Elon Musk: Force for anthropic advancement or self-serving con-artist?

I doubt that too - Democratic or Republican is only significant to US Americans, OP isn't even from there...
It's significant enuf that half the people in the presidential race thread are not Americans.

It mostly seems that Musk tried to tie himself to the Gop, possibly so that he would have an ally. Afaik this wasn't prominent at all before the barrage of criticism against Musk, and therefore the criticisms didn't rise from Musk being tied to Gop and a culture war.
Maybe it was his sociopathic or simply calculative move that tribalism can help him sustain fans, even if they are now politically tinted. May be similar to how shady businessmen buy sports-teams so as to have some political clout (since the fans vote).
I think you're overthinking it. He just likes to rile.

Musk's satellites 'blocking' view of the universe​

Radio waves from Elon Musk’s growing network of satellites are blocking scientists’ ability to peer into the universe, according to researchers in the Netherlands.
The new generation of Starlink satellites, which provide fast internet around the world, are interfering more with radio telescopes than earlier versions, they say.
The thousands of orbiting satellites are “blinding” radio telescopes and may be hindering astronomical research, according to Netherlands Institute for Radio Astronomy (ASTRON).
SpaceX, which owns Starlink, has not replied to a request from BBC News for comment.

The satellites provide broadband internet around the world, often to remote places, including challenging environments like Ukraine and Yemen.

They are also used to connect remote areas of the UK to fast internet. In 2022 tests showed that Starlink could deliver internet speeds four times faster than the average, according to the Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport.

But astronomers say this comes at a cost.

"Every time more of these are launched with these kinds of emission levels, we see less and less of the sky," Professor Jessica Dempsey, director of ASTRON, told BBC News.

"We're trying to look at things like the jets, which are emitted from black holes in the centre of galaxies. We also look at some of the earliest galaxies, millions and millions of light years away, as well as exoplanets," she said, highlighting the areas the satellite radiation is affecting.

Interference from the second generation, or V2, satellites was found by ASTRON to be 32 times stronger than the first generation.

The amount of radiation emitted exceeds regulations set by the industry body the International Telecommunications Union, Prof Dempsey added.

One estimate suggests there are 6,402 Starlink satellites currently in orbit at around 342 miles (550km) above Earth, making it the largest provider by far.

The satellites are relatively large - with 3m flat panels and an 8m solar array for power.

SpaceX's main competitor, OneWeb, has fewer than 1,000. But it is a growing business area. Amazon is developing its own network and hopes to launch at least 3,000 in the next few years.

By 2030 the number of satellites in orbit is expected to surpass 100,000.

The study was done using the LOFAR radio telescope in the Netherlands on a single day in July earlier this year.

Many objects in space, including distant galaxies and planets, emit light on the electromagnetic spectrum.

This radiation travels like waves and radio telescopes can pick up on those waves, allowing us to get a picture of things we can't see with our eyes.

But those waves are being disturbed by satellites.

The scientists found unintended electromagnetic radiation from almost all the V2 Starlink satellites observed.

It was about 10 million times brighter than from the weakest sources of light identified, they say.

Lead author Cees Bassa said it was like comparing the “faintest stars visible to the naked eye and the brightness of the full Moon.”
“Since SpaceX is launching about 40 second-generation Starlink satellites every week, this problem is becoming increasingly worse," he added.
Robert Massey, Deputy Executive Director of the Royal Astronomical Society in the UK, said: "it's very clear that if you have something this bright that is compromising a major radio observatory this much, then we need to do something and we need to do it quickly."
Asked about the value of the astronomy research, he said: "it's wrong to say that there is some science that you can simply dismiss. The applications may be decades or even longer in the future but they can be very fundamental and very important."
Scientists are also worried about light pollution from the satellites, and fear it is also interfering with optical telescopes.
Astronomers say they talked to SpaceX about radiation from the first generation of satellites and the company listened to their concerns.
But ASTRON now say the V2 have been found to be even more powerful.
"Turning LOFAR back up and seeing these booming signals from these new generation of V2 Mini SpaceX satellites was a bit shocking," says Prof Dempsey.
"This is actually threatening the entirety of ground based astronomy in every wavelength and in different ways. If it continues, without the sort of mitigation to make these satellites quiet, then it does become an existential threat for the kinds of astronomy we do," Prof Dempsey added.
The researchers stress that more regulation of space and how satellites operate is needed to avoid scientific work being compromised.
They said that as the largest provider of satellites, SpaceX could set a standard for limiting pollution.
Prof Dempsey said that simple actions like shielding the battery on the satellite could make a big difference and reduce the radiation emitted.
Some interference comes from faulty electronics, so this could prevent that happening.
But without action, “very soon the only constellations we will see will be human-made,” she added.
The findings are published in the scientific journal Astronomy and Astrophysics.
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cy4dnr8zemgo
Yeah orbiting space junk a big problem but like most of humanity's other big problems we can't worry about a solution rn we're too busy making the problem worse.

That's pretty awful poetry.

May as well tell people to go back to simpler days when they thought Santa was real.

There is still plenty of religious nations in the world and they're generally crime ridden and miserable. People seek out religion out of desperation but that's doesn't mean it works and they're 'not sad' afterwards. I guess it's like watching tele, when you forgot what's real and distract yourself w fantasy you're still depressed but you're a lil dissociated from it.
 
It's significant enuf that half the people in the presidential race thread are not Americans.
(...)

Sure - but both your political parties look much the same to me, Trump is not particularly "right" by old European standards, nor is Harris particularly "left"...

Both your parties subscribe to US constitution for example (liberal) and they all swear on the Bible (conservative) - they are not particularly radical either, none strives for a completely different political system in the US, they both seek to maintain the status quo.

The difference is more in the details...like abortion or migration.

Certainly a preference for the one party or the other would not dictate an opinion on Elon Musk.
 
Last edited:
musk is part of a general concept of breaking up the US Aerospace industry into smaller parts without overheads . Like paying money to retirees . Zuckerberg might have been there with enough incentives but he didn't want the part of looking like a Bond villain .
 
How many of you believe the same people would have come together and worked with the full faith that everyone else was working with the full faith to deliver the same or better results from 2008-2018 in private space tech and electric cars and batteries had there been no Musk?
This is counterfactual.
 
Well, Toyota has been developing their own solid state battery technology since 2012. They've made hybrid cars since the 1990s. The 1st commercial generation is expected to land in the market in 2027, making the current Li-ion batteries in use more or less obsolete with regards to driving range.

The point is that Tesla isn't driving the market for EVs anymore and hasn't been for a while. Tesla seem more focused on earning profits for its investors and lowering prices, than spearheading the development of better EVs.
 
The point is that Tesla isn't driving the market for EVs anymore and hasn't been for a while. Tesla seem more focused on earning profits for its investors and lowering prices, than spearheading the development of better EVs.
It's not that I disagree with you, but I think you are downplaying a lot of Tesla innovation and current good share in the BEV market.
That being said:
1. Tesla is battery wise very well equipped, their cars still have consistently good range specially for their price. Lithium battery technology/chemistry is still being improved. Sure, solid state batteries are the dream but to become standard they must convince battery plants owners to change their production lines and invest in new machinery, this will take years;

2. Tesla software also works reasonably good, when comparing to other legacy ICE OEM brands, for example: VAG group BEVs have been plagued with software issues for ages and they don't seem to be improving that much;

3. Gigacasting with all the problems it still has, check Tesla owners with huge chassis cracks, can greatly reduce the number of parts in a vehicle and thus making it's manufacturing more environmentally and, maybe, consumer friendly if the savings are passed on to the costumer. I believe that with proper refinement gigacasting will become standard in car manufacturing, Toyota is already looking into that.
 
Impossible to determine, given the possibility space across the period of time you're asking about. But it's hardly the impossibility you seem to be inferring.
The guys who founded Tesla before him already were on to it. Musks’s grand ideas have always been the most low hanging fruit as good ideas. However he is still a common denominator in multiple industries that were basically considered infeasible due to timelines that were longer than investor expectations. All of these required coordination, faith, and leadership. I don’t see a better counter explanation even if even a chunk of company resources was to “handle” him to be as hands off as possible.
 
The guys who founded Tesla before him already were on to it. Musks’s grand ideas have always been the most low hanging fruit as good ideas. However he is still a common denominator in multiple industries that were basically considered infeasible due to timelines that were longer than investor expectations. All of these required coordination, faith, and leadership. I don’t see a better counter explanation even if even a chunk of company resources was to “handle” him to be as hands off as possible.
How do you reconcile "coordination, faith and leadership" with "handling him" (to be as far away from the actual work as possible)?
 
Very easily.
 
Tesla was close to going under at some time with a +$20bn debt mountain hanging around its neck. Musk's ability to convince investors of the company's potential and future market dominance, saved it. The majority of his wealth was created from selling overpriced Tesla stock and receiving insane bonus payouts.
 
News-based anecdote:

1726949321725.png


I got it from Twitter, but the Tweet isn't super-useful by itself (despite being funny). Title should be enough to find it though.
 
Given that the idiot was (even temporarily) prepared to have the access of potentially tens of millions of accounts in Brazil blocked just to avoid blocking seven others himself, one wonders why he was so quick to comply with demands from Turkish and Indian authorities.
 

Musk hits back after being shunned from UK summit​

The world's richest person, Elon Musk, has hit back after not being invited to the UK government's International Investment Summit.
He was not invited due to his social media posts during last month’s riots, the BBC understands.
"I don’t think anyone should go to the UK when they’re releasing convicted pedophiles in order to imprison people for social media posts," Mr Musk claimed on X.
Earlier this month, the government released some prisoners to reduce prison overcrowding, but no people serving sentences for sex offences were included.

Following disorder and rioting across the UK in August, some people were jailed for encouraging unrest on social media.
Violence spread across the country after a stabbing attack in Southport, in which three children attending a dance class were killed. At the time, Mr Musk posted on X, formerly Twitter, predicting civil war in the UK and repeatedly attacking the prime minister.
The summit in October is the key moment that PM Sir Keir Starmer hopes will attract tens of billions of pounds in inward funding for business from the world’s biggest investors.
Mr Musk was invited to last year's event but did not attend. However, he took a starring role in November's AI Summit, including a fireside chat with then-PM Rishi Sunak.
The government declined to comment on the tech entrepreneur not being invited to the summit and the billionaire's backlash to the decision.

During the August riots, Mr Musk shared, and later deleted, a conspiracy theory about the UK building "detainment camps" on the Falkland Islands for rioters, on X - the social media platform he owns.
At the time ministers said his comments were "totally unjustifiable" and "pretty deplorable".
The BBC understands this is why he has not been invited to join hundreds of the world’s biggest investors at the event on 14 October.

Musk's presence 'unthinkable'​

The government’s decision not to invite Mr Musk to the investment summit suggests that it thinks the potential investment is not worth the reputational risk and opens up uncomfortable questions about the background of other investors it has actively encouraged.
Attracting international investment routinely involves charm offensives with investors or nations with questionable human rights records.
The government has actively pursued trade links in the Gulf. Sir Keir, for example, publicly boycotted the 2022 World Cup in Qatar as leader of the opposition, but now he and his team routinely visit these nations to drum up trade and investment.
A number of top sovereign wealth fund executives are expected at the summit next month.
Privately, insiders suggested that Mr Musk’s presence at such a summit would be unthinkable given his comments about the UK last month.
Coming two weeks head of the Budget, the government is billing it as a huge opportunity to attract foreign investment to grow the UK economy. The Labour Party committed before the general election to hold this event within its first 100 days in office.
Under the Conservatives, Mr Musk, who owns or runs X, Tesla and SpaceX, was quietly shown around various UK sites with potential for a gigafactory for cars and batteries.
He has previously told journalists he opened a site in Germany and not the UK partly because of Brexit.
He is a regular at the equivalent French summit. In July, he attended a three-hour lunch with top executives with President Emmanuel Macron ahead of the Paris Olympics earlier this summer.
Under his ownership of the site formerly known as Twitter, Mr Musk lifted the ban on far-right figures, including on the Britain First group.
The UK is considering a tougher Online Safety Act, after the role of misinformation in the widespread racist disorder in August.

Who is Elon Musk and what is his net worth?​

He is the world's richest person and has used his platform to make his views known on a vast array of topics.
Bloomberg estimates his net worth to be around $228bn.
That's based largely on the value of his shares in Tesla, of which he owns more than 13%. The company's stock soared in value - some say unreasonably - in 2020 as the firm's output increased and it started to deliver regular profits.
Since bursting on to the Silicon Valley scene more than two decades ago, the 53-year-old serial entrepreneur has kept the public captivated with his business antics.
Born in Pretoria, South Africa, Mr Musk showed his talents for entrepreneurship early, going door to door with his brother selling homemade chocolate Easter eggs and developing his first computer game at the age of 12.
For a long time Mr Musk, who became a US citizen in 2002, resisted efforts to label his politics - calling himself "half-Democrat, half-Republican", "politically moderate" and "independent".
He says he voted for Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton and - reluctantly - Joe Biden, all of them Democrats.
But in recent years he's swung behind Donald Trump, who is a Republican. Mr Musk officially endorsed the former president for a second term in 2024 after his attempted assassination.
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c756d56d2dro
 
Well, Elon Musk's staff is reported to be actually running Donald Trump's campaign.
 
Devastation in Western North Carolina from the Helene storm, many dead, no power and phone service out across the region but I was able to contact my family members there thanks to Elon Musk's Starlink.

Nice work Elon.
 
I still say con artist

The new valuation from Fidelity implies that it believes X is now worth just $9.4 billion — a far cry from the $44 billion that Musk paid. Other investors could value X differently.
(…)
Munster said that in the long run, he thinks X and the data the company has access to will be worth more than the $44 billion that Musk paid for Twitter.

(source)​

Just get a lot of people's personal info without paying those people anything ever and steal a good chunk of their life histories.
 
Self-serving con artist it is yet again! Elon Musk pays the $5 million fine imposed by Brazilian authorities, but pays it into the wrong account.
 
Back
Top Bottom