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Ed hinting at more South American civs

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by JtW, May 28, 2016.

  1. Zaarin

    Zaarin Chief Medical Officer, DS9

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    Arguing that the Maya and Aztecs overlap is kind of like arguing that Byzantium and the Ottomans overlap. Yes, there was some very minor overlap in the southernmost part of the Aztec range and the northernmost part of the Mayan range (if you disregard the several centuries of separation), but the heartland of the Aztec culture was in central Mexico while the Mayan heartland was in Guatamala--a long way from each other.

    At any rate, if we have multiple South American civs, I would prefer Native civs, but if we must have colonial civs I'd favor Gran Colombia over Brazil or any other post-colonial nation. But as I said in another thread, I'm not a fan of modern nations. Plus Brazil is just straight up obnoxious as an AI opponent. ;)
     
  2. GenyaArikado

    GenyaArikado Judge of Love

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    Aztecs, Mayans and Incas: fair enough. But some random natives over Gran Colombia, Brazil and Argentina? No thanks. Its not the spaniard fault that they were successful
     
  3. ehecatzin

    ehecatzin Emperor

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    One more point for Mapuches then, they kicked the Incas butt back into the mountains several times, and resisted the Spanish for 3 centuries, hardly random natives.
     
  4. True_Candyman

    True_Candyman Emperor

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    Well that's kinda my point, it's all Spain.

    Equally, the Spanish were successful not in small part because they pried the valuables from the diseased corpses of people's like the Muisca, who were so loaded with gold and valuables that their coronation ceremonies involved dunking their leader covered with gold dust into a lake.
     
  5. ldvhl

    ldvhl ніщо

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    Are you saying that you don't like the indigenous peoples of South America, or that you know about them and don't think they'd fit well in the game?
     
  6. Civciv5

    Civciv5 Grand Emperor

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    "Gran Columbia" barely existed for 10 years, how can you even call that a civilization? :lol:

    Brazil and Argentina, like Australia, Canada and South Africa are modern nations, not really civilizations. Wait another hundred years, then they might qualify, but not now.
     
  7. ldvhl

    ldvhl ніщо

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    Could you define "civilization" to include everything that is a civilization and exclude everything that isn't? Because so far as I understand it, everything you listed there is also a civ.
     
  8. Ezumiyr

    Ezumiyr Warlord

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    The Mapuche are quite emblematic indeed. They're probably one of the most famous cultures in South America (and anyway they are more famous than the Shoshone, which I was surprised to see in the game).

    Argentina is also a serious challenger. Could also be the Tupi.
    Nazca is too information-lacking. We don't even know their leaders. Very unlikely I think.
     
  9. Civciv5

    Civciv5 Grand Emperor

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    I don't know how I would define civilization in the traditional sense of the word.
    But all I know nation ≠ civilization in this game.

    A civilization would be a complex society of sentient beings who work and live together under some kind of government, with their own culture: customs, cuisine, architecture, traditions... While also lasting for several hundred years, not necessarily in an independent form, having some kind of impact, constructing monumental buildings, having their own religion(s), ideologies, philosophies etcetera...

    Gran Colombia would absolutely not qualify, it'd be like including the Confederate States of America.
    Most countries which emerged from European colonies would not qualify either, with the exception of the United States of America, whose status as civilization is undeniable.
     
  10. ehecatzin

    ehecatzin Emperor

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    The thing is, that is your opinion and the devs clearly think otherwise, America was always treated like the exception in Civ, but with the inclusion of Brazil your argument really doesn't hold, the devs clearly want post colonial representation besides the US. Now does that mean we'll see more than 2 post colonials in Civ6? we don't know, however there's nothing stopping them from doing so.

    I think most people's rational in supporting Gran Colombia despite it being a short lived nation, is that it actually encompasses a lot of latin American nations, it represents the revolutionary ideals of the XIX century and has a badass iconic leader to boost. It's the closer you can get to a historical blob civ that people represented wouldnt mind (seeing as all the countries that came out of it regard Bolivar as a common founding figure).

    Now sure you can argue against post colonial civs, and thats fine, but we know this is not beyond the devs to do, even more now with the South American TSL comment.
     
  11. Veras

    Veras Prince

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    I think the return of the Incas are a safe bet. I hope Brazil make a comeback too, as I think most people appreciate our portrait in Civ V (a little stereotyped but that's ok) and considering that tourism is back as well.

    Really want to see Gran Colombia led by Simón Bolivar. Not for the country itself, which was shortlived, but because of Bolivar and the ideals of liberation, decolonization and panamericanism he represented, which impacts all Spanish South America until today and stands the test of time. His Agenda could be to free any city in his continent who fell under foreign occupation.

    I'm totally in favor of the Mapuches too. Lautaro and Caupolitán could make great leader choices.

    If they'll really add more south american civs than before, then those 4 could totally be in sooner or later.
     
  12. GenyaArikado

    GenyaArikado Judge of Love

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    I just dont wanna play as them. I wouldnt mind them added but I prefer the 3 civs i mentioned. I dont see why are people are so triggered lmao. Argentina and Brazil are still nations today and the colonial period/Bolivar are pretty representative of the 3 northern Latin America nations. Just like you dislike "more spaniards" i dislike that all the representation latin/south america gets are snowing natives

    Gran Colombia would be representative of the 3 north latin america nations (Venezuela, Colombia, Ecuador. None of them too relevant on their own so individually they just arent going to happen). USA is a modern nation. Zulus werent a civilization. If chileans consider mapuches representative of their country cool then, I have never heard of them before today.
     
  13. Scorched Earth

    Scorched Earth Chieftain

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    I would would love to see Bolivar as well, but would they really call his civ Gran Colombia? What about just Colombia or Venezuela?

    If Spain isn't included at launch, I hope we can at least get a modern South American civ such as Argentina to fill in the continent and represent Hispanic culture as well.
     
  14. GenyaArikado

    GenyaArikado Judge of Love

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    Because i find unlikely that they will do Venezuela or Colombia alone (and if they do Colombia and not Venezuela with Bolivar as leader the death threats /insults/bullying are gonna start raining down upon Firaxis since thats our irl UA)
     
  15. Veras

    Veras Prince

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    I think it should not only for the fact that historical Gran Colombia was composed by Colombia/Venezuela/Equador/Panama (giving more relevant city options, compassing more territory and people), but also because the ideal of Gran Colombia ends up representing many other latin american nations as well, while Colombia is just Colombia and Venezuela just Venezuela.
     
  16. poom3619

    poom3619 Ping Pang Poom!

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    Hmm, I think Firaxis better take your opinion on this matter and do someone else like Tupi.

    IMO, wrongful depiction of Bolivar could generate controversy. You know, "Bolivarian" states probably won't be really happy if Firaxis make his Civ6 leaderscene, even if they won't give him streotypical conquistador armor like they did in Civ 4 : Colonization.
     
  17. Scorched Earth

    Scorched Earth Chieftain

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    That's true, but as you and others have pointed out, Gran Colombia was such a short-lived state that it might seem odd to use that name for Bolivar's civ. I don't know how they would handle it.
     
  18. GenyaArikado

    GenyaArikado Judge of Love

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    Who? Im sorry, Firaxis doesnt do irrelevant :)

    Wtf are you talking about in the second parraph lmao
     
  19. poom3619

    poom3619 Ping Pang Poom!

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    I'll just put this here then.

     
  20. GenyaArikado

    GenyaArikado Judge of Love

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    No thanks i'll stick to Pedro, Evita and El Libertador.
     

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