Designing Persia in Civ7

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

Designing the empire that's amongs the first to ride horses. I'd like them to be horse intensive empire. This time Not just Classical Persia, Islamic Persia should also be presented.
Unique Units:
- Aswarun (The FIRST Truly mounted Heavy Cavalry, also the first to be referred to as Fully Armored 'Cataphracts' (Civ series often have peculiar problems representing Cataphracts as Byzantine Knights or Horsemen while in truth this unit exists much earlier).
This unit is better represent Persia than Fxis's favorite--The Immortals. Since they were amongs the first to master horsemanship. They were also the first to discover the ways to breed horses big enough to support big men in heavy metal armor and even their own armored bardings. They were created by the Sassanids, and survived past the Islamic Conquests and even some did join Arabians for a time being.
Unique Infrastructure: Paradise Garden (can't remember Farsi name), one of a few pre-islamic Persian inventions survived and preserved by Muslim leaders that came after.
- Jazayerchis: (Islamic leader only only). Either a kind of Pike and Shot or Fusiliers. (came from Humankind)

Leader: (I'm not really keen on Persian much, but one for Pre-islamic, and the other for Gunpowder Islamic).

 

[Zaarin]

I don't mind combining Achaemenid and Sassanian Persia into a single civ, but I don't think combining Sassanian and post-Islamic Persia into a single civ works. At any rate, thinking realistically, we will never get a non-Achaemenid Persia so just give me Darius the Great back with a mix of expansionism and culture.

Wishful thinking:

Leader: Shahpur II: Brother of the Sun and Moon: Followers of your state religion in your cities generate +1 Culture and Faith; followers of foreign religions in your cities generate +1 Science and +1 Gold.
Civ Ability: Satrapies: Expansion causes less instability, however that is mechanically handled, and your cities are automatically connected by roads.
Unique Building: Atashgah: Replaces the Temple; produces additional Culture and promotes cultural spread.
Unique Unit: Aswaran: Replaces Heavy Cavalry.

 

[Saint Leibowitz]

Shah Ismail I, founder of the Safavid Dynasty, could be a great option for Islamic Persia. Converted the kingdom to Twelver Shi'ism and was a very influential poet. His ability should be called Khata'i, his pen name. It would cause Great Works of Writing to increase Culture and Faith of the cities they are stationed in by a certain percentage.

Jazayerchis are interesting but would most logically belong to Nader Shah. He'd also be a cool option with a strong aggressive military focus. IDK as much about him besides that he was a major conqueror though.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I know it's probably an unpopular opinion but I personally don't mind Achaemenid Persia keep on returning.

Though I also wouldn't say no to a non-Achaemenid leader either.

That being said I'd like Cyrus again but hopefully they can portray him as the tolerant ruler that he was.

Unique Ability: Satraps- Cities with governors established gain more gold per citizen in their city.

The Immortal is a staple and I liked their implementation in Civ 6. I'd like to keep them as infantry but also can be ranged when attacking.

Unique Infrastructure: Bazaar (either a Commerical Hub replacement or Market)- International trade routes provide more culture to your civ while the other civ receives more gold.

 

[Zaarin]

That being said I'd like Cyrus again but hopefully they can portray him as the tolerant ruler that he was.

Next time we see Darius the Great, I hope he talks more like his inscriptions: "Welcome to Persia. I am Darius, shahanshah. I am very honest! Please, enjoy your stay in my land that is so safe a virgin could travel alone with a basket of gold from one end of my empire to the other and not be harmed, and do not worry that I might murder you and usurp your throne. Did I mention that I am very honest? I am very, very honest."

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

Unique Unit: Aswaran: Replaces Heavy Cavalry.

Eh? generic 'heavy horseman' variants will be called just 'Heavy Cavalry' and later upgraded to Knights? and not 'Cataphracts'?
Don't let F'xis fools you. Cataphracts are more generic than Old Byzantium. everyone else apart of Persians and Byzantines use them in significant numbers too! even Chinese in 'Three Kingdoms' era were saw some uses of cataphracts.

 

[Zaarin]

Eh? generic 'heavy horseman' variants will be called just 'Heavy Cavalry' and later upgraded to Knights? and not 'Cataphracts'?
Don't let F'xis fools you. Cataphracts are more generic than Old Byzantium. everyone else apart of Persians and Byzantines use them in significant numbers too! even Chinese in 'Three Kingdoms' era were saw some uses of cataphracts.

I was not trying to make any kind of political statement with my word choice.

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

^ Then do you really think 'Cataphracts' should be generic heavy cavalry unit of the Classical Era? (Between heavy chariots and knights)

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

^ Then do you really think 'Cataphracts' should be generic heavy cavalry unit of the Classical Era? (Between heavy chariots and knights)

I think if Civ retains the Heavy and Light Cav split, and we get one unit per class every era, then yes I think Cataphracts should be that.

 

[Zaarin]

^ Then do you really think 'Cataphracts' should be generic heavy cavalry unit of the Classical Era? (Between heavy chariots and knights)

I think if Civ retains the Heavy and Light Cav split, and we get one unit per class every era, then yes I think Cataphracts should be that.

Yeah, Cataphracts would make sense as a generic Classical heavy cavalry as the idea was, as you said, quite widespread.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

Yeah, Cataphracts would make sense as a generic Classical heavy cavalry as the idea was, as you said, quite widespread.

Get them right, though: Cataphracts were the most expensive thing you could do with a horse and rider. Not only did you have to manufacture armor for both horse and man, and give man and horse lots and lots of time to train in armor and with weapons like sword and lance, but you also had to breed and feed horses sturdy enough to carry man and armor.
All of that meant that Cataphracts were always a very small percentage of any army: even armies largely of horsemen never seem to have managed to put more than 10% of the cavalry in cataphract-style armor and equipment, and 'settled' empires had even more problems: Rome had a dozen or so Auxiliary cataphractoi units, or about 5 - 7000 men out of 500,000, and the Tang Dynasty's elite shock force was 1000 cataphracts (with bow as well as lance) out of armies of 50,000 - 80,000 total.

That means, if Cataphracts are the 'generic' Classical Heavy Cavalry, the vast bulk of classical cavalry will be 'Light' and cover a wide range from unarmored horse archers and javelin-armed types to close-order cavalry with javelins, swords, lances, heavy spears, and body armor and shields. That's a pretty wide range of attributes to cram into Light Cavalry.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

That means, if Cataphracts are the 'generic' Classical Heavy Cavalry, the vast bulk of classical cavalry will be 'Light' and cover a wide range from unarmored horse archers and javelin-armed types to close-order cavalry with javelins, swords, lances, heavy spears, and body armor and shields. That's a pretty wide range of attributes to cram into Light Cavalry.

I would assume the generic light cavalry would be the Horseman unit that we've always gotten.

Maybe ranged cavalry could be a different class altogether, or just be uniques for certain civs like Mongolia, tribal/minor factions etc.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

I would assume the generic light cavalry would be the Horseman unit that we've always gotten.

Maybe ranged cavalry could be a different class altogether, or just be uniques for certain civs like Mongolia, tribal/minor factions etc.

What would work, possibly, would be to have "Light Cavalry" in Classical Era refer to the unarmored or partially-armored horsemen who tried to close with the enemy - charge and melee types more lightly armored than Cataphractii. Then an even lighter type would be Ranged Horsemen, but these would all be 'specialized': horse archers you can only get by hiring them from Barbarian groups or expert javelin-thowing light cavalry like the Numidians that you could get from a military City State like Cirta.

 

[Lord Lakely]

K, time to tackle the Persians next.

Disclaimer: In case you missed my posts in the French thread, I've been theorycrafting my perfect Civ7 for a few years now, but with its own set of rules. The design i'm about to post here is an adaptation of Lord Lakely's Civilization VII so that it can fit Sid Meier's Civilization VII.

I have two designs for Persia, but only one of them made the base game, which is the one I'll share right now (if adapted so it fits the Civ 6 core rules for better understanding.) The design I'm leaving out is Iran, an islamic Persia led by Abbas I.

*pretend the rest of this post is read out by Sarah*

Mirthidates I leads Persia in Sid Meier's Civilization VII.

He was the ruler of Parthia in the first centure BCE, and under his rule Parthia became the superpower of the area, reclaiming the middle east for the Persians. A patron of the arts, as well as a conquerer, Mirthidates admired Greek Culture, earning him the epithet "Lover of the Greeks".

Parthia is a militaristic civilization. Their unique ability, Parthian Shot, allows all of their ranged units and cavalry units to move after attacking. If a Parthian ranged unit kills another unit as their first action in a turn, they recoup all spent movement points. Parthian Shot also doubles the flanking bonuses of melee units against wounded opponents, allowing them to finish off surrounded enemies more quickly.

Parthia can also use the Zradha Shirvatir, or Armored Horse Archer for their hit and run tactics. This ranged cavalry unlocks at Horseback Riding, has a base speed of three and a combat strength of 27. When enemies attack a Zradha Shirvatir, they suffer a -6 attack penalty. It is less mobile than a standard Cavalry unit however, so be careful for enemy Horsemen who can outrun and flank you.

Mirthidates is a thoughtful leader who likes to build strong friendships with those he respects. His unique ability, Khvarenah, grants +2 Era score each time he meets a new Civilization. The first time Mithridates signs a declaration of Friendship with another player he and his new friend receive a Governor Title. Furthermore, each time a deal expires*, Mirthidates and his partner receive a random Eureka or Inspiration. If the deal was an Alliance, this is increased to three Eureka's/Inspirations each.

The Qanat is the unique building for the Parthian Civilization. This Granary replacement increases Food by +5% and Housing by +1 for each unique Bonus resource worked by the City. It requires access to Fresh water however, either directly or via an Aqueduct.

For Parthia building Friendships and alliances is important, as these grant them the technological benefits they otherwise would not have access to. Use the Qanat to grow your cities, and the Zradha Shirvatir to defend them. However, should you find yourself surrounded by enemies instead, take advantage your Parthian Shot ability to rain hell on those who denied your kingly glory.

Will you be able to distinguish between friend and foe? How will you play Parthia in Sid Meier's Civilization VII?

Sigil & Cities

Sigil
Parthia's sigil is a peach Simurgh on a dark lilac background. Their alternative colours are gold and dark magenta.



City List

because Mithridates loved Greek culture so much, Parthia's city list uses the Greek names for their core cities, as opposed to the indigenous Parthian names.

Capital: Ctesiphon
Other Cities: Susa, Mithridakirt, Ecbatana, Rhages, Hecatompylos, Zariaspa, Marakanda, Hatra, Haraiva, Zranka, Arbela, Zadracarta, Aspadana, Arsacia, Estakhr, Seleucia, Dura-Europos, Nisibis, Samosata, Patigrabana, Dara, Vologocerta, Margiana, Drapsaka, Gaugamela, Syrinx, Semnan, Sanabad, Tirrazis, Apamea, Shad Shapur, Astarabad, Sistan, Nishapur, Carrhae, Arg-e-Bam, Charax, Khoy, Quchan, Amul & Bagistana.


Persia was, in all its forms, a militaristic civilization held together by meticilous administration, shrewd diplomacy and intricate social engineering. Whatever its abilities are in Civ7, they should reflect these parametres.

 

[mitsho]

The first thing that comes to mind for Persia is culture and cities. They have a imperial feel, no matter the time period you look at them, and that needs to be reflected in the design.

Persia is also a good example again why a dynamic civ design makes sense: they have a range of leaders that can take them in any different direction, from expansionist empire to flourishing centre of religion and arts to a bustling merchant hub - the word bazaar is literally Persian after all. So yeah, ideally, my Persian civ would encompass the Achaemenids, the Parthians, the Sassanids, the Safvavids up to the Islamic Revolution. Maybe the Parthians fit better as one of the minor civs wandering around the map and causing trouble, but you get the idea.

 

[Zaarin]

Mirthidates I

I'm very open to a separate Parthian civ and might accept an Arsacid alt leader for Persia, but I really don't like Parthia being the Persian civ. It lacks the splendor of either the Achaemenids or the Sassanids. Also please no to another Hellenophile.

 

[Lord Lakely]

I'm very open to a separate Parthian civ and might accept an Arsacid alt leader for Persia, but I really don't like Parthia being the Persian civ. It lacks the splendor of either the Achaemenids or the Sassanids. Also please no to another Hellenophile.

"Hmm, I wonder how many more Hellenes we can stuff into Civ 7? Hmm. Maybe I should just go for Cleopatra again." he thought, absent-mindedly scratching the scruff on his chin.

But if you insist, how about we throw in an Alt leader? Or well, an "actual Persian Civ". (although the Arcasids were Persians and would and should count)

but no Achaemenids on my end. Have them sit out a game, that's fine with me. I would happily welcome the Sassanids, but it's the Safavids that caught my interest.

Abbas I leads Iran in Sid Meier's Civilization VII.

He was the greatest Shah of Persia's Islamic Safavid dynasty and one of the greatest conquerors of his time. A ruthless and efficient ruler, Abbas's reign marks the zenith of Iran's power across the ages. He later became known as the Shadow of God.

Persia's unique ability, Satrapeha, provides their cities with +1 Amenities and +2 Culture for each unit stationed in the city centre or on top of a completed district. Their Governors also provide their cities with +5% gold for each promotion they have earned.

Abbas was a great conqueror. His ability, Ghulam, grants him a free military unit the first time he conquers any city founded by another major power. All of Abbas's units gain +4 Combat Strengh when fighting in Districts or Forts.

The Zamburak is Iran's unique unit, replacing the Cuirassier. This Camel unit unlocks at Gunpowder and has a ranged attack that can hit adjacent enemies. Additionally, enemy Cavalry units units suffer a -5 Combat penalty when they're adjacent to a Zamburak.

Iran's unique tile improvement is the Pairidaeza. These imperial menageries provide +2 Culture and +2 Gold for every adjacent animal resource, increase appeal to adjacent tiles and provide a generic adjacency bonus to nearby districts. They unlock at Early Empire and only one may be built for each completed district in a city.

As Iran, you will want to prioritize building as many districts in your cities as possible, as these will gain additional yields from the Pairidaeza and will help you defend early on. Later, you'll want to conquer, filling your army with more troops. Remember that Iran's Governors provide gold for your treasury, allowing Abbas to support a large and healthy army. Iran is a powerful Domination Civ, but can try their hand at a Culture game as well.

Will you cast a shadow over those beneath you? How will you play Iran, in Sid Meier's Civilization VII

Sigil and Cities
Sigil
This Iran's Sigil is, naturally, the Lion and Sun they've used from the 11th Century well into the 20th century: Gold on Dark Green, as per their flag. Alt colours of Gold and Red seemed appropriate here, as that combination has been used before, in Civilization V.





City list

Capital: Isfahan
Other Cities: Tabriz, Shiraz, Tehran, Ardabil, Qazvin, Teflis, Ray, Mashhad, Yazd, Qom, Derbent, Herat, Merv, Hamadan, Soltaniyeh, Kerman, Bandar Abbas, Zaranj, Ormuz, Baku, Nishapur, Sari, Damghan, Maragheh, Astarabad, Shushtar, Kermanshah, Urmia, Bandar Bushehr, Birjand, Semnan, Zahedan, Lar, , Rasht, Zanjan, Khoy, Firouzabad & Bojnord.

Someone else is welcome to try the Sassanids while i go on to terrorize the other threads in this subforum with my presence. <3

 

[Zaarin]

But if you insist, how about we throw in an Alt leader? Or well, an "actual Persian Civ". (although the Arcasids were Persians and would and should count)

Like I said, I don't mind an Arsacid being a Persian leader as long as they're not the Persian leader; give me Shapur II or Khosrow I and I'm quite happy.

I really like your Iran design, but the Classical Persian form of Avestan Pairidāeza is Pālēz (modern Farsi Pâlîz) or Pardēs (Farsi, Pardīs).

 

[Saint Leibowitz]

Ooh, a really epic option from the Sassanid era could be Shapur the Great. A truly terrible neighbor to have.

Ability: Bane of Rome - Gains double gold from pillaging enemy improvements near Persian borders and gains an offensive combat bonus against civs who found cities near Persian borders. Workers captured by Shapur build improvements faster.

 

[Zaarin]

Ooh, a really epic option from the Sassanid era could be Shapur the Great. A truly terrible neighbor to have.

Ability: Bane of Rome - Gains double gold from pillaging enemy improvements near Persian borders and gains an offensive combat bonus against civs who found cities near Persian borders. Workers captured by Shapur build improvements faster.

I'd rather see Shapur II, or Shapur the Great, included for monumental buildings and his canonization of Zoroastrian scripture and codification of Zoroastrian orthodoxy (despite dabbling in heterodoxy himself).