Demigod Doodoo: A Training Day Game

[Tribute]

From the most recent SG's I've played as well as the games that I have been playing I have noticed an odd pattern. I noticed that I could have done better and that my strategy was so obsoleted that now, I must find a new one.

Please help me through a game that I will randomly generate. After all, any advice can be sage advice. Each set will be 10 turns long (with a maximum of 54). I'll try to be as detailed as possible at the start and make it as interesting as possible for those readers out there.

Continents with barbarians on Demigod Level with no AI respawn. Random civ on a standard map. AI agression is normal and Wonder Victory is off.

And hopefully, I, Tribute, will finally learn my lessons.

As always, try to be as supportive as possible in this learning environment. I bow down to all your tips and ideas that you will give.

In this game, I will be aiming for the stars! Hopefully my trading skills and research skills are up to the task! Since all victory conditions are enabled, I'll have to NOT conquer everyone and NOT reach domination as well as NOT be too cultural. Finally, I have to be technologically advanced enough to get the UN for voting prevention.

And please, please, please, give as much advice as you can!

The Start Things already look like poop.
The Rules If I want to learn, I gotta have some guidelines.
Turnset 1 Doodoo's Domicile is settled and a hot city site is spotted. Could this turn the game around?
Turnset 2 Meet 2 advanced AI. Despite a quick monopoly trade to tech parity, China and the Aztecs both outnumber me 3 towns to 1. Can I survive?
Turnset 3 Another AI. Despite tech parity, they outnumber me in both military and size. But with a second town, things are looking up!
Turnset 4 The poopyheads have a third town now, but the Aztecs have halted expansion altogether. What are they up to?
Turnset 5 Things have turned out for the worse. And where are the resources?

 

[Tribute]

This is obviously the first start I rolled. It looks SO bad. But we can get through this, right?



We are the Byzantines in the southern right corner of an island. The only plus side to being on the coast near so much tundra is the lake with the fish and the forests, hills, and tobacco nearby. Hopefully, we won't be trapped on this puny island for long. It's Demigod Doodoo!!!

And on another note, ... help MEEEEEEEEE!

 

[Tribute]

Before I actually play the first set of turns. What do you all think about this set of rules and restrictions?

No maximum research in the Ancient Times. This is to allow me to build up money for trades and stop me from relying solely on luck to get the Philosophy gambit. Additionally, the min science gambit can be utilized.

No cities farther than CXXXC In games past and present, I just LOVE OCP. I even bought the 'Hey, I'm an OCP player t-shirt before it even existed' (It still does not exist.) But you get the point. I am obsessive over this. And I must stop it.

No cities in formation. When I actually do build closer together, I like to have cities in formation. Sadly, that does NOT allow for best city placement. I have got to learn how to examine terrain and distance from the capital for the best city placement. This means DOTMAPPING. Many times over.

Explore before expanding In so many of my non-expansionist civ games, I have tended NOT to build scouting units, instead blindly sending out settlers to their doom. Thus, I don't play with barbarians. This time around though, it is different.

Settlers must be escorted. And Towns will be garrisoned. Edited to: Settlers will not be escorted, and Towns will be garrisoned only for happiness issues. (Thanks to andis-1) Instead of escorting the settlers for barb defense, a major scouting undertaking will be able to reveal all the barbarian villages. Using a few units instead of many, the villages can be destroyed instead of prevented from destroying my settlers.

Crush the barbs I will make a reserve army for barbarian destruction. I believe they pop up around 3000BC or so.

Less Focus on Infrastructure in Faraway Towns In all my games, my outlier cities would build a cultural building with a worker. Then they would create their own outdated garrisons (2 for each settlement including the core). Then they would all start courthouses. In some cases the courthouse did very little. I would be in the end of the MA by the time they finished. Other times the courthouse would do nothing, and I would be very sad. Instead, I will try to do Bede's really cool scientist farm idea. You know, you should patent this idea. What if someone from say, Apolyton decides to take it? Oh no!

No wonders in the AA A normal rule. I always though, have strived for the GLib or the Pyramids, especially in the higher levels. It's not necessary to say, but I very nearly always failed. If, however, I randomly get a SGL. I get a wonder. But that's luck. And my luck gave me a bad start.

Focus on Worker Actions I never have used automate. The AI really suck when there is no water; mining everything. Then they really suck when there is water; irrigating everything. This is probably the game breaking point. If I learn to use my workers well and have many of them, then the game is already half won.

Focus on military Edited to: Offensive Military (Thanks to andis-1) No, not military for war. But war prevention. I'll have the most updated offensive units that I can get as well as a few fast attackers (for the attack and run back strategy. At any rate, only a few cities will need a barracks for troop building, if at all. Apparently the AI gets really scared if you have high offensive point units. I find that quite odd since offensive units can only attack a limited amount of times in a turn, but defensive units can defend an infinite amount of times with higher odds of survival than offensive ones. Ah well.

No cultural buildings in the AA; no small wonders either. Sure, I've not wasted much time on this since my warlord days. But still. It needs to be said.
Of course, if I randomly get an MGL, I can have a small wonder (probably FP)

Actually, build the Forbidden Palace Did you know, that I am notorious for not building the FP? Yes, it's true. I never can decide on a city. And by the time I feel like I know, which one it should be, I'm in the IA with ToE and Hoover's going for the UN.

Embassies, RoPs, Maps, and Contacts I emphasize these things 'cause I don't like them much. RoP's can make me money and prevent the AI from clogging my land when they declare war on a civ behind mine as well as attacking me. Maps and Contacts are essential to victory. I normally do get all the contacts, but the maps allow me to see, which cities are threats. Embassies are necessary for RoP's and a nice, peaceful, happy neighbor who is not going to kill me anytime soon, right?

Check the AI to trade every turn This will be a pain. But to do better, I must.

Take pictures for your enjoyment Self-explanatory, my quiet audience

Take good notes for evaluation Precision is key. I really want to learn from my mistakes and accidental good choices. If I can never beat the AI on the harder levels I will never get better! And that, is precisely what I want to do.

Space Race It's lucky I'm scientific, but I should never lose sight of my goal. And my goal is to reach the stars. So wish me luck and give me your wonderful advice.

 

[andis-1]

Settlers must be escorted. And Towns will be garrisoned.

nonononononnononooo!!! This will severely hold back your initial expansion. And garrison your cities only if you have troubles with happiness, although it would be wiser just to spam workers to road the territory, thus incraesing commerce and then use lux. slider to deal with the happiness.

Crush the barbs

build couple archers and destroy their camps. It's easier to destroy them than to protect your each, and every city and settler.

Less Focus on Infrastructure in Faraway Towns

Unless if you are going for killing spree, I doupt you will ever get cities so far from your capitol. but yeah, irrigate them and turn pop into scientists...

Focus on military No, not military for war. But war prevention. I'll have the most updated defensive units that I can get as well as a few fast attackers (for the attack and run back strategy. At any rate, only a few cities will need a barracks for troop building.

Don't build any defensive units at all, unless if you need them. Just spam the best attacking units you can get, because attacking units increase your military strenght (check the military advisor and his "their military is weak/superior to ours") more than defensive ones. But seriously, a quick war to annihilate your closest neighbour eearly in the game gives you nice boost in production, which will be helpfull if you are going for spaceship.

These were just from top of my head, I'll give you more feedback once this progresses.

 

[Tribute]

Quote:
Settlers must be escorted. And Towns will be garrisoned.

nonononononnononooo!!! This will severely hold back your initial expansion. And garrison your cities only if you have troubles with happiness, although it would be wiser just to spam workers to road the territory, thus incraesing commerce and then use lux. slider to deal with the happiness.

Quote:
Crush the barbs

build couple archers and destroy their camps. It's easier to destroy them than to protect your each, and every city and settler.

Quote:
Less Focus on Infrastructure in Faraway Towns

Unless if you are going for killing spree, I doupt you will ever get cities so far from your capitol. but yeah, irrigate them and turn pop into scientists...

Quote:
Focus on military No, not military for war. But war prevention. I'll have the most updated defensive units that I can get as well as a few fast attackers (for the attack and run back strategy. At any rate, only a few cities will need a barracks for troop building.

Don't build any defensive units at all, unless if you need them. Just spam the best attacking units you can get, because attacking units increase your military strenght (check the military advisor and his "their military is weak/superior to ours") more than defensive ones. But seriously, a quick war to annihilate your closest neighbour eearly in the game gives you nice boost in production, which will be helpfull if you are going for spaceship.

These were just from top of my head, I'll give you more feedback once this progresses.

Okay, I see. I have much to learn.

But this is Demigod, I'll never be able to have an early war. Especially with the Byzantines on a cold area on the map.

I guess I ought to change the rules then. Thanks for the advice, andis-1.

 

[carmen510]

Well, look on the bright side to the start. You are next to coast, have fresh water, fish, and tobacco. Also, you'll have good production later.

 

[Tribute]

And now, I will play my first set of 10 turns. I really hope I do well. After all, these are very vital turns. I guess I'll have to stick with my starting location since it has all the qualities that carmen510 has listed. Thanks for helping!

 

[Tribute]

Turn 0 4000BC

Analysis of the Starting Location
7 coastal tiles
1 sea tile
3 tundra
1 forested tundra
1 lake with fish
1 hill
4 forested grasslands
1 tobacco grassland
2 grasslands
Sums to 21 tiles in the city radius.

I don't particularly feel like moving the settler anywhere. SE might be good, but there is tundra lurking in that direction too. N is good too since well, tobacco has only commerce bonus, which is not wasted.

But when the worker moves to the tobacco tile, it sees a whale and a fish.

Analysis of Starting Location when moved North
6 coastal tiles
1 coastal fish tile
1 whales on a sea tile
1 sea tile
1 lake with fish
1 hill
5 forests
3 grasslands
1 grassland with tobacco
1 tundra
Sums to 21 tiles in the city radius.

The northern site looks SO much better. But is it worth the waste of an empire wide loss of 1 turn? I decide, yes it has to be. For the capital is the main site of production. We've got to have a good one.

Summary:
Move both the worker and the settler north 1 space.

Turn 1 3950BC

Settle Doodoo's Domicile -> Warrior in 10. Laborer works the fish lake.

As for Doodoo's Domicile, it seems to have some great tiles already. Like the lake fish for fast growth and the whales upon expansion.

Rename my worker Pooper Scooper.
Pooper Scooper goes east to road the forest there. Just for Doodoo's Domicile's benefit.

Research
We have both Alphabet and Bronze Working already. The first is commonly researched by the AI, so we don't have the advantage of buying or selling that cheaply. Instead, we should focus on making the most of alphabet. Since I cannot MAX Science according to the rules, I still pick writing and min sci it at 10%

We now make +5gpt with Writing in 50.

Summary:
Settle Doodoo's Domicile. Move worker east. Writing in 50 with min sci.



Turn 2 3900BC

Pooper Scooper begins to road the forest tile in 6 turns.
Doodoo's Domicile (Pop:1 Growth:6) Warrior in 9.

Turn 3 3850BC

Nothing happens.

Turn 4 3800BC

Nothing happens.

Turn 5 3750BC

Nothing happens.

Turn 6 3700BC

Nothing happens.

Turn 7 3650BC

Doodoo's Domicile is about to grow! Pooper Scooper is about to finish his road.

Inter: Pooper Scooper finishes the road.

Turn 8 3600BC

Doodoo's Domicile (Pop:2 Growth:10) Warrior in 1.

I MM Doodoo's Domicile because there will be a waste of 2 shields. The laborer working on the roaded forest switches to the grassland south of Doodoo's Domicile for growth.

Turn luxuries up to 10% for happiness issues.

Pooper Scooper moves the grassland tile that Doodoo's Domicile is working on. The roaded forest has been used once for two free shields and 1 extra commerce. This will probably be how I will roll from now on.

Summary:
After MM's, Doodoo's Domicile (Pop:2 Growth:7) Warrior in 1. Lux to 10% Pooper Scooper goes south of Doodoo's Domicile. Writing in 43. +4gpt.

Turn 9 3550BC

Huzzah! The warrior finishes! Another is commisioned promptly.

Pooper Scooper roads the grassland tile for 3 turns.

MM Doodoo's Domicile to work the forest for only ONE turn. That's to make food stored 20, not 21.

Warrior is renamed 'dora's explorers. 'dora's explorers move east twice using the forest road. And discover wheat and 2 BG!!! as well as tundra tiles. But whatever. My second town will so go that direction.

Summary:
'dora's explorers move east to explore. Pooper Scooper roads the Grassland. Doodoo's Domicile (Pop:2 Growth:9) Warrior in 4.



Turn 10 3500BC

My last turn. I better make the most of it. Which, in this case, is not much.

MM Doodoo's Domicile back to the grassland.

'dora's explorers move east again and discover another wheat!!! But it also catches sight of a coast. This could mean tighter spacing....

Summary:
Doodoo's Domicile (Pop:2 Growth:5) Warrior in 7. 'dora's explorers find a wonderful city site. A settler farm site. However, at such a high level, it may have little use.




So that's my turn log. I'm not sure of the good that I've done. I hope I've done well. But there always is room for improvement.

Some questionable tactics (I really need some advice on these things)
Moving the settler north
Roading the forest first
Building a warrior not a curragh
Min sci on Writing instead of max sci.
2nd city placement suggestions

So help a demigod noob out. I'm sure you'll have a fun time watching me progress with your teachings.

And if you want to check it out, here's the <<SAVE>>

 

[carmen510]

Ok, nice position. BTW, I lose at Chieftain so I sck. I dunno wat i do wrong.

 

[Beorn-eL-Feared]

Good move moving to settle. Bad move roading a forest. There are a few, basic things you have over the AI:
- City placement
- Worker moves
- Military tactics
- Long term thought process

If you place cities closer together and see to it that every worker move counts, you will work more, better tiles than the AI and will be able to catch up in science and military. Roading a forest, which is a low food tile, is generally bad - especially at this stage. Chop it into a granary, this way your shields will go into growth, and pop = power.

About worker moves, if you choose to leave a tile unroaded as you did on turn 1, you lose 2 worker moves: the one you just did, and the turn you will eventually take to go back there. With the 'automated' roading of city tiles, you even lost 3 worker turns. that's sub-par

EDIT: you said all random, but did you allow yourself to seedbeast/'New Game' it, just to see?

 

[Beorn-eL-Feared]

I've played a few dozen turns for the kicks and something terribly shocking happened to me, I'll post it when it's no longer spoilerish.

 

[carmen510]

Let me guess, but don't tell. You met either barbs or a civ and they killed u.

 

[Beorn-eL-Feared]

Not gonna happen

 

[Tribute]

Um, we're on a lone island outexpanded by another AI who gets to the Middle Ages years and years before we do, and then I am forced to use suicide curraghs to find everyone, only to realize that I am so behind that I have to buy the Republic and then everyone is in the IA while I'm still in the AA and it all goes down from there. Right?

EDIT: you said all random, but did you allow yourself to seedbeast/'New Game' it, just to see?

I chose my first start with all random civs. And that was all. I think that answers your question?

And what is automated roading? I didn't do any automation! Maybe I'm a robot. Oh, no! I moved the worker to scout at the beginning to the tobacco and then found a better city site (uncovering both whales and a fish). Then I foolishly roaded the forest thinking that since Doodoo's Domicile would grow and pick a tile with as much production as possible despite food from that tile (due to the starting 3fpt), I chose to road the forest.

And about granaries, I don't have pottery! I'll have to buy it ASAP. Then again, what if there's no space for a settler farm. And what if there is not time. This is very depressing to be on demigod.

And thanks for the advice Beorn. What you say will help me improve my skills as a civ player. Maybe one day, even I could help other people! ... That's a silly dream, right now, isn't it.

 

[Beorn-eL-Feared]

I didn't think about the worker move, which was a good thing indeed.

Seedbeast told me it was a 60% continents map, so that meant warrior first, curragh later. When I played it, I made a warrior first, then straight to granary, 2 chops. I was spoiled by your pictures so I moved settler and roaded first off

On our continent, my first curragh found china and iroquois, then sumeria was one click away on the other shore. I was out-teched all the way until I met the Sumers, to which I traded a few techs Iros and Azzies didn't have, traded these techs to these civs for others sumer didn't have, and Wham I'm on tech parity. That's the magic of off-shore contacts and archipelago maps.

I only managed to plant 4 cities myself before being swarmed by the aztecs, so I was thinking of an archer/horse/swordsmen rush, whatever comes handy. I didn't pay attention to ressources, but IIRC we had nothing that I saw, though I didn't scout the south properly.

Research was Pots-Writing (beaten by 1 turn)-Lit (monopoly+cheap libs), and that went smoothly.

What was shocking is that Azzies settled a city next to my capital's border, stealing a BG, and I never saw that. Comps usually stay 2-3 tiles away from you. Oh well.

Btw, by automatic roading I meant that city squares count as roads. And dude, you are attempting demi-god, which is the first level where the AI starts with 2 settlers. That hurts. It's normal to be overwhelmed. You will often need to limit your early expansion and make some room at the tip of your sword, early. It's a big change of cards and I must say I'm not 100% used to dealing with it in non-AW games.

 

[Tribute]

Oh wow. Lucky you meeting those civs like that. Too bad I'm not researching pottery.... I'll try and get a curragh out ASAP as it appears you have suggested. After all, exploration by land and by sea is the best way to make contacts!

And I don't know who seedbeast is, but I did choose continents 60% if that's what you were wondering. I guess I forgot to mention that. I've normally played ONLY on pangea (how do you spell that word?), so I chose to do it the hard way this time. (Or easier, as the AI have a harder time contacting each other).

I'll try to forget all the spoilers, but OMG the Aztecs are on our island!!! No, I must forget that fact. But I'll meet them soon anyway, they have been very aggressive in their expansion in your game.

And again, thanks for the tips.

 

[Tribute]

As I am about to leave on a vacation, maybe with, maybe without the laptop, and my advisors seem through with their advising, let the next turnset begin!!!

 

[Tribute]

Inter: Cultural borders expand!

Turn 11 3450BC

'dora's explorers NE onto the wheat to reach the coast and sees a hut. I would say I've been extremely lucky with my explorations, but then again, huts are known to spawn barbs unless you pop it with a settlers immediate cultural borders. So I'll do just that, I think. The downside of what I have revealed is that my settler farm will have 2 coastal tiles but not be on the coast. (One of my peeves in past games.) Additionally, there is coast that could lead to another island in the east.

Doodoo's Domicile (Pop:2 Growth:4) Warrior in 3.
Apparently, upon expansion, the whale tile was grabbed. This is good because there will be no waste, and we get an unimproved tile that acts like a mined river grassland. Which reminds me, I haven't seen a river yet!
I think about it, and supported by Beorn's advice, I will change Doodoo's Domicile to a Curragh, which will complete after growth with hopefully, minimal waste. Curragh in 6.

Pooper Scooper roads for 1 more turn.

Turn 12 3400BC

Pooper Scooper, now done with the road, will proceed to mine for 6 turns.

'dora's explorers move N. Since we're southern according to the minimap, north is more probably going to have civs. I spot the coast of another island.



Turn 13 3350BC

Pooper Scooper goes north. Some plains are spotted as well as more coast.

Turn 14 3300BC

Pooper Scooper goes north again. Guess what? It seems like the island is actually connected to our lands!

On another note, Doodoo's Domicile is about to grow again. It will grab the roaded forest (again).
Doodoo's Domicile (Pop:2 Growth:1) Curragh in 3.

Writing in 37 with +6gpt and 76g

Turn 15 3250BC

Oh poo! Doodoo's Domicile grows with curragh in 1 with 1 shield necessary. Ah well....
Lux to 20% And MM for growth and commerce. by moving the forest laborer to the coastal fish.

'dora's explorers move north to get closer to the connection between the two lands.



Turn 16 3200BC

Doodoo's Domicile (Pop:3 Growth:6) Curragh->Settler in 15.

Pooper Scooper is almost done with the mine (2 turns). Must MM to get those shields.

Curragh renamed 'The Poop Deck' and moves NW N N to follow west to the warriors explorations east. The Poop Deck uncovers some nasty plains forests with still no water in sight.

'dora's explorers spot a lake, forest dyes, and dark green borders (Aztecs, anyone?) Woops, I was supposed to forget that. Regardless, F10 tells me so as nobody else on the list is green or even alternating green.

A long turn. Press enter....

Turn 17 3150BC

The Poop Deck NW N N. It sights both an oasis and whales.

'dora's explorers near the dyes and the green border. Might as well make contact ASAP, no? Maybe I can get pottery with alphabet.

MM Doodoo's Domicile to get the about to be mined grassland.

Turn 18 3100BC

Pooper Scooper finishes the mine! Moves N E NE to get to the next grassland as a chop will probably be wasted.

The Poop Deck moves 3N and spots an unguarded Chinese settler! Wow, I never thought the curragh would make me contact before the warrior....
We are up alphabet, of course, and down masonry, pottery, warrior code, and ceremonial burial.
To cheapen the trading, I want to contact the Aztecs. I'll get double monopolies and cheapen their techs!!!

'dora's explorers move onto the dye forest and contact the Aztecs.
We are up alphabet (thank goodness). They are up pottery, warrior code, and ceremonial burial. Hmm....

Trading Time:
I notice that the Chinese also have a monopoly. I have gold though, just in case.
So, Mao gives a straight masonry for alphabet deal. On the other hand, I could get a few gold discount on CB (he has no gold). I guess not. I could always ask the Aztecs with my soon to be 2 monopolies (or so he thinks). So masonry for alphabet!

Mao cautious->polite

It seems that the Aztecs do know somebody with Masonry and Alphabet since they have 20g and are not going all out to pay for my techs. What if they know the Chinese? Oh dear.
Warrior Code and 2g for Masonry. WC and 17g for Alphabet. Shows you their worth....
Well, I want to do 2 techs for 3. I might as well use my treasury!

WC, pottery, CB for Alphabet, Masonry and 46 gold. Deal. The AI are going to research these eventually/trade for them. I might as well get the benefit.

Montezuma polite->polite (not a mistake; the agressive guy was polite. Maybe he just likes Theodora. Or maybe he just loves despotism.)

What a long turn. They'll only get longer now. Checking back, the two civs have no more techs. But China has overall 2 towns. And Aztecs have 3. We're gonna get crushed!

Summary:
Trade Alphabet for Masonry to the Chinese.
Trade Alphabet and Masonry and 46g for CB, pottery, and WC to the Aztecs.

Inter: Chinese settler makes Canton.

Turn 19 3050BC

The poop deck NW N N. 'dora's explorers go north to reveal Tenochtitlan (guarded by an archer) and a worker.

Pooper Scooper starts to road in 3.

MM Doodoo's Domicile for shields to make food add to 20 instead of 21 again using the roaded forest. This is a very useful tile for a mistake. Or maybe I'm just usin' it to make myself feel better.

Doodoo's Domicile (Pop:3 Growth:4) Settler in 6

No new trades. BTW, do you all think that I should turn on CivAssist II? Or is that unfair?

Inter: An Aztec worker runs through Tenochitlan to the north. At least one of us can afford more than 1 worker....

Turn 20 3000BC

'dora's explorers move NW seeing Teotihuacan. My guess is that their third town (Tlateloco?) would be north of Tenochtitlan.



The Poop Deck goes NW NW N exploring the Beijing's tiles. They'll be a production monster with all those jungles.



Re-MM Doodoo's Domicile for growth in 2.

The AI has nothing new to offer. Both have 3 towns. Aztecs have 66 gold (as you would know if you added it or checked the save)

Summary:
Doodoo's Domicile (Pop:3 Growth:2) Settler in 6.
Pooper Scooper roads in 2.
Writing in 31 with +6gpt and 68g in the kitty

So this is my second set. I guess I'm not solely alone on this island. But I need more contacts for my gambit to work well. Soon I'll be behind again and need to spot a deal between my two foes, er, rivals.

Things are looking up. Kind of.

Things to discuss:
Switch to curragh instead of continuing the warrior (ignoring the new contact that I recently got off of it)
Trading the way I did.
MM's of Doodoo's Domicile.
Worker Actions
Exploration Tips
Future Builds and Settler Destination

Help a 'noob' to Demigod. Your advice may suffice in bringing us victory!

Our lands:



And the 3000BC <<SAVE>>

 

[Beorn-eL-Feared]

If you move it 1NE, you get to use your coastal commerce bonus.

You have a lot of food for that town, no granary, just settlers. In fact, with 2 AI's so close and no real deal at a 1st town settler factory, skip granaries, just make settlers. Try and grab the land you can and hope it's enough to pull a good old archer rush whoever has the most cities nearby or whoever has the pyramids.

Good trades and it is so much easier to do good trades with CAII on, you save an incredible amount of time. I remember my first huge map emperor game where I checked diplo every turn for new slaves and maps and stuff. Crazy idea not playing with CAII

If you had switched to the forest 2 turns before growth, so as to get 17 food total, and then back to coast, for your 20, your town would have worked the forest twice in 2 turns: it does count the shields and commerce of tiles automatically selected on growth: here, the forest would most likely be selected upon growth (you were over 2fpt growth so it thinks you can spare some growth) and you would gain these 2 extra shields twice. However, if you have it already selected, it will try and stay above 2fpt growth and work a normal grass or something like that, ripping you of 2 shields.

 

[Tribute]

Good trades and it is so much easier to do good trades with CAII on, you save an incredible amount of time. I remember my first huge map emperor game where I checked diplo every turn for new slaves and maps and stuff. Crazy idea not playing with CAII

If you had switched to the forest 2 turns before growth, so as to get 17 food total, and then back to coast, for your 20, your town would have worked the forest twice in 2 turns: it does count the shields and commerce of tiles automatically selected on growth: here, the forest would most likely be selected upon growth (you were over 2fpt growth so it thinks you can spare some growth) and you would gain these 2 extra shields twice. However, if you have it already selected, it will try and stay above 2fpt growth and work a normal grass or something like that, ripping you of 2 shields.

Oh, I thought I did do that. I specifically slow growth a few turns before growth (whenever it is best placed). then to reach growth sooner, I put in max food (without using the forest) and then get it on growth.

I think I did what you said on Turn 9 and 19 (how odd that they're spaced 10 turns apart when I grow in 7 turns). Hmmm.

As for CAII, I'll be usin' it!

If you move it 1NE, you get to use your coastal commerce bonus.

You have a lot of food for that town, no granary, just settlers. In fact, with 2 AI's so close and no real deal at a 1st town settler factory, skip granaries, just make settlers. Try and grab the land you can and hope it's enough to pull a good old archer rush whoever has the most cities nearby or whoever has the pyramids.

You know, I haven't settled so far away in a long time. I guess I forgot that, I would get the other wheat if I settled there too! I so forgot. What a fool I am. I get coastal and get to pop the hut safely! Thanks Beorn!

And on another note, would you, Beorn, mind guiding me along the way to space? It might be asking too much, but your advice is really helpful to me. It would be an honor to be trained, especially by you. The same goes for everyone else too! I really want to get better, maybe even play deity before my days are over (which I have many of).

Thanks for all your help, guys!