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DG4 Proposal: History Dept

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Demo Game III: Citizens' started by FortyJ, Oct 24, 2003.

  1. FortyJ

    FortyJ Deity

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    Cyc and I have come up with an interesting idea for DG4: a sort of Creative History Department, which would chronicle the happenings of our nation and her people. The Department would consist of two threads: the story thread and the office thread.

    The Story Thread would contain the actual history as told by her citizens. It would be written in a manner similar to the Civ3 Never Ending Stories, with a few rules to help preserve the integrity of the tale (see below).

    The Office Thread would contain the rules for the Story and would also be used by individuals to "check out" the story for a short time so they could write a chapter without concern that someone would insert a chapter before they could post all of their hard work. It would also contain a list and bio of the key NPCs used throughout the tale to assist others in writing new chapters.

    At this point, Cyc and I have agreed to head up this department if there is sufficient intnerest to warrant its creation. As department heads, we are also accepting applications for staff positions within the department. Just so you know, staffers would be responsible for helping the department heads with the overall maintenance of the story (adding/updating NPC bio information, flagging chapters that violate the story rules for deletion, etc.)

    Story Rules (subject to change)
    1. Story content must be consistent with the state of the actual game (ie. no airplanes before the discovery of flight, etc.) Flashbacks and historical interludes are permitted.
    2. No consecutive postings by the same individual.

    Comments appreciated. Applicants/Volunteers welcome.
     
  2. FionnMcCumhall

    FionnMcCumhall Emperor

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    this would be killer to be overseen by the culture department, as it would give culture more to do, if not its still a killer idea considering we havent had a history department in a long time
     
  3. FortyJ

    FortyJ Deity

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    An excellent suggestion, but I personally believe that for this undertaking to be successful, the project leaders should not be subject to elections. Otherwise, the entire project risks losing continuity.
     
  4. Cyc

    Cyc Looking for the door...

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    Thank you Fionn. I firmly believe the Culture Dept. has been nullified. People don't want it. Cultural Leaders have been lacking. Therefore I don't see its revival.

    A History Department, on the other hand could come on board as an Office of the Government without being attached to any particular Department. It wouldn't have any elected officials responsible to the public. It's main contributors would be the Citizens of the new world.

    FortyJ and I could head the Creative History Department, as he said, plus bring on Staff to help with it's creation and maintenance. It will be difficult to provide a Never Ending Story line that runs parallel to the game, but that will be our main objective. Creative History.

    As 40J said all comments are welcome. All applicants should PM 40J or myself.
     
  5. TerminalMan90

    TerminalMan90 Citizen @ Large

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    I think this is a great idea. I haven't been here too long, so I cannot vouch for how well the office will work.

    I do think it will be a great starting place for new players to read up on what has been happening in the game. It will all be in one place. It will also allow people with limited participation time the ability to contribute to the character of the game without coming to the turn chat or taking on the mayorial responsibilities.

    I would suggest that the Office thread should maintain a History Milestone Index or TimeLine post. This would be a great resource for finding posts at a particular era of the game. The timeline should show both dates and events so we can quickly locate and jump to each creative history events.

    It would also be nice if creative history participants could link to actual game discussion thread or even turnchat logs for corraboration or additional background. A touchstone to 'reality' as it were. These links would be optional, not compulsary, but should be encouraged by the Office thread.

    I would like to volunteer for maintaining the Timeline post/thread.
     
  6. GenMarshall

    GenMarshall Blood Elven Ghost Agent

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    I would like to Apply to the ofice :).

    My experiance includes Partisipating in various NES games and the Draw your own story thread :). Not to worry, Ill make sure the contex of the stories will remain within the tech limits of the game.
     
  7. ravensfire

    ravensfire Member of the Opposition

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    I absolutely agree. I've proposed, and will continue to do so, that all citizen offices be under a specific leader, so if the jobs not getting done, we know where to go. The membership, however, is not elected in any way. Members should only be removed for non-performance.

    -- Ravensfire
     
  8. donsig

    donsig Low level intermediary

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    I don't see the purpose of this thread. No one is going to say it's a bad idea. We don't need any rules made up for it. Just do it.
     
  9. donsig

    donsig Low level intermediary

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    Sorry, Ravensfire, but I do not see the need for this. This is simply a beaurucratic office. It has no political power, i.e., it has no authority to make any game play decisions. Since it cannot directly impact the Civ III game play I do not see a pressing need to make rules here. this is exactly the sort of thing that would fall under the *procedures* level of a multi-level ruleset. Just let someone (the president or domestic leader or whoever) appoint the people needed. These people would work for that person who could hire and fire at will. Don't even get into issues of non-performance or confirmation polls ar anything like that. Just do it.
     
  10. Donovan Zoi

    Donovan Zoi The Return

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    @FortyJ and Cyc - this is great news! :D I am glad to see that two of the DemoGame's finest storytellers will be banding together for this effort. It's little things like this that will hopefully make DG4 the greatest one since the original.

    As far as I'm concerned, these "extracurricular" offices should not be subject to elections, and should be run by any citizen who has a strong passion for the role. I hope that there is similar interest for our Cartographic Office, Election Office and Census Office. Am I missing any?

    Also, I feel that we could go either way on who "controls" an office. We could designate the office to an appropriate government department, or we can give power to the moderators. It doesn't matter to me how we do this, as long as we document it in the procedure section of our ruleset.
     
  11. Sarevok

    Sarevok Civ3 Scenario Creator

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  12. GenMarshall

    GenMarshall Blood Elven Ghost Agent

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    There is the Chat Office ;)
     
  13. Sarevok

    Sarevok Civ3 Scenario Creator

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    you know i didnt even know there was a cultural dept. mabye because they had just about nothing to do.
     
  14. FortyJ

    FortyJ Deity

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    Donsig...

    While I certainly didn't hope to find any posts reflecting someone's disapproval of this idea, seeking approval was, in actuality, a small part of the overall purpose of this thread.

    Ideally, we would receive some volunteers to assist with the maintenance of the thread and perhaps even a few ideas on what features to include. Discussion at this time may make for a smoother startup of this office once DG4 launches. It also may inspire some citizens to think of characters, stories and more that they wish to include in the tale - essentially, getting the creative juices flowing.

    Finally, I've also read some of your concerns with respect to this office crowding out the need for a newspaper service like the one you published during DG2. I believe that these two offices will be different enough that they could both flourish in DG4. I certainly did not intend to discourage your participation.
     
  15. Donovan Zoi

    Donovan Zoi The Return

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    Forty, I think that donsig's disapproval was aimed more toward government sponsorship of your office than the office itself. And I too believe that both yours and donsig's endeavors could stand side by side. IIRC, donsig's journal was very stats intensive, while the History Dept seems like it would act somewhat like an RPG.

    Which brings me to my next question. With something like this in our Government Forum, is there really a need for an RPG like we had in DG2? I plan on bringing up a full discussion on the future of the RPG shortly, but it wouldn't hurt to get opinions on that now.
     
  16. FortyJ

    FortyJ Deity

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    DZ...
    That is precisely how I see the office in DG4 - a sort of free-form Role-playing / story-telling that is loosely constrained to the events that actually take place in the playing of the game.

    While I see it as a form of role-playing, I don't think it will be broad enough to encompass the entirety of the RPG. Furthermore, I don't think the "need" for the RPG is as critical to its survival as the desire of somebody to run the thing. Managing the RPG is a highly time-intensive responsibility. In answer to your question, I believe the RPG should exist as long as there is an individual (or individuals) willing to run it.
     
  17. Cyc

    Cyc Looking for the door...

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    I can see the point in your question DZ, and it's a good question. I'm not sure the Creative History Dept. (CHD) will be able to satisfy all the needs of potential RPG goers. FortyJ and I will not have the time or room to run an RPG, as he mentioned the maintenance of one is the greatest factor in its success.

    I do like the comment you brought up about Mayors in City threads, tho, in Stuck's RPG discussion.
     
  18. DaveShack

    DaveShack Inventor Retired Moderator

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    During DG3 I saw a couple of people complaining about not being able to perform these optional, creative duties because they had not been appointed to the task. Being a relative newcomer and not terribly creative (at least in that way :) ) I decided not to say anything, but now that we're in-between games here it is.

    You don't need an official appointment to make a map, write a story, or contribute in any other way you want. The only thing to be concerned with is stepping on each other's toes -- post a "got it" to let the other team members know you're working on an idea, and go for it!
     
  19. FortyJ

    FortyJ Deity

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    An excellent observation DaveShack. I think that part of the problem has been that in previous DGs, the Cartographic Office (which is likely the most visible of the non-elected offices) was always placed under the jurisdiction of the Domestic Department.

    Of course, I imagine (and this idea might have to be fleshed out a bit) that the "got it" posts would be optional, but failure to do so would jeopardize your chances of getting your chapter next in line. Of course, failing to observe a "got it" post, would be severely frowned upon.

    Also, the duration of the "got it" needs to be worked out as well. Reserving a spot for an entire day might ensure that person enough time to draft up a nice little post, but would not allow for many posts in between turn chats - and a lot can happen between turn chats.

    Finally, I think we're going to need to address the issue of killing off characters. Obviously, I don't think citizens should be killed off in the story without permission from the soon-to-be-deceased citizen himself/herself. Additionally, we should come up with a way to deal with NPCs. Certainly, some of them can be sacrificed for the good of the overall tale, but how should this be managed to prevent a blood feud of sorts between rival authors?
     
  20. Cyc

    Cyc Looking for the door...

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    quoting DS:
    You don't need an official appointment to make a map, write a story, or contribute in any other way you want. The only thing to be concerned with is stepping on each other's toes -- post a "got it" to let the other team members know you're working on an idea, and go for it!
    _____________________________________________

    :) Hey Dave. I'm not sure if you were referring to me in that comment, but if you were, let me clear something up. There was an official office for the History Dept., and people jumped at the idea of controlling it. So much so that a poll had to be done. You know as well as I do, the winners of the poll didn't do anything, so had I stepped in, I would have been filling an official void unofficially. I kind of think that would be stepping on people's toes. And btw, this thread can be considered a big "Got It". ;)
     

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