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Deity India Game Help

Discussion in 'Community Patch Project' started by chicorbeef, Apr 15, 2018 at 6:58 PM.

  1. chicorbeef

    chicorbeef Chieftain

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    I'm trying to play a Deity game right now as India and my game has steadily devolved into an utter mess. I want to know if you guys think it's possible to win this right now (my cities are in unrest/have so many barbs due to an event. I'm thinking of disabling events, honestly).

    https://imgur.com/a/19ATz

    I took Tradition and the first policy in Artistry. My religion is: Goddess of Purity, Divine Inheritance (haven't used it at all due to an unhappiness mess), Mastery, Cathedrals (probably should have picked Thrift), and Resilience.

    The build order in my cities was Monument-Council-Walls(I was being attacked here)-Military/Markets or Barracks+Arena+Forge.

    I got attacked by the Incans first, fought them off, now I'm being attacked by the Egyptians. I'm about to steal Chemistry in three turns, maybe once my unrest is over Nagga-Mallas can help? I think I'm screwed, but I do have a spy stealing tech every 6 turns, so there is that.

    I can't even build any farms because I can't protect my workers.

    So to anyone who plays Deity, is this possible to win and what can I do to avoid this?
     
  2. Noob Fanboy

    Noob Fanboy Chieftain

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    Honestly, this is the reason why i don't play with events. You're really behind and you're playing Deity, i think it's wise to begin a new game.
     
  3. CrazyG

    CrazyG Warlord

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    I think you're screwed. You can also disable bad events separately, they do really punish slight unhappinesss

    You need to delay building those walls. You have got to find a way to defend yourself for a longer time with just units to compete on Deity
     
  4. chicorbeef

    chicorbeef Chieftain

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    How would I be able to defend a city like Mumbai without walls in this game?
     
  5. ElliotS

    ElliotS Warmonger

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    By taking Elephantine. :c5war:

    Seriously though, with that placement you're guaranteed to need to have problems unless you knock Egypt down. I think you're screwed here too.
     
  6. chicorbeef

    chicorbeef Chieftain

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    I would've, but how was I supposed to take that city when I was simultaneously being attacked from Machu? And India's got no boosts to early warfare/I picked Tradition (should I have gone Authority here?).
     
  7. CrazyG

    CrazyG Warlord

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    I think the first mistakes was the pantheon. There doesn't seem to be that many eligible tiles. Yes it feels good to snowball with those awesome lake tiles on turn 1.

    I wouldn't have settled in Mumbai at all as tradition. I see that you were tempted to because of the pantheon boosted lakes, but its a really hard to defend city. If you had enough strenght to defend it, you probably would have enough strenght to conquer it.
     
  8. chicorbeef

    chicorbeef Chieftain

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    There are two marshes and three lakes by my capital, which was more than enough in my view. What other pantheon would be better?

    I suppose I could have done without setting Mumbai, but then the battle would have just shifted to Varanasi.

    I tried settling Vijayanagara in a defensible location, it's covered by rivers/jungle, but maybe I shouldn't have settled the city at all or settled it further back?

    I mean, with such a cramped map, I'm beginning to think Authority aggression was the only way here and I shouldn't have bothered with Tradition.

    Btw, I'm about to get Nagga's, it seems like I'm probably screwed but that could be a glimmer of hope in this game.

    My religion overall seems to have been really bad too, what would you recommend in this kind of game? I've been suffering from massive Poverty despite Cathedrals (like +18), and of course Crime.

    Edit: Mumbai is also my only source of Horses and I'd only have 2 iron without it.
     
  9. CrazyG

    CrazyG Warlord

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    The quarry pantheon is quite strong for India. Ghandi can go monument first everywhere and that pantheon buffs monuments. You have a decent number of pantheon tiles which makes it really strong early on. I don't see how your capital is only that big when you have so many high food tiles early on, you needed to snowball. Goddess of Beauty is also really good.

    Long term you cannot have the borders you currently have. Your plan should either be to hold Mumbai and Elephantine (maybe Machu as well) or none of those. IDK why you are so unhappy, amber monopoly gives you +6 happiness and your cities are low population.

    Random questions- why are all of your cities working the defense process?
    In that screenshot you have 0 science and 0 culture.
    Your capital is really small for turn 169. This is standard speed right? My most recent game was also as India, my capital's population was 30~something on turn 200.
     
  10. chicorbeef

    chicorbeef Chieftain

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    So quarry pantheon's production > Purity's food? Isn't it a bit of a slower start, though? I'll certainly test it out.

    I have 0 science/culture because of an unrest in all my cities. Because I can't build anything or make any yields, Defense process is the only thing that has any impact whatsoever.

    My capital is really small because I simply failed to get growth going early I was too focused on military/didn't get workers out fast enough (dumb mistake, I know). I have had previous games where I grew like a madman, but this isn't one of them.

    My cities are unhappy right now because they're all in the "occupied" state (this event, man). I was actually even unhappier because of massive poverty/crime, which I really don't know how to deal with at this stage. My Amber monopoly isn't even connected, btw.

    And yes, this is standard speed.
     
  11. CrazyG

    CrazyG Warlord

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    The mistake probably happened a long time ago when something got built instead of a worker.

    The quarry pantheon also gives culture and gold to monuments. You should finish you monument on turn 10 or so, so its a good way to start with India. Early culture pays off
     
    Owlbebach likes this.
  12. Owlbebach

    Owlbebach Chieftain

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    Yeah, Tradition really requires a lot of workers ASAP, this is the best way to fix production.

    Don't you think that India needs to maximize its Faith? I mean that Prophet discount is great, but without Missionaries it starts so slow that you really need to get Scripture or Ritual ASAP
     
  13. CrazyG

    CrazyG Warlord

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    The faith isn't great but it would get you there. I also really like Goddess of Beauty for India, which is faith strong early on.

    I don't take scripture or ritual with India. Usually I take Sainthood and Glory of God to start a great person loop.
     
  14. Owlbebach

    Owlbebach Chieftain

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    This is great but you need to spread your religion somehow. I had lots of problems with spreading for india without Scripture (on Pangea)
     
  15. chicorbeef

    chicorbeef Chieftain

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    Thanks for all the advice!

    One thing I want to know-would you go Tradition or Authority here?

    Edit: I also realized that a more efficient strategy would probably have been to go for Mills-Harappans-Markets/Library/Baths-Barracks-Forge-Arena instead of going straight for the BFA trio. I could have let the Harappans carry my infrastructure for a while.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2018 at 7:50 PM
  16. Owlbebach

    Owlbebach Chieftain

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    That depends on what do you want to do. Tradition is most likely a Tourism tree, Progress and Authority are both suitable for Science/Diplo but should be played differently. With Authority you should probably go very aggressive, rush Horseman or Spearmen and Archers and capture couple of cities. You need to be fighting to get science and culture from kills. With progress you try to defend and then go aggressive in Renaissance, when Progress starts to shine.

    I think the main advise is that you should look for complex synergies, it is like solving a puzzle. You have couple of parts by default and lots of parts that you can choose from. Your goal is to choose parts that fit good to your default parts AND to other parts that you have chosen.
    To me it seems like the best idea for India is to go Progress->Fealty->Rationalism with Holy Law and Scripture.
    Another idea is Tradition into Tourism but it feels more luck-based, i don't believe you can play it in any start, India is way too vulnerable. Also if you don't take Scripture - you need St. Basil, otherwise forget about Reformation. And it is quite hard to get it with Tradition
     
  17. CrazyG

    CrazyG Warlord

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    Tradition-Artistry-rationalism-freedom is my default plan for India. Tradition's gameplan plays into enormous farm and food bonuses quite well.

    Progress is a solid option. In particular, I take progress if I begin on the coast with fishing luxuries. Goddess of Wisdom is a good default pantheon choice with progress synergy.

    I don't really know when I would pick authority. I suppose if I had warmongers on all sides it would be okay? In this situation I don't think authority would have helped either. I don't think the problems in this image are military, they are economic.
     
  18. chicorbeef

    chicorbeef Chieftain

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    So basically, I ended up in this situation because I made poor building choices, poor religion choices, settled hazardous cities, and delayed workers. I could have played a standard Tradition turtle game, but I screwed up because of overreaching and making really bad infrastructure decisions.

    Looks like I have a lot of things I need to improve on, especially regarding my Tradition game. Thanks a lot for all the advice!
     
  19. Owlbebach

    Owlbebach Chieftain

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    Poor building choices are the most important thing with Tradition. It has less hammers => can build less buildings => every building choice is much more important that with other policy trees.

    With Authority you can build Walls as your first building in cities and be okay. With Tradition it is usually gameover right away
     
    ElliotS likes this.
  20. chicorbeef

    chicorbeef Chieftain

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    So I've started a new game on Deity as India again.

    https://imgur.com/a/IRDUZKY

    This game, I fixed my infrastructure decisions and I focused on getting plenty of workers early. My religion is Earth Mother, Holy Law, Cooperation, Cathedrals, Scripture (I would maybe have picked Sainthood but it was already chosen).

    My unhappiness is a little lower than it probably should be partly because I have -4 unhappiness from an event (Why didn't I disable events in this game? I'm starting to hate them so much).

    I'm doing quite a bit better than in the other game but I'm starting to worry that troubles are brewing on my borders. What can I do to keep my neighbours in check and what policies do you think I should pick? I have full Tradition.
     

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