense. You can't prevent attacks every game but you should be able to rebuff them if you prepare, especially as Ethiopia lol. The best protection against the AI is other AI though. try to get on the good side of some of them. Some players even bribe their friends to attack their enemies. Even if you don't fight much getting involved in wars and denouncing the people other AI don't like will get you on their good side. And if you divide the world this way with a few friends on your side it'll be easier to defend yourself and catch up. May not work every game but it works well enough. Usually if you try to be friends with everyone that's the quickest way to get attacked by everyone. They prefer you to take sides in their silly squabbles.

 

[KingKong76]

Ill definately give it a shot, because the idea behind just makes so much sens. I always build academy pre turn 200 and pop them for extra science post turn 200. I took that habbit pretty early, maybe even at Kink level like 2 years ago and never even reconsider if it was the right thing to do.

 

[darkskies]

I find England to be an easy one at Deity, bee-line for those cross-bows and play defensively until then. She is especially good in island or archipelago maps; in fact in island games if you are lucky enough to get an isolated island with a few city-states then you can be all prepared for DOWs by the time you get ocean crossing abilities (they will find you first most likely since you'll still be a bit behind in science but usually it takes them a little time before the try to invade by which time you should already have long bows and be on your way to ships of the line).

While you are working your way towards cross bows, DOW a city-state nobody cares about and get your archers up to their double attack experience level then when you get long bows you'll have some great power to go out and conquer the world (or keep the world at bay while you work on some other VC).

Just about the time you get worried that your long-bows are getting a bit obsolete then you should be getting ships-of-the-line (which is why I recommend water based maps, on a mostly land based map, get rid of any nasty neighbors early while your long-bows are still the best units in the game and get those puppets generating science).

And by the time Gatling guns come in, two range Gatlings (and machine guns) are quite powerful and useful.

 

[danaphanous]

I did the same thing for a while, but my rule is plant pre T150. I did some back of the envelope math and I think after 150 you definitely lose planting because the game is halfway over. Some speedy players say even past T100 is too late to plant given how valuable they are at the end of the game but I hate saving them that long lol. I think it's ok to burn one to get research labs a little quicker too as long as you have the money/production to make the savings matter and get them up 8 turns quicker.

Honestly I'd prefer it if scientists were locked at the science output of their production time because saving them seems like a loophole, but it works really well. It can make a science finish difference of 20-30 turns. I learned about it from other Deity players on this forum and my tests show it works REALLY well. It makes it more likely to get Hubble too which is 2 more free scientists so it snowballs. One game I was completely finished with the spaceship and had won just 15 turns after beelining and researching rocketry with this strategy. (Finished spaceship 8 turns after apollo program completion) The entire info era and half of the atomic was done just like that because I also had glory of God to faith-buy more scientists then usual plus 2 from hubble plus 5 hard-built saved. I had planted 2 as well. You get another from ISS but I find it typically isn't worth it. You can finish faster putting your hammers immediately into parts. Usually ISS isn't even started by the time I win which is sad...

 

[KingKong76]

I find England to be an easy one at Deity, bee-line for those cross-bows and play defensively until then. She is especially good in island or archipelago maps; in fact in island games if you are lucky enough to get an isolated island with a few city-states then you can be all prepared for DOWs by the time you get ocean crossing abilities (they will find you first most likely since you'll still be a bit behind in science but usually it takes them a little time before the try to invade by which time you should already have long bows and be on your way to ships of the line).

While you are working your way towards cross bows, DOW a city-state nobody cares about and get your archers up to their double attack experience level then when you get long bows you'll have some great power to go out and conquer the world (or keep the world at bay while you work on some other VC).

Just about the time you get worried that your long-bows are getting a bit obsolete then you should be getting ships-of-the-line (which is why I recommend water based maps, on a mostly land based map, get rid of any nasty neighbors early while your long-bows are still the best units in the game and get those puppets generating science).

And by the time Gatling guns come in, two range Gatlings (and machine guns) are quite powerful and useful.

This s pretty much how I play England on lowerlevel, but I dont think Im ready for heavy warmongering yet. lolll
Ill deffinately give Englanf a shot later tho when I feel ready. One of my fav civ.

 

[KingKong76]

I did the same thing for a while, but my rule is plant pre T150. I did some back of the envelope math and I think after 150 you definitely lose planting because the game is halfway over. Some speedy players say even past T100 is too late to plant given how valuable they are at the end of the game but I hate saving them that long lol. I think it's ok to burn one to get research labs a little quicker too as long as you have the money/production to make the savings matter and get them up 8 turns quicker.

Honestly I'd prefer it if scientists were locked at the science output of their production time because saving them seems like a loophole, but it works really well. It can make a science finish difference of 20-30 turns. I learned about it from other Deity players on this forum and my tests show it works REALLY well. It makes it more likely to get Hubble too which is 2 more free scientists so it snowballs. One game I was completely finished with the spaceship and had won just 15 turns after beelining and researching rocketry with this strategy. (Finished spaceship 8 turns after apollo program completion) The entire info era and half of the atomic was done just like that because I also had glory of God to faith-buy more scientists then usual plus 2 from hubble plus 5 hard-built saved. I had planted 2 as well. You get another from ISS but I find it typically isn't worth it. You can finish faster putting your hammers immediately into parts. Usually ISS isn't even started by the time I win which is sad...

Ill mplement that for sure...

 

[sunbeam]

Really don't know why everyone says the Maya. You don't start getting great people till you get Theology.

And for all practical purposes you get a great engineer, great prophet, or maybe a great general (depending on situation). Writers, artists, musicians don't really matter except in occasional corner cases.

And Theology is so far down the road the early part of establishing the cities that will be your core ones has already been done when it rolls around.

Useless? No. But by no means do I think it is as useful in general as Poland or Babylon's abilities though.

Push getting the great person back to philosophy maybe. But I'd wager a guess that the great scientist Babylon gets at writing has more of an impact on games than all of the Maya's great people combined.

 

[inthesomeday]

Maya's good for Pyramids, not the Long Count. Well, the Long Count's great too, but Maya pyramids are one of the best UBs in the game. I go wide and they make it even better. Plus the first Long Count, usually available to the player at the 7th ba'aktun, has great timing with the liberty finisher; it means you can get two scientists right around universities, meaning 16 beakers in the capital right around perfect timing to make it like 30 beakers.

 

[danaphanous]

yes exactly. The Long Count is not why they are good. It's on ok ability but the pyramid UB is what makes them top-tier. A shrine that provides 2 faith and 2 science is pretty OP given how early you can get it. That's extra science at least a dozen turns before any other civ, and it simultaneously gives you 2 faith which means you'll make something of religion as well. The faster you expand the better the pyramid effect and early religion. Also another perk of the Mayans is the atlatist doesn't need archery so you can skip it and go straight for theology while still being able to build them for basic protection and they are cheaper then normal archers! The science boosts from having early pyramid and library catapult you to theology very quickly to get long count started. The earlier that first free GP the better!

It's the powerful combination of all that early science and usually a nice religion that makes them competitive for deity where you are playing from behind. They are probably the easiest to try for a wider empire on Deity as the Pyramid keep them up in science almost from founding and the more the better!

 

[KingKong76]

Was about to say pretty much what danaphanous and inthesomeday said.
I would add one tiny benefit, not only you get that UB very early, but you dont really have to change anything in your building order or beavior to extract max value from that UB. Which make them very easy to play. Ethiopia would be another example of the same type...

Like you know tho, I'm an Immortal player that got an amazing roll on Diety, I dont know yet how much I will have to change my habbits and vision of the game to beat it on a regular basis.

Still thik Maya is one of the top 3-5 Civs at least from Immortal down.

 

[sunbeam]

Well that makes sense. Never play them though.

Seems like the unique buildings are better than unique abilities quite often.

I know the Ethiopian Stele beats Byzantium's bonus hands down. I mean you usually have to take whatever faith pantheon that makes sense first, and you don't get to take advantage of that second belief till you found the religion. And depending on whether you are working the terrain in question, you may not get any faith from that pantheon belief.

Meanwhile Ethiopia gets faith from the get go, and gets to take advantage of something like Sun God from the beginning.

I guess there are some unique situations with map generation where you would rather have Byzantium's ability, but they aren't common. I think I have beaten Ethiopia to founding Eastern Orthodoxy only once in games where I played Byzantium and Ethiopia was in the game.

To tell you the truth, the dromon is the real strength of that civ, if the geography permits. Cataphracts are nice too, but sometimes you don't get horses, you might want to research other things first, and everyone seems to have lots of spearmen.

 

[KingKong76]

Well that makes sense. Never play them though.

Seems like the unique buildings are better than unique abilities quite often.

I know the Ethiopian Stele beats Byzantium's bonus hands down. I mean you usually have to take whatever faith pantheon that makes sense first, and you don't get to take advantage of that second belief till you found the religion. And depending on whether you are working the terrain in question, you may not get any faith from that pantheon belief.

Meanwhile Ethiopia gets faith from the get go, and gets to take advantage of something like Sun God from the beginning.

I guess there are some unique situations with map generation where you would rather have Byzantium's ability, but they aren't common. I think I have beaten Ethiopia to founding Eastern Orthodoxy only once in games where I played Byzantium and Ethiopia was in the game.

To tell you the truth, the dromon is the real strength of that civ, if the geography permits. Cataphracts are nice too, but sometimes you don't get horses, you might want to research other things first, and everyone seems to have lots of spearmen.

Give them a shot, they are interesting...

 

[ShakaKhan]

The strat listed above for England is certainly effective. It's a big bonus that both of their UUs are ranged units. But in the context of Deity level games, their biggest bonus is their extra spy. You get it along with your initial spy, whenever anyone enters the renaissance. From there, if you're playing a real Deity level game, with no IGE bonuses or map-cooking, you're getting an extra TWO technologies, every 9-12 turns, which is often about 70% of your total research.

As far as the thread title, interpreted as, "which civ is the best for deity?" I have to go with Babylon. That one free academy on turn 15 or so makes such a huge difference, often tripling you research at the time. Techs that take 10-12 turns are done in 3 or 4. The extra spawn rate of scientists let you go bulb-crazy later. While the science bonuses are obviously the biggest advantage to the Babylon game, it's often overlooked how both of the Unique's help keep you alive early game, the only time that Babylon is vulnerable.

 

[KingKong76]

The strat listed above for England is certainly effective. It's a big bonus that both of their UUs are ranged units. But in the context of Deity level games, their biggest bonus is their extra spy. You get it along with your initial spy, whenever anyone enters the renaissance. From there, if you're playing a real Deity level game, with no IGE bonuses or map-cooking, you're getting an extra TWO technologies, every 9-12 turns, which is often about 70% of your total research.

As far as the thread title, interpreted as, "which civ is the best for deity?" I have to go with Babylon. That one free academy on turn 15 or so makes such a huge difference, often tripling you research at the time. Techs that take 10-12 turns are done in 3 or 4. The extra spawn rate of scientists let you go bulb-crazy later. While the science bonuses are obviously the biggest advantage to the Babylon game, it's often overlooked how both of the Unique's help keep you alive early game, the only time that Babylon is vulnerable.

Im rollling starts rght now with them... lets see if can pass turn 100 and have enough hope to continue.

 

[Lord Alexander]

Outside of the obvious Civs that for the most part are easy mode being Poland, Maya, Babylon and Korea I really like the Netherlands on Deity. Unlike the already listed civs they can be pretty situational but if you can get a handful of Polders on marshes or flood plains they can be pretty damn good and the unique ability is nice as well, can really help with happiness at times or if you need extra gold you can sell your last copy of a resource with only half the cost towards happiness.