destroyers
- Thread starter mardukes
- Start date
funxus
Orange Cycloptic Blob
They're the fastest naval unit in the game, so they're good for exploring. They are also good for sinking old enemy ships like triremes and caravels. I'd rather question the submarine...
cameramano
Television Cameraman
Ok... don't have one stacked with your bb/crusier/carrier. Just don't blame me when you park next to a random submarine.
stacked ships! I had a BB once. A carrier once, too. Swiped a cruiser in a recent game and got a giggle out of Leo improving it to Aegis class. With all the bombers & fighters I'm sending down their throats I don't think the ai has time to build subs.
Terrapin
Prince
- Joined
- Apr 15, 2003
- Messages
- 505
Destroyers are great for sinking unprotected transports. The ai does not use ship chains, so you can often send whole shiploads of bad guys to Davey Jones' Locker using these swift, cheap vessels.
The units I do not use are bombers/stealth bombers. These things are basically glorified cruise missiles. If your enemies are even close to your tech level, you fly your really expensive bomber up to a city, kill one cheap ground unit (if you are lucky) and then have the bomber shot out of the sky by a cheap fighter. Or just have the bomber immediately shot down by a scrambled fighter. The fact that the bombers, damaged by their attack, have to sit there in the sky above their former target virtually ensures their destruction. If you are so far ahead on tech that you have bombers and the AI's do not have flight, then there are much cheaper ways of beating them up than with an air war!
The units I do not use are bombers/stealth bombers. These things are basically glorified cruise missiles. If your enemies are even close to your tech level, you fly your really expensive bomber up to a city, kill one cheap ground unit (if you are lucky) and then have the bomber shot out of the sky by a cheap fighter. Or just have the bomber immediately shot down by a scrambled fighter. The fact that the bombers, damaged by their attack, have to sit there in the sky above their former target virtually ensures their destruction. If you are so far ahead on tech that you have bombers and the AI's do not have flight, then there are much cheaper ways of beating them up than with an air war!
Old n Slow
Emperor
I ususally squeeze out 2-3 destroyers in a game to look over the waters & see the world. On occaision, they may sink enemy boats, smack light stuff near the shore (like cannons, barb leaders, etc.); just as often, they provide early warning regarding enemy naval intentions.
If my tech is screaming along, I'll wait for a few turns & crank out a couple of cruisers for the same job.
If my tech is screaming along, I'll wait for a few turns & crank out a couple of cruisers for the same job.
Please elaborate. How do you get around the unhappiness of units traveling around (fighters are always at home.) How do you get around being sued for peace every time you enter the neighborhood? I would love to find something better than 3 bombers and around 8 fighters, stroll in with any horsed piece and buy up a couple of partisans as garrison--that's the point of the game I always fall behind.
Terrapin
Prince
- Joined
- Apr 15, 2003
- Messages
- 505
Unhappiness: If the units are based in a city w/Shakespeares OR in a small city (Size 4) with Women's Sufferage plus Bachs, those units never create unhappiness. A size 4 city can be set up with stable food (0 surplus) and enough shield production to support 10+ units!
Also as a democracy at war, you can crank up the luxuries to balance some unhappy citizens with happy citizens. If you have MPs and Banks, in a large city with good trade routes, the effect will be quite large, an advantage seemingly overlooked by the "build no improvements" bloc.
Sued for peace: Use Alpine troops or spys/dips (or explorers for that matter) to clog up all the squares in the city radius before taking the city. You can empty the garrisons first. There is a more complex trick involving diplomacy and the UN which apparently prevents the suit for peace, but I have never done it.
Also as a democracy at war, you can crank up the luxuries to balance some unhappy citizens with happy citizens. If you have MPs and Banks, in a large city with good trade routes, the effect will be quite large, an advantage seemingly overlooked by the "build no improvements" bloc.
Sued for peace: Use Alpine troops or spys/dips (or explorers for that matter) to clog up all the squares in the city radius before taking the city. You can empty the garrisons first. There is a more complex trick involving diplomacy and the UN which apparently prevents the suit for peace, but I have never done it.
funxus
Orange Cycloptic Blob
Vet. stealth fighters don't cause unhappiness, they are pretty cheap, and they can (unless armed with vet mech infs) take out the units in a city in just one turn. Bombers, though better at taking out the target, always cause unhappiness and can only attack once in a turn. So, as long as you have a base close to your enemy (a bribed city maybe), it's easy to take out the surrounding cities with stealth fighters and either fast moving land units or paratroopers to capture the city. If you have the money though, bribing all cities is probably the easiest solution.
Originally posted by funxus
Vet. stealth fighters don't cause unhappiness, they are pretty cheap, and they can (unless armed with vet mech infs) take out the units in a city in just one turn. Bombers, though better at taking out the target, always cause unhappiness and can only attack once in a turn. So, as long as you have a base close to your enemy (a bribed city maybe), it's easy to take out the surrounding cities with stealth fighters and either fast moving land units or paratroopers to capture the city. If you have the money though, bribing all cities is probably the easiest solution.
But stealth is way down the road from advanced flight.
and RE: clogging with dips above, I'm sure I've had spies coming in contact with the ai allow him to request a meeting.
Archer 007
Rebirth
You can change your title after 30 posts. So you could be a Blob today? Or just make it whatever you want.
funxus
Orange Cycloptic Blob
Check your USER CP, Edit Profile, and then write a new title in the Custom User Text textbox.
I think what I actually wanted to say was that if you have a gov that is sensitive to unhappiness, wait with your airforce until you have stealth. That late in game you shouldn't have to wait more than a few turns before you get it. In my opinion, massive airstrikes aren't worth it before stealth.
Terrapin
Prince
- Joined
- Apr 15, 2003
- Messages
- 505
I think you misunderstand. Using the spies to clog the squares in the city radius prevents partisans from appearing when you take the city, which happens after the conquest of any city of a civ which has invented communism. What often happens is that you take one city, the partisans show up and you immediately get "offered" a peace which you do not want, but the Senate insists on...
Cactus_Jack
Lefty Nutter
I never buy any ships untill i can get a battleship. I produce 10 od them and i rain terror on the seas on the AI. When the computer gets cruises missles the funs over though 
la fayette
King
Bombers and battleships are fun, but when it comes to talking seriously about conquest in modern times, any experienced player will tell you: "howies + engineers + vet spies".
GenShwartzCough
General of the Newbies
Ok....count me among the inexperienced...why Engineers?
Pre-charged engineers can build forts, airbases or extra links to RR networks in a single turn, or land on a beach and create an instant coastal city, which allows fully laden transports to unload right onto the RR network. A continent of dozens of cities can be taken down in a single turn.
Marlos
Christian Soldier
Back to the original topic, destroyers have their purposes and unique advantages. They can see further than other ships of the same time period, they are faster, and they can see submarines. I don't think that I build too many of them, though, because Leonardo's upgrades ironclads to them.
Mardukes, that is interesting, that Leonardo's upgrades cruisers to AEGIS cruisers. I don't believe that in any of the bazillion games that I have played that I have seen that happen.
Engineers are a primary part of any strike force that I utilize. Quick railroads, fortresses, you have to have them. If I am overextended militarily, I will have an engineer or two convert the city square of a city on "the front" to forest and up the defense bonus until I can compensate.
Mardukes, that is interesting, that Leonardo's upgrades cruisers to AEGIS cruisers. I don't believe that in any of the bazillion games that I have played that I have seen that happen.
Engineers are a primary part of any strike force that I utilize. Quick railroads, fortresses, you have to have them. If I am overextended militarily, I will have an engineer or two convert the city square of a city on "the front" to forest and up the defense bonus until I can compensate.
Cruisers come with Steel, while AEGIS comes with Rocketry. Leos dies at Auto, which is not technically a precursor tech to Rocketry, so it can be reached by bypassing Auto. Most of us bee-line to Auto after RR/Ind/Corp in order to goose up our SSC with SuperHighways, accepting the death of Leos as collateral. To get Flight (percursor to Rocketry), which kills Colossus, without getting Auto (for SuperHighways) or Computers (for ResearchLab) seems like folly but could be a valid strategy if you were playing Bloodlust. Make the most of Leos, if you got it.
