Hey all,
(tl/dr: research treaties are bad for the game, and as bugged as resource trading. The Ai can't play for win)
I thought I share some thoughts about my last game, my goal was to see how can I compete against the AI on the highest level without wars and by disabling some well-known strategies.
Settings: Large map, 12 ai, epic speed, deity level, small continents.
Extra rules:
-I can't start war unless I'd lose the game otherwise (I mean I could had attacked a civ which already had the apollo program or 3 policy branches completed. I expected wars would be necessary, but no ai got close to this)
-Maximum one city state ally from each type, no patronage (though with the first restriction I wouldn't had taken it anyway)
-Not selling open borders or strategy resources to the ai (Luxury resources could be traded, but no exploit like getting lump sum then declaring war)
I was with the Iroquois, had an isolated start (was not my intention, but for an economy game it could work well) So I hadn't built too many units, but I couldn't trade with the ai until around 500 bc when I made contact. My land was mostly tundra, I had 5 cities in the whole game, only 7 tiles of luxury resources in the whole empire, so it was not a nice rich land.
I won a spaceship victory in around 1850, I was also going for culture to see which one I could get sooner.
Egypt has entered into the industrial era in 400 ad, (I was somewhere in the beginning of the medieval), modern era in 1400 ad (I was quite close to follow) and I entered the future era first.
I managed to win because appearently I left one 'exploitable' strategy in the game, that is: research treaty (I did not even use the make the treaty then declare war exploit) I maintained my research treaties with around 8 ai, got a tech in average every 6 turns even when researching myself took 20-30 turns in the end.
Without patronage science bonus, without maritime city states pumping up my cities, without puppet states my science was very low (around 200 tops) but it did not really mattered. I ran scientist specialists in all my cities though to get great scientists (free techs).
I have noticed that just like with resource trading there are never ending research treaties. Made them hundreds of turns ago and never got the tech, can't make an other because it says I have already..
The Ai used the research treaties, but not as extensively as I, fortunately.. it would had been much more crazier.. this RA concept is very bad and makes no sense.
I would make two changes at least: any subsequent research treaty would cost more than the previous one (if you have one running already then the second one would be more expensive for you) and you can only get tech from the same era as your partner in (so no stealth bomber tech from a stone age tribe).
But I'd just throw them away if I could..
About the ai: we know they aren't really good in intercontinental wars, but why didn't they even build the apollo program? they could had..
(tl/dr: research treaties are bad for the game, and as bugged as resource trading. The Ai can't play for win)
I thought I share some thoughts about my last game, my goal was to see how can I compete against the AI on the highest level without wars and by disabling some well-known strategies.
Settings: Large map, 12 ai, epic speed, deity level, small continents.
Extra rules:
-I can't start war unless I'd lose the game otherwise (I mean I could had attacked a civ which already had the apollo program or 3 policy branches completed. I expected wars would be necessary, but no ai got close to this)
-Maximum one city state ally from each type, no patronage (though with the first restriction I wouldn't had taken it anyway)
-Not selling open borders or strategy resources to the ai (Luxury resources could be traded, but no exploit like getting lump sum then declaring war)
I was with the Iroquois, had an isolated start (was not my intention, but for an economy game it could work well) So I hadn't built too many units, but I couldn't trade with the ai until around 500 bc when I made contact. My land was mostly tundra, I had 5 cities in the whole game, only 7 tiles of luxury resources in the whole empire, so it was not a nice rich land.
I won a spaceship victory in around 1850, I was also going for culture to see which one I could get sooner.
Egypt has entered into the industrial era in 400 ad, (I was somewhere in the beginning of the medieval), modern era in 1400 ad (I was quite close to follow) and I entered the future era first.
I managed to win because appearently I left one 'exploitable' strategy in the game, that is: research treaty (I did not even use the make the treaty then declare war exploit) I maintained my research treaties with around 8 ai, got a tech in average every 6 turns even when researching myself took 20-30 turns in the end.
Without patronage science bonus, without maritime city states pumping up my cities, without puppet states my science was very low (around 200 tops) but it did not really mattered. I ran scientist specialists in all my cities though to get great scientists (free techs).
I have noticed that just like with resource trading there are never ending research treaties. Made them hundreds of turns ago and never got the tech, can't make an other because it says I have already..
The Ai used the research treaties, but not as extensively as I, fortunately.. it would had been much more crazier.. this RA concept is very bad and makes no sense.
I would make two changes at least: any subsequent research treaty would cost more than the previous one (if you have one running already then the second one would be more expensive for you) and you can only get tech from the same era as your partner in (so no stealth bomber tech from a stone age tribe).
But I'd just throw them away if I could..
About the ai: we know they aren't really good in intercontinental wars, but why didn't they even build the apollo program? they could had..
