1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

Do you play Cut-Throat or Immersion?

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by Can Not, Jul 2, 2012.

  1. Can Not

    Can Not Chieftain

    Joined:
    May 23, 2004
    Messages:
    26
    I don't know if there are better terms for these gameplay styles, but Cut-Throat implies that you want the AI to be score-mongering lords of victory and Immersion implies that you want to feel like you are experiencing the role of a leader of an empire/nation in a fictional world.

    I think in the game options there should be a choice related to this, either global or per an AI. Also, it would be interesting in multiplayer if player 1 could only win a domination and player 2 could only win a space victory.

    Which do play as, do you make grey area between these distinctions, and would you pick different words to describe these play styles?
     
  2. Peacemongerer

    Peacemongerer Prince

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2012
    Messages:
    431
    Location:
    California
    Depends... sometimes I get into it, other times something so irritates me (The AI poaching a CS from me or beating me to a wonder or something) that I break character and rampage.
     
  3. El Caballerion

    El Caballerion King

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2010
    Messages:
    938
    Location:
    New York
    I play very organically. Before creating a map, I ask myself, 'Do I want to keep regenerating the map until I get a comfy isolated island?' or 'Do I want to war-monger right away?', etc. And then I choose the Civ I like.

    That's about the only question I ask. I never begin a game by saying, 'I AM going to win this game by domination or I AM going for a cultural victory.' I actually shy away from those goals, and have only truly finished 3 games out of the 100+ I've played in marathon. I really like to be immersed more than anything, and enjoy the story that emerges from a 24+ hour game.
     
  4. Barghaest

    Barghaest King

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2011
    Messages:
    758
    Generally I play immersively. I spend more time focusing on building the empire than winning, but I often set goals for myself based on the empire (current Rome game I'm planning on Domination, but with Russia I wanted Space Victory) but these may be subject to change based on how the map plays out.

    As for setting goals based on player/AI... that could easily be exploited. If you know said AI can only win via space, you can simply deny them access to aluminum while you work on whatever your victory condition is. I don't believe any victory condition should be set in stone for any player as situation could bring about change - maybe it'd take you 200 more turns to do a SV but just 50 to roll over and take that last remaining capital... being forced to stick with option A isn't fun.
     
  5. AbenHumeya

    AbenHumeya Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2012
    Messages:
    65
    I do a bit of both really, I play-by-feel. A lot of times I'll go with what I'm given early game and use my Civs UA and situation to develop things, but as I get into a Civ more and get a larger view of the world, I typically get immersed: I had a Mongol game where I had destroyed several CS's, except for a few on islands which I hadn't bothered with, and Almaty was one of them, since they kept handing me troops for wars since I had conveniently killed 3 people they wanted dead (entirely incidental). I actually got immersed in the idea of them basically being a small vassal and military outpost near the Romans, so when the Romans ended up actually invading them and defeating them before I could get there, I basically ended a war nearby and just went wholesale at the Romans to obliterate them, I ended up taking back Almaty and burning almost all Romans cities to the ground, just out of revenge, that was fun.
     
  6. RazorChain

    RazorChain Naked Emperor

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
    Messages:
    69
    Location:
    Drammen, Norway
    I play for immersion and I love to hate other Civs...it makes wars more personal. Often I play on King as there I am in my comfort zone and don't have to sweat it but occasionally I ramp up the difficulty for a harder game. The only thing I feel is missing in a King game is a combat bonus for A.I units.

    I always play on the larger maps on either Epic or Marathon and cram it full of rival civs for interesting politics, alliances and early wars. I rarely go out with a plan how to win but I like to explore different strategies with different civs. At the moment I'm playing as the Arabs and exploring the faith system with them and I feel it's a bit refreshing to be able to make different strategies around religions.

    I have even started to plan my next game using the Romans going for a religion with growth and production bonus. When my cities will be large enough they can build everything in that has been built in the capital with a 40% production bonus.....
     
  7. Kabloosh

    Kabloosh Warlord

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2012
    Messages:
    182
    I try for immersion but certain factors can dictate how I go about things. I do choose a way to play before the game. For example I may want to aim for warmongering while another I want to be play strictly with city states and work on building up a high populated but small country.

    Sometimes though things can change this. For example I started a European map as the Iriquois(spelling?) with the intention of busting some skulls in early. Well they threw me on the British isles completely changing that so instead of aiming for a large and expansive nation I went for a tall cultural civ which by the mid game I was a cultural run away with like 5+ policies ahead of everyone and had almost every wonder plus a massive tech advantage. I unfortunately didn't start busting any skulls until Germany declared war on me and I just steam rolled him with superior tech/numbers. I won by a cultural victory but I had literally everything. I had all but like 4 wonders, every single city state was my ally, and I was bombing great war infantry with stealth bombers. This had to of been one of the most ridiculously powerful empires I've ever built. Its weird though cause I like to play to the civ's strengths but sometimes you just gotta play to the strengths of the environment you are placed in.
     
  8. jjkrause84

    jjkrause84 King

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2010
    Messages:
    959
    Location:
    UK
    I tend to opt for immersion. I find playing too cutthroat gives the player an un-fun advantage.
     
  9. Furycrab

    Furycrab King

    Joined:
    May 26, 2011
    Messages:
    914
    As much as I like immersion, I absolutely hate it when and if the AI isn't trying to actively Win. They put the option to keep playing after someone wins just for that...

    I'm the guy that kinda hated CIV diplomacy because it was *Edit* sometimes backwards bat**** stupid from someone wanting to win a game should work. I haven't played in years, but ya, was really really annoyed at how with religion, your AI neighbor could be your best damn friend and trade techs all day long, but the guy on the other continent with a different religion wouldn't give you the time of day.

    It's the subject of a lot of debates. Personally what I like with an AI that plays to win, is the satisfaction when you finish a good high difficulty win.
     
  10. Andulias

    Andulias A Stranger on a Train

    Joined:
    May 26, 2012
    Messages:
    508
    I am more on the side of immersion, which is great, because no Civ game has a "cut-throat" AI.
     
  11. SHaW1986

    SHaW1986 Prince

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2010
    Messages:
    334
    Location:
    Iowa City, Iowa
    immersion, hardly play to win at all, but if i just so happen to be in a position to win i go for it
     
  12. Eagle Pursuit

    Eagle Pursuit Scir-Gerefa

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2010
    Messages:
    15,738
    I'm for immersion and empire building. I'm not trying to be the best player or have the sharpest strategy. I do things because I think they are cool, not because it is the best thing to do.
     
  13. Drawmeus

    Drawmeus Emperor

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2007
    Messages:
    1,213
    Neither/both. I want the AI to be a challenge while also being immersive.

    This is not impossible. There is no fundamental tension between the two; the tension arises from the fact that the victory conditions which have actually been created for the game sometimes encourage you to make decisions which do not help you win. For example, if you're playing for a culture victory, expanding your empire can be counterproductive.

    I go for immersion over cut-throat because cheaty bonuses can make up the difficulty reasonably well.
     
  14. Lira

    Lira Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2012
    Messages:
    56
    Location:
    Brasília, Brazil
    Immersion... unless I feel a rival civilisation is close to winning the game. Then I'm going to do all within my reach to hold that sucker down like I'm OT Quartet.
     
  15. thadian

    thadian Kami of Awakened Dreamers

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2006
    Messages:
    2,288
    Location:
    Indiana, USA
    i play for immersion until i need to cripple an opponent - usually i have to be forced to go cut-throat. Once i go cut-throat, i usually cripple as many AI's as i can before i return to immersion.

    Usually i use this time to try to establish a foothold of 1 annex + 2 puppets on another continent to ease later warfare. This allows me to return to immersion until late game.
     
  16. SlithyTove

    SlithyTove Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2011
    Messages:
    53
    if(difficulty == 'Deity' || otherplayerabouttowin)
    style='cutthroat'
    else
    style='immersion'
     
  17. SS-18 ICBM

    SS-18 ICBM Oscillator

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2006
    Messages:
    15,263
    Location:
    Here and there
    I want the AI to have flavor. I want them better at some things than others and emphasizing different strategies.
     
  18. binhthuy71

    binhthuy71 Emperor

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2003
    Messages:
    1,887
    Location:
    Southern California foothills
    I prefer to play immersion and I'd do it more often if the game allowed. No matter how carefully I play it seems that some AI civ is going to DoW. To me, thaat's the point at which the game goes stupid.

    Recent game; I'm playing as the Byzantines on a Large Islands map. Spain DoWs after many turns of good relations. Spain sends a mixed force of six Frigates and Privateers. I sink one and capture the rest. My Military Adviser "Our war with Spain is not going well..." Huh? I counterattack, capture more ships and take a city from Spain. My Military Adviser "Our war with Spain is not going well..." Whatever. Isabella offers peace for all of my money, my resources, GPT, and the city I just took. I take another city. Isabella offers peace on the same terms plus the second city I took from her. My Military Adviser is still smoking crack. Etc.

    How can you not rampage when some AIs force you to pound them into the ground before they take peace on sane terms?
     
  19. Gucumatz

    Gucumatz JS, secretly Rod Serling

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2011
    Messages:
    6,181
    Depends on how I feel like playing that day. In multiplayer I can be... and probably will be cuthroat though. I don't like waging war though - but when I do I win, I prefer diplomacy and building to win games in multiplayer too and will only stray to war if its necessary to keep things in line.
     
  20. RazorChain

    RazorChain Naked Emperor

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
    Messages:
    69
    Location:
    Drammen, Norway
    It's completely the opposite for me. My girlfriend Boudicca says she doesn't like me anymore and our relationship was just a lie and invades. I use my 3 camel archers and a musketman to fend off her force of Pikemen and Crossbowmen. I kill 2 pikemen and I don't even start up military production and she comes crawling to me begging for mercy offering 1600 gold, 150 gpt, Ivory and Incence for 90 turns (I'm playing on marathon). Hell...this is 15100 gold in total plus +12 happiness (because of merchant SP) for 90 turns.

    And I'm thinking...what was her problem? Why did she bother to attacK? Was it that time of the month?

    This she has done 3 times over the span of last 300+ turns. She gives me all her money, get's her economy back together, produces some units and attacks and rince and repeat
     

Share This Page