Discussion: The Beginnings of Research

[Octavian X]

As our nation starts out on it's path toward Fanatica's destined victory, we must decide what would be the best way technologically for us to follow. There are many options before us, and each must be examined carefully.

Some discussion has already taken place at the Ministry of Trade and Technology.

Please, post your own ideas of how you believe we should start off.

For good measure, I'll make the first proposal: Bronze Working should be our first tech. No matter when strategy we decide to following, BW will be a good starting point. BW is a good cheap tech, and Spearmen will be good for early defense. Plus, it sets us forward on the path toward Iron, which is important for the military.

 

[Cheetah]

It looks like we will be going for a Cultural Victory. If so, I recommend Ceremonial Burial as the first tech we research.

 

[Rik Meleet]

To help you determining the path I have taken a picture, made by Chieftess, which shows the tech cost.

Personally I think pottery will be useful.

 

[Fier Canadien]

I think we should go for Bronze working, then straight to litterature. We should be able to acquire ceremonial burial from somebody else. The Great Library is the most culture intensive wonder in Civ 3.

 

[Stuck_as_a_Mac]

We, the French, are in a unique position. We are the ONLY civs to start out with Alphabet and Masonry. Alpha and Masonry lead to Mathematics, a tech which costs 8 and we have the opertunity to research FIRST THING. Do math. Trade for what we need with other civs. Don't do a 2 or 3 cost starting tech. Take an 8 that we alone can research. Viva La Math!

 

[Fier Canadien]

Now that I think about it, SaaM is right. We should go for math. The price of this tech will compensated for its, hmm, quite unuseful nature (catapults are realy bad).

 

[Furiey]

An 8 Tech, that only we can research, that will still only take a maximum of 40 turns (how long would 2 2s and a 3 take?) - sounds too good to miss. If 40 turns is the best we can do we might have quite a bit of money for trading as well! I'm not sure how the free techs from goodie huts work - is a 2 value tech any more likely to get than an 8? Spearmen would be nice, particularly if our random barbarians come up raging! - we should be able to trade for that though shouldn't we?

 

[Stuck_as_a_Mac]

@Furiey- The research time for Math would be the same as that as for, say, Bronze. We will expand as the AI expands, so we will remain on level for tech time. (Plus, we can trade it for Writing later and head to Lit/GL)

 

[Furiey]

@Stuck - That's what I thought - why research a 2 value tech in 40 turns when you can research an 8 value tech in the same time! Great trading opportunities!

 

[Strider]

Math is defiantly the way to go, we would only waste time researching Bronze Working. It can be easily acquired in trade, and I can guarentee that we will NEVER beable to research Iron Working before the AI's. We need to research something we can get first, and trade it off. Otherwise we will fall behind, and quickly to. Tell me, why research Iron Working, when we can research mathematics, trade for Iron Working, Writing, Ceremonial Burial, The Wheel, Horseback Riding, etc.?

 

[donsig]

Granaries are very important to initial growth and I would like to suggest we go for that tech (pottery) first at maximum (90%) science rate.

 

[Stuck_as_a_Mac]

Donsig, once again, as I have said before. Pottery is a tradeable tech which other civs will start with. We have this opertunity to get a tech no one else can start to get, Math, right away. We should take this opertunity and run with it.

SaaM, who ducks and waits for a famed Donsig rebuttle

 

[Cyc]

Technology-wise, what advantage does the AI have on Monarch level play? Are we sure that Math will be unattainable by other Tribes?

 

[amirsan]

Originally posted by Stuck_As_a_Mac
We, the French, are in a unique position. We are the ONLY civs to start out with Alphabet and Masonry. Alpha and Masonry lead to Mathematics, a tech which costs 8 and we have the opertunity to research FIRST THING. Do math. Trade for what we need with other civs. Don't do a 2 or 3 cost starting tech. Take an 8 that we alone can research. Viva La Math!

eh, well thats what I said millions of times before...

I go for MATH.

 

[donsig]

Originally posted by Stuck_As_a_Mac
Donsig, once again, as I have said before. Pottery is a tradeable tech which other civs will start with. We have this opertunity to get a tech no one else can start to get, Math, right away. We should take this opertunity and run with it.

SaaM, who ducks and waits for a famed Donsig rebuttle

It's tradeable but we don't know yet how long it will take to find someone to trade with! Of course alot depends of what our starting position looks like but getting pottery in around 15 turns combined with a granary pre-build in our capital could give us a good advantage in pumping out settlers and getting our core cities up and running. There are other techs to trade for and going for math or another expensive tech after getting pottery would still accomplish what we'd get by going straight for math.

 

[Strider]

Originally posted by donsig


It's tradeable but we don't know yet how long it will take to find someone to trade with! Of course alot depends of what our starting position looks like but getting pottery in around 15 turns combined with a granary pre-build in our capital could give us a good advantage in pumping out settlers and getting our core cities up and running. There are other techs to trade for and going for math or another expensive tech after getting pottery would still accomplish what we'd get by going straight for math.

No, It wouldn't. The 40 turns it'll take to research pottery is 40 turns longer we have to wait to acquire mathematics & currency. The whole point of researching them would be to trade them off, and we can't do that unless we get them first. I would have thought anyone knew that.

Going for pottery would be a waste of our time. It is a rather inexpensive technology, and can easily be acquired through trade.We can not trade pottery off for another tech, remember that the AI's trade techs off quickly, we have to match the research of 5-6 AI's. Once gets something, all the others will have it to.

 

[Strider]

Also, there is always the lit/GL tatic.

We can set our goal immediantly towards lit, research Writing and lit pretty quickly (already having alphabet is a good bonus). Normally I can acquire Writing and trade it off and head straight for lit.

Also, most of the times the AI research's Map Making & Code of Laws before lit.

 

[donsig]

Originally posted by Strider

No, It wouldn't. The 40 turns it'll take to research pottery is 40 turns longer we have to wait to acquire mathematics & currency. The whole point of researching them would be to trade them off, and we can't do that unless we get them first. I would have thought anyone knew that.

Going for pottery would be a waste of our time. It is a rather inexpensive technology, and can easily be acquired through trade.We can not trade pottery off for another tech, remember that the AI's trade techs off quickly, we have to match the research of 5-6 AI's. Once gets something, all the others will have it to.

Strider, my good man, I suggested we research pottery at 90% science which would take (at most) twenty turns, not forty. The French are comercial and industrious (are they not?) and the extra commerce combined with some intelligent road building would get us pottery before 3000BC. Combining that with a granary pre-build we can get our core cities built and researching in the fastest way possible. I do not consider that goal a waste of our time. Also, the AI civs cannot trade with civs they haven't met any more than we can. We would still have math before anyone else in any event.

 

[amirsan]

We dont need a Granary just yet, remember, most of us are going for a warrior attack early on. Its very good to get it, but better to get it in trading. We can get it in five ways; One, an expansionist civ; Two, a non-expansionist civ that knows an exp. civ and traded; Three, a non-exp. civ that found a goodie hut; Four, a non-exp. that researchs it for us; Five, OUR OWN GOODIE HUTS. Those are five ways we can get our hands on Pottery before 40 turns without researching it. Its a cheap tech, so with the minimum research on Math we would be able to buy it easily.

About Lit/GL. Good Idea, but we should still go with Math, build our capitol, use Pyramids as prebuild, trade math to a person who has writing then go 100% on Liturature and switch from Prebuild. We would be sure to get it first.

 

[naervod]

My idea, which I sent to Octavian in my PM for the T&T Deputy position is as follows:

We research mathematics, as we are the ONLY civ that can do so, giving us an expensive tech. Then, with two of the most expensive first level techs and an expensive second level tech, we are in a good trading position. There, we can trade for what we need for, while setting down the science slider. This will put us in a position where we can trade for or buy any techs we need, therefore reducing the need for research. Techs we should try to obtain are Writing and Literature, as a Great Library could put us at a huge advantage in the tech race, and if we haven't picked up any first level techs, we can pick them up then. I would also advise going for Currency at some point. The importance of Bronze and Iron Working depends on what kind of strategy we are going for, offensive or peaceful. I would say Bronze Working is important anyways, as a Spearman is a huge legup from the Warrior in terms of defense. Lastly, we can probably count on at least one tech from the peaceful barbarian tribes (the huts).