1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

"Don't Cry for me Argentina!"

Discussion in 'Imperium OffTopicum' started by Birdjaguar, Apr 6, 2013.

  1. NinjaCow64

    NinjaCow64 The Continuation of the Dream Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2010
    Messages:
    7,747
    @Lord of Elves: From what I've read the lore of WoW really went downhill over recent years. I'm not a WoW player at all but I really liked Warcraft 3 so I like to read about the lore and watch cutscenes occasionally. I think that Horde players are rightfully miffed by having to endure the Garrosh Hellscream plot-line (where the leader of the Horde turns into a power hungry maniac for basically no reason) not once but twice (now with everyone's favourite waifu Slynvanius Windrunner) whereas the Alliance has been depicted as almost completely unambiguously good for a while now. I don't know why they decided to make the Alliance the "good guys" all the time and the Horde the "bad guys" all the time when they are effectively alienating half their audience and also retreading the same ground over and over again. Seems bad and dumb.
     
  2. Tolina

    Tolina trust the pillars with your s e c r e t s

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2013
    Messages:
    10,492
    Location:
    Nightvale, US
    What happened is pretty simple, at least from my point of view: both the model of IOTs and the community within had been depleted. The first, because no real innovation occurred - it was stuck in the limbo of doing the same thing over and over - it's not complexity, it's stagnation, despite Sone's heroic efforts to try and rescue it all. Ah, but no chance. The second, because the community stagnated, as well. It was, in all honesty, kind of circlejerky and isolationist. We kept talking about the same things, day in, day out, with no new people. Admittedly, the last part is due to the demise of forums (objectively a good thing for CFC, because it deserves dying and more), however the lack of "new blood" really did us all in.

    The other issue is the core paradigm of IOTs is based either on alternate history, which sucks, because it's a bit of a daft genre 90% of the time, and it's not very good. The other is to have a blank state ala Civ, which is also kind of boring and sort of imperialistic, don't you think?

    So, what's to be done? Read Marx, read Lenin. Don't be a nerd.

    That's all there is to it.
     
    Sonereal likes this.
  3. Tani Coyote

    Tani Coyote Canis Latranscendental

    Joined:
    May 28, 2007
    Messages:
    14,965
    Gender:
    Male
    Lenin says to keep things stable at home, colonialism is necessary.

    Clearly, I need to start an IOT on a furry website or something.
     
  4. Ailedhoo

    Ailedhoo wonderer

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    7,609
    FurIOT: OwO

    Anyhow: let us see on the demigod game I am looking forward to play first before we plan exports... ;)
     
  5. west india man

    west india man Immortal

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2008
    Messages:
    9,119
    Location:
    Brazil
    Considering the fact that ''imperium'' is right there in the name, imperialism being involved isn't exactly a surprise

    don't read lenin
     
    Lord of Elves likes this.
  6. Tani Coyote

    Tani Coyote Canis Latranscendental

    Joined:
    May 28, 2007
    Messages:
    14,965
    Gender:
    Male
    I just want the opportunity to join a game as Mexico so I can be an Mexicaboo, myself.
     
  7. Crezth

    Crezth 話說天下大勢分久必合合久必分

    Joined:
    May 26, 2006
    Messages:
    10,421
    Location:
    北京皇城
  8. Tolina

    Tolina trust the pillars with your s e c r e t s

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2013
    Messages:
    10,492
    Location:
    Nightvale, US
    It would appear that your knowledge of Lenin is approximately as lacking as that of history, or being a decent human being, I am afraid, because I see no way how'd you read that into any of his works.

    90% of IOTs are basically imperialism make believe by some history nerds (incl. yours truly)

    actually he's so good, it's not even funny
     
  9. GenMarshall

    GenMarshall Ghost Agent

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2002
    Messages:
    42,735
    Location:
    Versailles City, Vekta, United Terran Systems
    War, War never changes.
     
  10. Ailedhoo

    Ailedhoo wonderer

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    7,609
    War is the continuation of politics by other means.
     
  11. GenMarshall

    GenMarshall Ghost Agent

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2002
    Messages:
    42,735
    Location:
    Versailles City, Vekta, United Terran Systems
    Some have developed different interests in other games and have moved on. I myself have gotten myself into Overwatch and Starcraft and have been venturing into their communities on their related discords and Reddit pages (plus there’s a fresh relief for me that I start out with a clean slate in these communities where no one knows nor cares about my past and holds it against me).
     
  12. Tani Coyote

    Tani Coyote Canis Latranscendental

    Joined:
    May 28, 2007
    Messages:
    14,965
    Gender:
    Male
    He literally said capitalism did not yet collapse because the imperial powers were using their colonial wealth to bribe people back home.

    So. Time to forge that furry splinter sect!
     
  13. Crezth

    Crezth 話說天下大勢分久必合合久必分

    Joined:
    May 26, 2006
    Messages:
    10,421
    Location:
    北京皇城
  14. Sonereal

    Sonereal ♫We got the guillotine♫ Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2008
    Messages:
    14,790
    For new players to be intimidated, there has to be new players.

    Everything flows from top-forum growth. In other words, Imperium Offtopicum took off because Civilization IV had reached the peak of its popularity and its extremely creative community overflowed into Forum Games where OT posters were already congregating. When V and later VI were released, they had a lot of activity but a lot of the "creative itch" was being scratched by either more complex IAARs up-forum or simply didn't exist because people were increasingly more interested into Video AARs by the time V and VI were released.

    Steam Workshop chipped away at a large reason why people frequent the forums. The subreddit chipped away even further. There are more people active on the subreddit at any given time than these forums. Just look at the subscriber growth for the subreddit since 2010 and think about whether forum is matching that.
    newplot.png
    If you look at the number of daily comments on the subreddit, it is about ~750, obviously tripling at least when an expansion is released. There have been only 186 posts on this entire forum, from what I can tell, in the last 24-36 hours.

    IOT is caught between a rock and a hard place compared to 2010-2015. The "simple IOT" is great on lunch breaks when you can check the thread and send in orders during lunch, but if you can do that now, you can literally do anything else on your phone now like play a game, read a book, watch Netflix, etc. The more complex and expressive GMs became, the more prep work required for diminishing returns of player activity because people could do other things and new people never made it down to the subforum because they're better served by the subreddit.

    And I can't prove this, but I'm fairly sure there is a HUGE overlap between "GMs who enjoy lots of prep work" and "GMs who would make good DMs". I'm doing even more prep work for campaigns these days but player retention and activity is easier to maintain and the prep work is more upfront than constant like an IOT. Better yet, you can take prep work from one campaign setting and slot it in with just about any system you want 90% of the time. There is far more variety in the personalized suggestions tab of DTRPG than the last four years of IOT in terms of setting and mechanics and a lot of one can slot in for the other.


    And really, at some point, what IOTs do are better served by about a dozen other games. The players attracted to IOTs because they can play as rulers can get about as much from a Paradox Game or something like Pocket Empires/World Tamers for Traveller, Kingmaker for Pathfinder, the Company system in REIGN, the Domain system in ACKS, or dozens of other similar games about "ruling stuff from the perspective of individual rulers".

    It takes forever to resolve something in an IOT. Why would you want to wait two weeks to see what your five lines of orders do when you can play a Paradox game and get through two hundred years? At some point, I and a select few others just started ripping off TTRPG faction rules wholesale, which naturally lead a few of us to just run TTRPG games instead.

    You can only do so much with an alternate history before it becomes so divorced from OTL that it might as well be an alien world or so close to history that it takes RL months of years before the divergence becomes actually noticeable by which point 80% of people will have stopped checking the thread anyway. Blank slates are fun except they're as easy to check out from as they are to check in to.

    Hilariously, IOT pulled a Gygax/Miller where people started wondering "boy it sure would be fun if I could play as an individual player or ruler instead of a whole country".
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2019
    Tolina and Crezth like this.
  15. Crezth

    Crezth 話說天下大勢分久必合合久必分

    Joined:
    May 26, 2006
    Messages:
    10,421
    Location:
    北京皇城
    Jolly good posting, Sonereal old chum! Allow the internet naturalist in me to inscoriate this "post" you've engongled us with. It seems like you're saying that Civilization has gotten less popular, causing this forum to also become less popular. Civfanatics is a young and vibrant community, but for some reason Imperium OffTopicum is not able to attract some of that youthful energy to it, in much the way a venus fly trap attracts flies, or a libertarian attracts children. It would seem - and I daresay you would agree double-wholeheartedly - that the reason for this is a surfeit of games that rely on systems and models, barren of the juvenile frolicking of Ages Yore (not to mention chatroom culture that has caused some of the more enterprising among us to be unfairly maligned). Naturally, such an environment is downright hostile to a historical roleplaying community, the pillars of which are galaxy-brain alternate histories postulating feminist Nazi empires of the Outer Hebrides.

    The good news is, however, that you poor, wretched souls are not alone. There exist Titans that stride among you, and you need only look up to behold them. Rejoice, for my plan to revive Imperium OffTopicum is at hand! All we need to do is

    Your free trial to Crezth Posts is over! To read the remainder of this post as well as enjoy the priceless high-quality content of literally dozens of Crezth Posts, you can subscribe to our service for $199.99 a month (less shipping and handling) and become a member of the Crezth Posts community! A Crezth Posts subscription also comes with a free subscription to Moonwaxers, the premiere newsletter for all enthusiasts of waxing the lunar surface. Call our number TOLL FREE at 1-800-NOT-TOLL-FREE and order now!

    A Crezth Posts subscription is not recommended by any doctor or caregiver. Crezth Posts, Inc. is not a registered company and is described by the U.S. Attorney General as "a really f**king illegal piece of brazen racketeering" with "crimes so heinous that it literally makes babies sneeze." Crezth Posts, Inc. is not responsible for any charges of treason filed against its clientele by the U.S. Government and is obligated by Law to warn its clientele in the strictest possible terms to "grow some facial hair and get a hair cut and as much plastic surgery as you can and a name change and move across the world as soon as possible and even then may God have mercy on you." Restrictions apply, results may vary.
     
  16. Sonereal

    Sonereal ♫We got the guillotine♫ Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2008
    Messages:
    14,790
    The number does NOT work people. Do NOT give the person on the other end your credit card number.
     
    JohannaK and NinjaCow64 like this.
  17. Tolina

    Tolina trust the pillars with your s e c r e t s

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2013
    Messages:
    10,492
    Location:
    Nightvale, US
    You can't even post your last three digits of your credit card with the expiration date on CFC, I mean, let me just demonstrate...

    *** **/***

    give it a try in the comments below
     
  18. Sonereal

    Sonereal ♫We got the guillotine♫ Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2008
    Messages:
    14,790
    *** **/***

    Wow wtf [REDACTED]

    I'm so sorry Leif. I didn't know @tagging was a thing.
     
  19. west india man

    west india man Immortal

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2008
    Messages:
    9,119
    Location:
    Brazil
    As I recall, I was banned from the discord ~3 years ago for consistently advocating for violent revolution and now it looks like half of IOT wants a violent revolution of some sort
     
  20. Tolina

    Tolina trust the pillars with your s e c r e t s

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2013
    Messages:
    10,492
    Location:
    Nightvale, US
    clearly, your banning was the dress rehearsal for the radicalization of IOTChat

    here's one for those before us
     

Share This Page