Discussion: Unique Epics

borhap88 said:
I'd like to propose an alternative National Heroic, even if it's less known than Orlando Furioso:
"La battaglia di Legnano" ("The battle of Legnano") https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_battaglia_di_Legnano, an opera by Giuseppe Verdi. It tells about battle between the imperial army of Frederick Barbarossa and the troops of the Lombard League in 1176, near the town of Legnano (Lombardy). In a proclamation issued in Bergamo on August 3, 1848, the revolutionary leader Giuseppe Garibaldi referred to the historic Battle of Legnano as a source of inspiration for his own struggle for the Unification of Italy.
The QUOTE could be: "Italia risorge vestita di Gloria, invitta e regina qual'era sarà" / "Italy rises again robed in glory!, Unconquered and a queen she shall be as once she was!"
The IMAGE could be The Carroccio ("a large four-wheeled wagon bearing the city signs around which the militia of the medieval communes gathered and fought"). Unfortunately, it has recently become a symbol of the current, former northern secessionist, party of the League (right).
View attachment 589181
Click to expand...

Thanks for getting this, Ill put it in.
 
Update:
There are seven civilizations left, including Khmer, Indonesia, Mali, Mexico, Iran, Aztec and Inca. Also, the heroic entry to China was changed.

I would finish them myself (and if needed I will) but I do have real life responsibilities :crazyeye: (wish I could search the literary accomplishment of the world all day:lol:). I prefer to do Khmer myself as I have already found the sources for it but any contribution is appreciated.

Feel free to check out the entries, and leave your comments here. I am hoping we can have this completed very soon so better to talk about them now and later. Once all the entries are completed I will want to submit the project as a whole fairly quickly.

Thanks to everyone who have been helping out with this! Once the entries are done Ill make a list of users that contributed to put on the list (as I know them based from this thread. After that it would be up to Leoreth if he counts everyone as official DOC contributors. (I assume there is a DOC credits somewhere but I honestly don't know)
:grouphug:
 
There are only three nations left to do. Aztecs, Inca and Modern Iran.

I sometimes had to make hard decisions with civs with more obscure texts but I always put national authenticity first, so I can say that all of these quotes relate to the country. I will say that Tibet's epic has Mongolian influences but this is because it was the one I can find, and I was assured from research that the content was very similar.

I would love to do the last three, but real life dictates I need to get to my own assignments and cease this unpaid labor :lol:. Can someone take a crack at the last three?
@Steb @Publicola
@merijn_v1
@borhap88

@rmontaruli, anyone?

@Leoreth
I don't know if you remember your discussion from two years ago on Unique Epics but, the table of quotes is almost done.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Ww_NOV27og8fUpziGSvTxKFN6QRcg7lZ0pXo77JVn2c/edit?usp=sharing
 
This is obviously super important so I went and found a PDF of the Cantares Mexicanos with English translations. I read a couple of war poems in it, and I like this one (from page 361 in the PDF):

Montezuma, you creature of heaven, you sing in Mexico, in Tenochtitlan.
Here where eagle multitudes were ruined, your bracelet house stands shining—there in the home of God our father.
There and in that place they come alive, ah! on the field! For a moment they come whirling, they the eagles, ah! the nobles Ixtlilcuechahuac and Matlaccuiatzin.
And in that place these nobles gain renown and honor: bells are scattered, dust and lords grow golden.
Onward, friends! We'll dare to go where fame, where glory's gotten, where nobility is gotten, where flower death is won.
Your name and honor live, O princes. Prince Tlacahuepan! Ixtlilcuechahuac! You've gone and won war death.
Sky dawn is rising up. The multitude, the birds, are shrilling. Precious swans are being created. Turquoise troupials are being created.
Lucky you, arrayed in chalk and plumes. O flower-drunk Montezuma! Precious swans are being created. Turquoise troupials are being created.

I suggest using the second half (from "Onward, friends!") as the quote for the Heroic Epic. (Note that currently the Cantares Mexicanos are int the table as the National Epic, but I think it's better to swap it with the Cronica currently used as the Heroic Epic).

There are plenty of Aztec Codex images depicting warfare. This one is nice:
Spoiler :
Codex_Mendoza_folio_67r_bottom.jpg
 
Last edited:
Steb said:
This is obviously super important so I went and found a PDF of the Cantares Mexicanos with English translations. I read a couple of war poems in it, and I like this one (from page 361 in the PDF):

Montezuma, you creature of heaven, you sing in Mexico, in Tenochtitlan.
Here where eagle multitudes were ruined, your bracelet house stands shining—there in the home of God our father.
There and in that place they come alive, ah! on the field! For a moment they come whirling, they the eagles, ah! the nobles Ixtlilcuechahuac and Matlaccuiatzin.
And in that place these nobles gain renown and honor: bells are scattered, dust and lords grow golden.
Onward, friends! We'll dare to go where fame, where glory's gotten, where nobility is gotten, where flower death is won.
Your name and honor live, O princes. Prince Tlacahuepan! Ixtlilcuechahuac! You've gone and won war death.
Sky dawn is rising up. The multitude, the birds, are shrilling. Precious swans are being created. Turquoise troupials are being created.
Lucky you, arrayed in chalk and plumes. O flower-drunk Montezuma! Precious swans are being created. Turquoise troupials are being created.

I suggest using the second half (from "Onward, friends!") as the quote for the Heroic Epic. (Note that currently the Cantares Mexicanos are int the table as the National Epic, but I think it's better to swap it with the Cronica currently used as the Heroic Epic).

There are plenty of Aztec Codex images depicting warfare. This one is nice:
Click to expand...

wait.
This is for the Aztecs, not the modern Mexicans? I just realized
 
Steb said:
This is obviously super important so I went and found a PDF of the Cantares Mexicanos with English translations. I read a couple of war poems in it, and I like this one (from page 361 in the PDF):

Montezuma, you creature of heaven, you sing in Mexico, in Tenochtitlan.
Here where eagle multitudes were ruined, your bracelet house stands shining—there in the home of God our father.
There and in that place they come alive, ah! on the field! For a moment they come whirling, they the eagles, ah! the nobles Ixtlilcuechahuac and Matlaccuiatzin.
And in that place these nobles gain renown and honor: bells are scattered, dust and lords grow golden.
Onward, friends! We'll dare to go where fame, where glory's gotten, where nobility is gotten, where flower death is won.
Your name and honor live, O princes. Prince Tlacahuepan! Ixtlilcuechahuac! You've gone and won war death.
Sky dawn is rising up. The multitude, the birds, are shrilling. Precious swans are being created. Turquoise troupials are being created.
Lucky you, arrayed in chalk and plumes. O flower-drunk Montezuma! Precious swans are being created. Turquoise troupials are being created.

I suggest using the second half (from "Onward, friends!") as the quote for the Heroic Epic. (Note that currently the Cantares Mexicanos are int the table as the National Epic, but I think it's better to swap it with the Cronica currently used as the Heroic Epic).

There are plenty of Aztec Codex images depicting warfare. This one is nice:
Click to expand...

Thanks for the suggestion. I just put it in, and switched the epics as you suggested.
 
I just did the two Inca epics. Thanks to Steb's work with the Heroic Epic for Aztec, we have only three entries left

  1. The Aztec National Epic
  2. The Two Iranian Epics

(this has been hard as I am looking for 16th-19th century Iranian literature, I might settle for 20th)
Lets hope after all of our work, that this ends up in the game

Not sure if a bonus was ever decided in. If so, here is a simple (and hopefully uncontroversial opinion here)

Maybe something simple
National Epics are national, so they nation wide they create a plus 1 culture bonus, per city, this bonus could double every era, so that older civs that are technologically behind anyway get a cultural boost (Ie: China remembers its ancient stories)

For National Epic, how about just 3xp for every unit recruited in the heroic epic city, to show the values the epic inspired on the military.

Something simple, that should not be game breaking but shows the value of literature to our complex civilizations.
 
Sergey_Kalinin said:
Great job done! Good that we have finally completed all list!
Click to expand...

Your contributions, helped a great deal. If you can take a look at the document again, and see if any changes might be needed. Honestly even though I have not played DOC in a while, I really appreciate the parts like this that build an immersion for the player.
 
I made a suggestion in the Google Document for the Korean Epics.

1)
Changed the Image for the Heroic Epic to the drawing of the Sun and the Moon over five peaks.
This was a very popular theme during the Joseon Kingdom era, especially in the royal court.
Since 'The Song of the Flying Dragons' is an epic for the founder of the Joseon Kingdom,
it seems fitting that the above theme should be that of the matching image.

2)
Changed the National Epic from 'Chasa Bonpuri' to 'Tales of Hong Gil-dong'.

Chasa Bonpuri is a traditional story from the Jeju Island, which has always been a remote part of Korean dynasties.
To use this as the National Epic for Korea would be like, say,
to use a tale from the Canary Islands as the Spanish Epic, or to use a tale from Okinawa as the Japanese Epic.

So I changed this to 'The tales of Hong Gil-dong', a popular novel probably originating from 16c.
This was (and still is) much widely known, and is the first novel to be written in the Korean Alphabet.
Also I changed the matching image to the Korean Tiger image that was originally used for the Heoric Epic.
 
JHLee said:
I made a suggestion in the Google Document for the Korean Epics.

1)
Changed the Image for the Heroic Epic to the drawing of the Sun and the Moon over five peaks.
This was a very popular theme during the Joseon Kingdom era, especially in the royal court.
Since 'The Song of the Flying Dragons' is an epic for the founder of the Joseon Kingdom,
it seems fitting that the above theme should be that of the matching image.

2)
Changed the National Epic from 'Chasa Bonpuri' to 'Tales of Hong Gil-dong'.

Chasa Bonpuri is a traditional story from the Jeju Island, which has always been a remote part of Korean dynasties.
To use this as the National Epic for Korea would be like, say,
to use a tale from the Canary Islands as the Spanish Epic, or to use a tale from Okinawa as the Japanese Epic.

So I changed this to 'The tales of Hong Gil-dong', a popular novel probably originating from 16c.
This was (and still is) much widely known, and is the first novel to be written in the Korean Alphabet.
Also I changed the matching image to the Korean Tiger image that was originally used for the Heoric Epic.
Click to expand...

I really appreciate this. I had thought of 'Tales of Hong Gil-dong before, I struggled to find a translation. So I am glad that you were able to. Haven't checked out the doc yet, but wanted to say thanks! :)
 
IMO the quotes in the Google Doc are way too long.
If we want to fit them in the screen size and time length of ingame wonder movies (or static images), we need to shorten these quotes down to <= 20 words long each.
 
I think a scroll bar is used for long text.
Also I think the longer quotes provide a complete context to whatever is being discussed and signifies a unique attribute about the civilization.
 
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