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Dynasty Game III "Immortal Kingdom"

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Succession Games' started by Lord Civius, Nov 4, 2012.

  1. Lord Civius

    Lord Civius Emperor

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    Welcome to Dynasty Game III "Immortal Kingdom". In this installment we will be stepping up to Immortal difficulty and our fearless leaders (turnplayers) will be granted the title of King (or Queen). We must lead our great civilization to victory as a Kingdom set in the middle ages. Our Leaderhead must have the Civilopedia title of King or Queen as well as the Civilization we choose must have existed at some point in the middle ages (500-1500AD).

    Variants:

    The following civics must be adopted once they become available and cannot be changed-
    Heredetary Rule
    Vassalage
    Serfdom
    Decentralization
    Organized Religion


    Settings:

    Leader: Pacal II of Khmer
    Traits: Expansive/Financial
    Starting technologies: Hunting/Mining
    UU: Ballista Elephant (War Elephant)
    UB: Baray (Aqueduct)

    Map: Standard, Factal, Temperate Climate, Medium Sea-level
    Difficulty: Immortal
    Speed: Normal
    No Goody Huts, No Random Events, Lock Modified Assets.


    Roster:

    Lord Civius
    Cam H
    Revent
     
  2. Cam_H

    Cam_H Deity

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    Lord Civius,

    Thanks for putting this forward.

    I'd be quite happy to play an Immortal level SG with the Medieval-themed constrained choices on civics as proposed.

    With that said, it would be difficult for me to participate in live chatrooms due to time zone problems.

    The roster-type system used in most succession games of everyone taking roughly equal turns seems to work quite well, and I see more pitfalls than benefits in the idea of one player taking 'say' 40 turns in a row, while the rest of the roster essentially acts as lurkers. It can be tough enough to maintain a full roster of interested participants, but having several game members not playing for long periods of time runs a real risk of them losing interest and dropping out. I appreciate that you are proposing a new system, and hope that my concerns on it don't dampen your enthusiasm for pursuing this theme in some manner as I appreciate that you've put some thought into it.

    Keeping the 'Player is King/Queen' theme, maybe instead confine all discussion on the roster to broad Kingdom-wide issues only, such as who we should attack, or which tech-path we should pursue, but prohibit any 'micro' talk such as which cities should build which units/improvements, or work such-and-such tiles, or settle a city in such-and-such spot etc. (?). Therefore the 'King/Queen' gets a sense of what their 'Advisors' (the roster) wants from a very general perspective, but still gets autonomy to run the Kingdom as they see fit. I have no idea if it'd work or not, but it's a thought.

    If I were to play, I'm happy to play whatever leader the roster prefers, although in terms of map set up I'd rather not play on quick or marathon speeds.
     
  3. Lord Civius

    Lord Civius Emperor

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    Thanks for the post Cam. Seems the Dynasty Game didn't catch mush traction this time around so I am cool with just doing a normal succession game. I am updating the original post and will go with a random leader and civ from the list above. I will post the genesis save in the next day or two and get rolling.
     
  4. Cam_H

    Cam_H Deity

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    Sure ... sounds good. :)
     
  5. obsolete

    obsolete Deity

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    Not having Rep is going to be very sh!ty for me. But since it's only immortal, what the hell.

    Let's go.
     
  6. Cam_H

    Cam_H Deity

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    Provided we by-pass; Monotheism, The Pyramids, and Schwedagon Paya, we can still select a lot of other civics (including Representation).

    A Representation - Bureaucracy - Slavery/Caste - Pacifism set up would be possible for instance.

    Not really what's trying to be achieved with the variant I'm guessing, but still it's an option under the proposed rules at this point.
     
  7. Revent

    Revent Will SIP

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    I'll be up for this as well. :)

    I've just found myself with a lot more free time since the 7th so lets go for it! :)
     
  8. Cam_H

    Cam_H Deity

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    Sounds like you've been injured, expelled, or fired! :eek:
     
  9. Revent

    Revent Will SIP

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    I just finished studying for this test last week :) That's the only academic thing I'll be doing until September or October so all my free time is available for Civ :D
     
  10. Lord Civius

    Lord Civius Emperor

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    welcome to the game Revent and obsolete. I have added you guys to the roster.

    I am firing up the game now so I will be posting the Genesis save shortly.
     
  11. Lord Civius

    Lord Civius Emperor

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    After 8 tries we finally got a combination from the list, King Pacal II of Khmer. I could have thought of some better leaders+Civs but I also could think of some far worse.





    Go ahead and fire up the save and look everything over and we can start discussing where to settle and are strategy. We are using Civ4 BTS 3.19 with no mods.
     

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  12. Cam_H

    Cam_H Deity

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    Thanks for getting this map up.

    Very pleased to see Pacal. I guess if nothing else, with the Khemer at least we get Mining.

    To start the discussion;

    I often lean to S.I.P. as I eventually end up getting dudded when I don't, but ...

    ... the tile between the Corn and the Cows looks fairly reasonable to me: We'd pick up the Cows and the second Floodplains, however there's a tile that looks like Desert to the east. We'll miss a levee and Hydro Plant by not settling on the river, but I'm not sure if we need to worry too much about that - at least health won't be much of a problem.

    Interestingly, the computer's put a 'blue circle' on the dry Grassland tile immediately North of the Cows. Maybe more seafood to the East?

    Before we leave the S.I.P. spot, maybe move the Scout to examine North West of Settler? Alternately, we could check out why there's a 'blue circle' on what looks like a so-so choice?

    I'd build a cheap 'expansive' Worker and research Bronze Working ... 'chop chop'!
     
  13. Revent

    Revent Will SIP

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    Move scout northwest of the settler I think.
    Tile between cow and corn looks to be a solid food spot!
     
  14. Lord Civius

    Lord Civius Emperor

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    Nice observations guys, I am inclined to SIP. I think we can put all of that wood to good use and chop a few workers+ settler then start whipping. There are also another 3 tiles to the north and one NWW that may give us another resource, though the odds are pretty slim. It also looks like we have atleast 2 more forests for chopping either way. Perhaps we could send the scout 1NW to scope that out asRevent suggested..

    So here is where we are

    either move scout to cows or 1NW
    either SIP or settle between corn and cows.

    I vote to move the scout 1NW and see for sure because as Cam said I have also been bit in the ass too many times for not SIP.

    Any other suggestions or comments? Lurkers are welcome too ;)
     
  15. Cam_H

    Cam_H Deity

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    [Crosspost]

    Yeah ... between Cows and Corn doesn't look like an especially great :commerce: site, but could be good from a :hammers: or :gp: perspective.

    Sheesh ... we haven't even moved the Scout and I'm already thinking that we should consider re-locating our Palace at some point! :lol:

    S.I.P. does look weak ... I'm fine to check it out more with the Scout and the proposed NW-of-Settler suggestion.

    I'll be interested in obsolete's views. :)
     
  16. Lord Civius

    Lord Civius Emperor

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    Seems we are pretty much in agreement to send the scout 1NW so I will go ahead and make the move and then update the screenshot. Then once we have the info we can all, including obsolete, can make an informed decision.

    Screenie has been updated and we have one more corn in the BFC if we settle in place.

    EDIT: Put the new updated save in this post.
     

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  17. Revent

    Revent Will SIP

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    SIP looks a lot more appealing now. :)
     
  18. Cam_H

    Cam_H Deity

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    "Gah!" Now it's more difficult! ;)

    It's a shame both Corns are dry. I guess Agriculture just elevated itself to possibly #1 pursuit too if we do settle in place (I was keen to get to Bronze Working). It also leaves 'blue circle' or something near there to share two or three Cottages with the capital.

    At this point my opinion's divided, although I can certainly live with settle in place.

    Before we get much further ... Lord Civius ... can you just confirm the variant for me? ... Can we 'say' adopt Slavery or Caste pre-Feudalism, or are we stuck with Tribalism? Similarly, can we adopt Bureaucracy pre-Feudalism or must we stick with Barbarism? As per my earlier comment, we can easily avoid Organised Religion, Vassalage, and Serfdom and adopt other civics by not acquiring select 'optional' technologies and Wonders if it's permissible.
     
  19. Lord Civius

    Lord Civius Emperor

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    My first thought was we would have those civics for the entire game (once available of course). Hadn't really thought of avoiding them since the game is centered around being a middle age kingdom. You brought up the idea of avoiding the techs and that is perfectly acceptable according to the rules. Now we would also have to also avoid the Wonders that make these civics available, like mids if we ever want representation. To answer your question Cam, we can adopt any civic we want in any category as long as the mandated civic is not yet available.

    If we SIP I would still favor BW to chop workers and settlers while teching Ag and fishing.
     
  20. Lord Civius

    Lord Civius Emperor

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    I plan to play the first 10 (20?) turns tonight so everyone give their suggestions, especially as far as settler and tech path. I am leaning toward SIP, build worker and research path Ag-->BW. Work the corn 3F until we pop then switch over to river floodplain 3F1C. Then we can farm the corns while teching BW.
     

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