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DG6 Discussion: I want to help the newbies

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Demo Game V: Citizens' started by Crimso, Jan 17, 2005.

  1. Crimso

    Crimso ...aaaaaagh!

    Joined:
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    Hello all!

    Well, now that it is over, I can honestly say that DGV, my first, was a pleasurable experience. Joining right after the Roman conquest, I quickly found myself interested in the game, and wanted to participate. Not knowing a single citizen prior, I did the only thing I could and posted many many times. I was trying to get noticed, and eventually, I did get noticed. To those who acknowledged me, I thank you.

    For the first few weeks I was completley lost in the DG. Maps were hard to come by; TCs were at bad times for me and the logs were no help; the CoL and the Constitution were overly long and totally uninteresting to someone who had just joined and didn't take the game that seriously; history texts were brief and unspecific. Even more baffling were the relationships between the citizens: enemies openly attacked one-another over issues I didn't understand, citing past conflicts frequently and never settling their conflicts each other. Eventually I got over these problems, but those first few weeks were like riding a bumper car without any pedals or a steering wheel. I got tossed back and forth a few times before I was able to bump back and have fun. Believe it or not, it took me 2 weeks to recognize the discuss, poll, instruct DP style of decision making. Interest only grew after I got to know the game, and the citizens, a bit better.

    The same cannot be said for the overwhelming majority of newbies. Take a look at this thread, the citizen registry for DGV. Approx. 85% of the people who posted in that thread did not make another post in the DG forum ever again: I've been in many internet communities since 1999, and the reason that they die is because people leave, and new people don't join. The most terrible part about the DG community is that people are joining every single day, but not sticking around. To have 170 potential citizens lost in one DG is a tragedy. Every once and a while the forum will get someone like myself or Gres, who will take an interest and frankly won't shut up until they get noticed (keep it up dude!) but so many are overwhelmed on there first visit, or just don't find a reason to come back.

    To me, this is the biggest problem with the DG, and 4 weeks into DGV I decided that if I stayed until the end, I would try to do something about it in DGVI. I would like establish, with your help, a new initiative for getting more people in the DG. I recognize efforts like the newbies society/adoptation and the advertising thing, but those threads were already dead in my second week in game. I want there to be a permanent, frequently updated, informational, and PERSONAL place where newbies can get a great start in the game. I have a ton of ideas, and I want to get started as soon as possible.

    I would also be very interested in working in tandem with an adverstising committee. I want DGVI to start off with twice as many people as we have now, a goal I think is quite surpassable. There are many people here who have great passion for the DG, and it would go to great use in recruting new citizens. You grab 'em, we stick 'em!

    Right now, there are 215 lurkers on the board. At least 25% want to join the DG, I know it. If we make them aware, and lend them a helping hand, in 2 years they could be, heck, will be running DGIII for Civ4: that's how fast the Internet moves.

    Now, just a few ideas I was thinking of, I'll elaborate on some later. Some of it has been discussed in the past few weeks...

    - not mandatory, but definitly recommended that a new player be 'enrolled'
    - newbies will not be given any identifiable marks
    - a sort of 'tour' of the forums through chat
    - adoption, 'newbie buddies'
    - more information on the status of the game
    - condensed and/or explained in simplest terms CoL and Constitution
    - same explanations for anything else not plainly spelled out
    - interviews with veterens who will hold high positions in the first few terms
    - a history of the DG's, how they got to where they are now
    - chat 'parties'

    So, who thinks that more citizens will make the DG more fun?
    Who thinks that a more direct approach to recruitment and will make it happen?
    Who wants to make more buddies on the 'net?
    Who wants to help make it happen?
     
  2. Cyc

    Cyc Looking for the door...

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    Count me in, Crimso.
     
  3. Black_Hole

    Black_Hole Deity

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    Ill help, but I am not a veteran(been around since start of DG4)
     
  4. Octavian X

    Octavian X is not a pipe.

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    I'd be glad to help in any way I can. :)
     
  5. Strider

    Strider In Retrospect

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    As I've said before, it would be alot easier to get people in the game if half of our "new players look here" threads are actually new. This should be another goal for DGVI.

    Count me in BTW.
     
  6. Gres

    Gres Chieftain

    Joined:
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    LOL :lol:
    Um Alright?
    When I made my first post here I was encouraged to write what I thought... So thats what I have been doing :D

    Anyways, All sounds well Crimso. I agree something needs to be done. All that needs to be done is for someone to take an initiative. I see a lot of people say they are in but who has proposed how to start? :) (Other than Crimso, Obviously)

    I wouldn't mind heading this thing up with you Crimso. PM so we can set up a chat and talk about details? :)
     
  7. Black_Hole

    Black_Hole Deity

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    crimso you and gres never spammed :)

    In the citizen registry we should have a link to thread for inexperianced people(also we dont want to scare them away by calling them newbies or noobs), actually we currently have this however it was added part way through

    also we could have a list of veterans, that are avalible for help, listed in first post of the citizen registry
     
  8. Civanator

    Civanator Deity

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    Count me in. I've been in the DG from the beginning, and right now plan to be in till the end, if it ever ends ;). I'm on the forums almost every day, so I can help out the new players. I might try to get into the cfc chatroom more often so any new player can ask for help there.
     
  9. Crimso

    Crimso ...aaaaaagh!

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    Cyc, Black Hole, Octavian X, Strider, Gres and Civanator:

    Yes! Now I'm getting really excited. I'm glad that you're on board, and I invite your ideas and discussion.

    To anyone and everyone else:
    We want you. The DG needs you. Join us in reviving the DG. The more people who help out, the better, as long as we have organization. So...

    Firstly, I want to divide us up into the two groups I mentioned: Advertisers, and Guides. I would like the head up the Guides with two or three partners; there are those who are more interested, and talented, in spreading the news of DGVI through words and images to the rest of CFC than I, and I think that we should work closely together, but ultimately be separate establishments. So, for those who have expressed their interest in my proposal, I would be very grateful if you would announce which you would rather be, a Guide or an Advertiser. Eventually, the two groups will break off and perform their own duties, but for now I would like us to throw some ideas around, discuss, and whatever.

    To elaborate on some of the ideas I posted before...

    One of the least interesting things about the DG to new players are the CoL and the Constitution. I propose a sort of 'Cole's Notes' to these documents, simplified and basically dumbed down. We will encourage them to read these documents in their true form eventually, but interest in the DG comes from participation (I'm pretty sure), and we want people to start participating quickly, so they can have fun quickly and not get bored after a day.

    Along with this I would like to have basic explanations of how the game works: in DGV we had a discuss, poll, and instruct method of making decisions which I presume was in previous DGs and will continue for VI. A 50 word paragraph on this concept could mean a world of help. Also, basic descriptions of the different positions, their duties, and who currently holds that position would be a big help for newbies. Quite frankly, I would rather patronize new comers rather than have them make uninformed votes, or worse, leave because a lack of information.

    Just a small story: about a week into DGV I had very little knowledge of either the decision method nor the basic positions. Donsig posted a poll about military action and I voted assuming he was the 'General' or something. Provolution in fact held that position, and I felt quite embarrassed afterwards. But a week into the DG, it was hard to keep names and avatars straight. I don't want new players to make the same mistake.

    Another thing they might be interested in would be a history of the DGs. I couldn't possibly construct such a thing, but not only would it give basis and context for new players, I think many of us already involved would love to see a text following the evolution of this little experiment.

    This has been going around the forums as of late, picking up a lot of support. I would like to say that from a 'helping the newbies' perspective, it is a necessity. We can expect people to be joining throughout DGVI, and having a history of our next nation updated every TC would help those late-comers. I think it would be cool if us citizens would take turns writing a new chapter of Fanatica's history every step of the way.

    With these initiatives, I hope to speed up the process of new people getting know each other and those already in the game. I would like every person on the board to adopt at least one newbie who wants to be adopted. The 'newbie buddies' thing would be a sort of pairing up of newbies, but right now I've seemed to have lost where it goes from there... whoops... anyway...

    Chat parties and interviews with vets could be held before or after TCs. The newbies could be introduced to the President for example, and that person could have express what experiences they've had with the DG, what they've done in past DGs, y'know, just inspiration or whatever so that newbies can get a feel for what they can get into if they decide to run for a position.

    Ok, this is already way too long. I'm going to stop here for tonight, but I want you guys to throw in your ideas, like, non-stop until Sunday or something when I hope we'll start getting this off the ground. I want you to add to, discuss, and tear apart what I've said. Also, if you know whether or not you'd like to be an Addy or a Guidy, mention that too.
     
  10. snipelfritz

    snipelfritz Crazy about the Demogame

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    Hey all, I know its been a while since I've done anything here, but I think this is a good idea, and I can help out with this. I started DGing halfway through DGV term 1. From my experience, joining the DG is like getting into a cold pool. Slowly wading into it isn't the best way, jumping into the deep end is the best. Sure you'll have to strugle a little to stay afloat at first, but once you get your head above water, you're fine.

    EDIT: I cross-posted with Crimso.

    I can be an "addy", I'm quite good at spamming.
    *wonders if advertising the demogame is worthwhile of a ban*
     
  11. Cyc

    Cyc Looking for the door...

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    I would definitely be the guide-dog kind of volunteer. :) If you've been to the DG website, you may have read the History of DG1. It took me a long time to put that together, but I was happy with the final product. It is very factual.

    So if you need a History of the Demogame - How it came to be what it is, I can help with that. I'm also fairly familiar with the Judicial Code and the Constitution.

    I'm really not good at advertising and I probably wouldn't make a good interviewee. But I've always tried to help the newbs, 'cause I used to be one.
     
  12. Black_Hole

    Black_Hole Deity

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    i could create a condensed version of the constitution and CoL, and of course take questions
     
  13. Cyc

    Cyc Looking for the door...

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    Ok, here's a start to the information page that a lurker might find on the main page. I did it up in Word just to have some fun, so there are no links in it. That can be easily changed. It's a starting point.




     
  14. Civanator

    Civanator Deity

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    That's righteous Cyc :goodjob:

    I'm more of a guide, and I'm good at explaining complicated things.
     
  15. Gres

    Gres Chieftain

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    That's great Cyc. We should figure out how to get it read more. Maybe we should have a newb-central sort of thing. If the DG website ever gets renovated we could use that. I have some server space actually. I could wip up a site for newbs and put it on my domain until DG gets its site done.

    I could be an advertiser. :)
     
  16. TimBentley

    TimBentley Deity

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    I wonder if it might be wise to send a PM to people who register in the citizen registry saying hi, welcome, go look here, or whatever. Or perhaps it, in addition to telling you to say all this stuff, could say go look here if you're near. I suppose I could be a guide.
     
  17. Crimso

    Crimso ...aaaaaagh!

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    Cyc: This is exactly what we need, amazing job. You've made it friendly, casual, and informative, as well as simple. With this, I think we're taking off.

    Black Hole: Alright! I bestow that job upon you, since I know you're heavily involved in the creation of both right now. Of course, you won't be able to write such documents until we know what our CoL and constitution will be, though. In the mean time, I would love to hear any ideas you might have on this project.

    Gres: I'm considering that when we advertise DGVI, a link provided should go to the website, because compared to the whole msg board interface, a site/page can be a lot more focused, and it has more potential visually to catch people's attentions. While I do appreciate the offer, I don't think we'll be needing your server space, but if you (or anyone else) is particularly html-savvvvy I think the advertisment arm could benefit greatly from a cool web page.

    Snipelfritz/all advertisers: Ha, good start with the sig! I was thinking of a genuinely kick-ass banner that all us current citizens could wear right now. I was thinking an animated gif, all like "We had ninjas in DGV..." [cool pics of ninjas, lookin' all ready to pOUnce] "...what will we have in DGVI?" [silhouettes of Gallic Swordsmen and Enkidu Warriors, question marks] "...you decide..." [fade to black... suddenly,] "JOIN THE FREAKING DEMO GAME RIGHT NOW, YOU LITTLE SNOT." C'mon, you know some 13-year-old goofing off in computer class would totally click on that banner. Maybe something you advertisers can talk over?

    TimBentley: Wow, everyone who has posted here on the same wave-length, eh? I think a PM with a friendly welcome and some directions would be awesome. Like I said before, being personal will be a major focus of this initiative.

    I like where this is going. Kudos to Cyc for The Lowdown! Be like him: if you have anything to contribute, throw it in here! I think we've got a good sized group for now, but anyone else who is interested is still very welcome to join. I'd like to have some more back-and-forth before we do anything big though, so if you have any ideas on how we could get more people to join the demogame and make them stick around, shout 'em out!
     
  18. snipelfritz

    snipelfritz Crazy about the Demogame

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    EDIT: :crazyeye: forgot to post anything

    I have a friend who is good with photoshop and has been asking me if I wanted a sig. I'll talk to him about this today.
     
  19. Black_Hole

    Black_Hole Deity

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    unfortunately we cant use images in sigs...
     
  20. snipelfritz

    snipelfritz Crazy about the Demogame

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    There isn't anything about them in the forum rules. Just so long as it is as big as 5 lines of text, at max. When in doubt ask. Mods, are pics allowed in sigs, so long as they are small?

    My friend said he can do it, but hes pretty busy right now designing a website. So if anyone who can wants it done right now, feel free to go ahead and make it.
     

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