Design: Traits

[Kael]

+Aggressive

Free Combat 1 promotion for all Melee Units
½ cost Training Yard and Drydocks

+Agnostic

Can’t adopt State Religions
Cities resist religious spread
(Negative trait)

+Arcane

Arcane units earn XP faster
½ cost Mage Guid

+Barbarian

At peace with the barbarians
-10% research

+Creative

+2 Culture per turn per city
½ cost Obelisk and Theatre

+Defender

+15% Combat and +15% Withdrawal rate when the unit is in its own land
½ cost Archery Range

+Expansive

+2 Health per city
No Upkeep on Health Care Civics
½ cost Granary and Harbor

+Financial

+1 commerce on spaces generating 2 or more commerce
½ cost Market and Moneychanger

Hidden

Lands are always covered by the fog of war to other civs.

+Industrious

+50% Wonder production
½ cost Forge

+Ingenuity (woodelf)

Halves the cost of all upgrades

+Organized

-50% Civic upkeep cost
Can build the Command Post
½ cost Courthouse and Lighthouse

+Magic Resistant

All units gain the magic resistant promotion
Ring of Warding is twice as likely to desttory summoned attackers

+Philosophical

+50% Great People birth rate
No Upkeep on Education Civics
½ cost Elder Council and Library

+Raiders (Loki)

3 times as much gold from pillaging
+1 xp from each combat win
Archer, Melee, Mounted and Recon units start with the Commando promotion

+Scorched Earth (Loki)

Must Raze all Cities
(Negative trait)

+Spiritual

Free Mobility 1 promotion for all Disciple Units
½ cost Temples
No Anarchy

+Sprawling

Cities are able to work the 3rd plot ring instead of just the first 2
Cultural borders increased

+Summoners

Summoned creatures last for 3 turns instead of 1.

 

[Kael]

Reserved for ideas under consideration.

 

[Lunargent]

I was thinking that perhaps dwarven civs should be able to work peak tiles with their cities. Make it act like a mine on a desert tile.

Heck- make them able to build their cities on peak tiles-under the mountain.

Maybe throw in Dark Elves with that.

 

[loki1232]

Nah. Dark elves should be able to plant forests on Mountains, and in Hell.

 

[Lunargent]

If you complete genesis, you will get forested peaks already. But they're no good unless the city can work the tile.

 

[woodelf]

If possible I love the dwarven cities in peaks ideas, but would other civs be able to invade that tile since it's impassable?

Way back in November I added an Agricultural trait into my games. It worked like Financial, but added +1 food on tiles of 3 or more.

Also I've always preferred Industrial to work this way as well instead of the 50% bonus on Wonders.

 

[loki1232]

Hey I'm just wondering if all of the new traits are included in the phase 2 alpha.
It said they were but I wasn't sure because things like hidden are very difficult to implement so quickly.

 

[Kael]

Hey I'm just wondering if all of the new traits are included in the phase 2 alpha.
It said they were but I wasn't sure because things like hidden are very difficult to implement so quickly.

Hidden will probably wait for Shadow (which is when the 2 civs that use it are implemented). The rest I would like to get into Light. That said Im not sure how the traits will end up. Granting non-researchable civ specific techs is so much more functional. For example the Seafaring trait actually doesn't do anything in 1.1. All of the effects we want from seafaring are granted by the Seafaring tech. So I will probably cut the seafaring trait.

The elven, dwarven, dark elven and orcish traits are the same, they will probably become techs.

 

[Kael]

Cut cut cut. Removed all of the racial traits, seafaring and bascially any trait that is better done as a civ specific tech. So the Lanun won't have the seafaring trait anymore, instead they will start with the Seafaring tech.

 

[Kael]

Changed the arcane trait so that it now allows casters to xp faster and typically gain more xp than other civs.

I also changed the summoner trait to allow summoned units to stick around for 3 turns instead of 1. This doesn't apply to spells like fireballs, but does to fire elementals.

What do you guys think, do they sound like reasonable traits?

 

[loki1232]

Changed the arcane trait so that it now allows casters to xp faster and typically gain more xp than other civs.

I also changed the summoner trait to allow summoned units to stick around for 3 turns instead of 1. This doesn't apply to spells like fireballs, but does to fire elementals.

What do you guys think, do they sound like reasonable traits?

I like these. Will the sheaim still get the mages/conjurer combo unit?

 

[Kael]

I like these. Will the sheaim still get the mages/conjurer combo unit?

I dont know. After i post the next version I would like to hear your feedback on how spells are handed out and such. I had to juggle some stuff around to get it to work correctly.

But yeah, Im still up for it if it isnt unbalancing.

 

[loki1232]

Another comment is that I think the barbarian trait should not give reverse war weariness, but a constant happiness bonus while you are at war.

 

[Kael]

Another comment is that I think the barbarian trait should not give reverse war weariness, but a constant happiness bonus while you are at war.

You're probably right. I love the idea of being punished for staying at peace but it is probably unreasonable (and difficult to get the AI to deal well with).

 

[Kael]

I snuck another trait in under the wire, Defender. It gives +15% combat and withdrawal rate to units while they are in their own lands. I gave the trait to the 2 Elohim leaders and Amelanchier.

 

[Chalid]

How about giving +20% cultural defense also (maybe for later)

 

[Brancaleone]

In my opnion

+Aggressive+Arcane+Creative+Defender+Expansive+Financial+Industrious+Organized+Magic Resistant+Philosophical+Raiders+Spiritual
Those are ok, and some seems very fun to use:

+Agnostic+Barbarian+Scorched Earth (Loki)
For negative, i think those are fine. If some leaders are so strong they need a negative trait, then those are ok.

+Hidden
Most original!

+Scorched Earth (Loki)
Seems overpowered! I use alot of summoners and mages, man three demon summoners leading 9 of those great demons is scary! Add a bunch of other summoners in there and some crap units to garrison cities and you can take over the world without receiving any xp..

Damn i cant wait to play this..

 

[Kael]

In my opnion

+Aggressive+Arcane+Creative+Defender+Expansive+Financial+Industrious+Organized+Magic Resistant+Philosophical+Raiders+Spiritual
Those are ok, and some seems very fun to use:

+Agnostic+Barbarian+Scorched Earth (Loki)
For negative, i think those are fine. If some leaders are so strong they need a negative trait, then those are ok.

+Hidden
Most original!

+Scorched Earth (Loki)
Seems overpowered! I use alot of summoners and mages, man three demon summoners leading 9 of those great demons is scary! Add a bunch of other summoners in there and some crap units to garrison cities and you can take over the world without receiving any xp..

Damn i cant wait to play this..

Keep in mind that we dont balance specific aspects, only the civ as a whole. The Summoner trait will probably stay on the Sheaim (though if it is to powerful they will be handicaped in other ways). And if its to powerful it may be removed from Thessa.

So we have no desire to make sure that Summoner is equal in power to Aggresive, only that the civs as a whole are relativly equal in power in power to each other.

 

[Brancaleone]

Just now i noticed you changed the Arcane Trait.. It was my favourite, now its pretty useless... Mages usually dont fight, their spells do, since they have strengh 3 or 4! The 1.0 Arcane gave them a very usefull spell extention, now, when are mages supposed to get that extra xp? From the weakened enemies their spells dont manage to kill? Not fun.. Arcane wasnt overpowered, but i really like mages, and being able to hit enemies one square further away was very usefull.. I played a quick game and couldnt use the Arcane trait bonus more than two or three times.. in the end game, units move in mass, its hard to pick one weak enemy alone to level up your mage.

I propose you change arcane back to the way it was! Or teach me to do it, at least..

 

[Brancaleone]

Also, "Raiders" is sweet!

"Philosofical" seems very good, but when i used it in 1.0 it didnt changed the upkeep of education civics, does it now?

"Industrious" dosent seem atractive, dont you think it would be better to use that popular industrial trait seen in several mods? (+1 hammer on squares with at least 3 hammers).

Just my two cents