Do you accept Vassals (and if so why)?

[MaxEd]

Sorry for necroing but is an interesting subject...IF the de-vasalization option can be done interface-wise it also must have some kind of penalization for realism and fairness IMO...like a relation penalty with every other nation for...lets say...3 points? with the excuse of "You didnt respect a vassal contract" or something like that PLUS 5 points with the de-vassalized nation with the same excuse AND worst penalties if you both are at war...(maybe the same penalties mentioned before plus a 30 turn -5 happines across your nation)
But for all this to make any sense there should be a bonus to having a vassal state on the first place...a REAL bonus of some kind...one option is to use the vassal to work for you in an area you chose...and make it REALLY usefull...like giving the vassal the order to research for you (not specific, just a sub-menu to force it to choose if research-gold-espionage-suggestions?) then that research gets ADDED to your own research without the need to sharing previous project with said nation...and make it a percentage of the mass production he can spew maybe? so if that nation is in renaissance and you are in modern age then they add for a minuscule amount of research...

I can think of other options to add but...maybe im dreaming to much...way to much

Vassal system need some love...thats something a lot of ppl agree

EDIT: should i post this on the ideas thread?

 

[Thunderbrd]

naw... these threads are basically huge extensions of those and make the conversations much easier to follow So this was an appropriate place for your post.

I agree that the vassal system could use some modding attention but it baffles me in function too much to want to touch it yet... maybe down the road.

I've also been thinking that I might like to see an 'Annexation' trade option that dissolves a nation and adds all cities and possibly even current units to the other... generally a war option when the ai recognizes its defeated. Just some surface thoughts from the other day.

I may have to do something with it eventually and if I get to that, I might take a look at how the vassalization option works and see what tweaks might help it to be a useful tool... problem is, I think some like exactly what I don't about the system so its probably not something to go adjusting without a lot of care.

 

[MaxEd]

There is another way to make vassal states more interesting, make it so the annexation option only appear after lets say...100 turns a state is your vassal? maybe adding some dificulty like...mmm...having him happy with you up to some minimal point? plus a bit more spice like...he needs to have your same state religion? (after all you get an entire culture and country as reward) and same civics also? (this also forces you to be nice with it sharing some minimal tech level wich in fact makes it a bit more happy with you, etc)

And im not sure if direct anexation during war is a good idea in fact, its better in the way i propose, after all, they hate us because we declared war (or they to us, anyway) and we killed some of their ppl and troops, and took by force some of their cities...plus they hate our way of life because we are wining, etc...but...just think about my idea...the AI know they are going to lose the war and offers to be your vassal state, then you have to chose to accept and work his happiness so he finally anexes to you...or force his hand and just wipe him from earth...

After all if you accept that last chance vassal (instead of finally kiking his ass) is because the war is wearing your own country to much and you need to refresh things so you get a free pass too...so let it cost some extra effort in a different front...

EDIT: sorry my bad english, its not my main language...

EDIT2: another idea is to make em handle their cities slowly, like, one every 20 turns and only if the city have your same religion...and your culture touch his border...etc

 

[Thunderbrd]

some good thoughts there too, MaxEd. I'm not anywhere near DOING anything with this yet but when it starts coming up on my radar I'll bring it up again for more discussion since there's some interesting thinking floating here on the matter.

 

[LumenAngel]

"Do you accept Vassals (and if so why)"
Only if they have only cities in harsh environment (big deserts, nearly only ice and tundra...) : too hard to conquer, not often worth it and not often a threat...

We dont have a big advantage to take vassal, and it sometimes hard to erase them when you dont need them anymore
Maybe with some one-way wonders effect sharing (Culture Wonders, all +X in all city wonders, All free-somthing in all city wonders, ...), I would take more vassal, mainly the one with interesting wonders.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

"Do you accept Vassals (and if so why)"
Only if they have only cities in harsh environment (big deserts, nearly only ice and tundra...) : too hard to conquer, not often worth it and not often a threat...

We dont have a big advantage to take vassal, and it sometimes hard to erase them when you dont need them anymore
Maybe with some one-way wonders effect sharing (Culture Wonders, all +X in all city wonders, All free-somthing in all city wonders, ...), I would take more vassal, mainly the one with interesting wonders.

On my list of things to do is to make the vassal wonder (Topkapi Palace) do, it currently just "strengthens" your vassals but I want it to give you a free based culture of your vassal.

 

[Schwarzbart]

I usual have the Vassal system disabled when starting a new game.