Embassy with Anarchie

[Cyc]

Don't our Workers count on our Military Strenth compared to others? Even though they have no off/def value, don't they still count as military units. And I should have said Swords, not Pikes.

EDIT: Ok, did some testing. Although the Workers are tied to our Military budget, they don't add to our strength. It was just too hard to believe that with 4 Warriors, a Dromon, and a Curragh we were strong to the Kitchen.

 

[Calis]

That is why there is no real thread at this moment.

 

[Chamnix]

From d7 ~

Dear Eagles,

some of us think that it is critically important for both the Eagles and the free people to come to a close cooperation very soon. We have been thinking about what the Küche is planning, and I personally believe they are planning a surprise attack against either you or us.

It is crucial to find out what civilization the Küche is playing. From watching F11 we are quite sure that they are industrious. We also know that they are neither agricultural (rules), seafaring (slow ships), religious (long phase of anarchy) nor scientific (no free tech). So only three civilizations remain:

* Americans (ridiculous, no usable UU and useless trait, you _would_ have seen their scout),
* French (very well possible),
* Chinese.

That the Küche keeps repeating that _we_ need Chivalry and never talk about Invention may be a clue that their unique unit needs Chivalry, i.e. that they are Chinese, and nobody plays a militaristic civilization without planning war.

Together we can make a simple test as to what their intentions are: You can suggest to remove Chivalry from the research pact because "nobody needs or wants it". Jus tell them that you talked to us and that we did not really want Chivalry, and that two peacefull peoples like the Eagles and the Küche have no need whatsoever for that dead end tech that just costs everybody money and has no practical use. If they still insist on Chivalry, they must have a _very_ good reason to do so.

Please do keep in mind that if the Küche plays the Chinese, they are bound to attack _you_ shortly after Chivalry is researched. Here is some of the evidence:

* The Küche has horses connected.

* We are currently in a discussion with the Küche because we want them to pay some of the 308 1/3 Gold pieces they currently owe us before we get Feudalism. And know what? They outright _refuse_ to pay their debts, inventing lots of fake reasons why they can't pay and that they are not obliged to pay anything because of some calculation where they research the same amount of beakers as everybody else does - but actually they have not been researching anything for more than ten turns.

* We are now in our golden age in despotism. We know how much money _we_ make per turn. Speaking of _commerce_, the golden age in despotism is weaker than just being in the republic. So they must make considerably _more_ money than we do. We have a net profit of 77 coins per turn. The Küche told us they are sending you 50 gold per turn, so this leaves at least a gain of 27 gold per turn plus the money they received from the Knights. Yet they told us that they are not hoarding money, which is quite clearly a lie.

Given that, saving 480 or 600 gold coins to upgrade four to five horsemen is not too difficult for the Küche. Also, five horsemen wont show as a noticeable military service of F11 or F3. But five Ansar warriors are enough to conquer your whole realm if you don't have a solid defense.

--

This scenario is not proven, but if that's what they are planning and they pull it off, it will be the end for you and for us.

--

So to better judge the situation, we have given you some information and want to ask you some questions. Honest answers may help us to pin down the plans of the Küche:

1. How strong is your military compared to the Küche (F3 and F11)? Were there any recent changes (in which turns)?
2. Did you swap maps with the Küche? Did they sell _your_ maps to the Knights?
3. Do you know which civilization they play? Finding that out is _crucial_ for us.

--

We are thinking about offering you a close cooperation, because at the moment we are hard pressed by the Knights who enjoy the Küche's support. Without a strong partner, we are destined to perish soon. If you are interested in intensifying our relations, we will offer some deals that should strengthen both of us.

A voice of the free people

P.S.: As time for diplomacy seems to be somewhat scarce for you Eagles: Would you prefer shorter messages with less text and just a few topics, or long ones with all things to negotiate in one message?

I think our response to Anarchie is:

• Thank them profusely.
• Let them know we are following their advice and telling Kuche that neither Eagles nor Anarchie really cares about Chivalry.
• Our military strength has been comparable to Kuche's throughout the game so far.
• We traded maps with Kuche a long time ago, but we have no knowledge of any trades Kuche has made with the Knights (including trading our map) other than what Anarchie has told us.
• We do not know Kuche's tribe, but we agree that they are industrious.
• We will continue to communicate openly with Anarchie as we hear Kuche's response to our request to drop Chivalry from the treaty.

 

[Calis]

I will try to set up some answers tomorrow...

 

[Calis]

Proposal for a response:

Dear free people,

We are really grateful for receiving the open and detailed information you share with us.

We want to comment on your points as follows:

1. Chivalry: As you also see no need for Chivalry we will inform Kueche about the fact that we do not want to research it, as there are other plans in our desk.

2. Military: Our military strength has been comparable to that of Kuche all over the game.

3. Kueche and Knights: Many turns ago, we swapped maps with Kueche. We do not know whether they sold the maps to the Brotherhood. Also we do not know of any further deals between the teams, just what you told us.

4. Kueches tribe: We do not know who they really are. But we agree with you that they are industrious.

Rest assure that we will keep close contact to you. We will inform you about any news we will get, especially Kueches reaction regarding our refusal to research chivalry.

Calis of the Flock

 

[Cyc]

Looks good.

 

[Chamnix]

 

[Chamnix]

I think we owe Anarchie a note saying that Kuche has decided to research Chivalry themselves, but I don't know what else to say right now...

 

[Calis]

From Anarchie:

Any progress regarding the Küche and Chivalry?

 

[Calis]

Proposed reply:

We owe you an apology for our missing statement:

Kueche said, as you and we seem uninterested, they think they should research it on their own, which probably is going to take some time.

 

[Calis]

No objections, so I posted it, slightly modified...

 

[Calis]

And more questions...

"... they should research it ..."

As part of the research treaty, or just for their own fun?

--

Can you tell us the turn when we get Feudalism?

 

[Cyc]

The Kitchen arbitrarily made it part of the research treaty...

we will sent you 50 gold each turn until we saved enough money to pay out the rest at once. We regret that you seem to have no use for Chivalry. But since you will only pay one third of its cost the damage will be relativly small. We will pay our share on this and we expect Anarchie to honor the agreement, too. ~ Cotta

If the Kitchen is refusing to pay the Anarchy on part of their deal, them researching Chivalry and demanding payment could be the wrench in the gears for us.

 

[Bowsling]

So now they want us to pay for it too?

 

[Cyc]

So now they want us to pay for it too?

Actually, that was a message from the begining of this conversation. I was researching the discussion to find this quote. We may want to take a closer look at the Kitchen's motives.

 

[Chamnix]

I would stick with our original prognostication of turn 100 (I think?) for Feudalism. We still don't want them to get it any earlier than necessary.

 

[Calis]

Note I would post.

Feudalism will be available on turn 100.

As for them self-researching Chivalry. From our poit of view it never has been a part of the treaty officially, as we (as mentioned before) never agreed to research it.

And please assure that we won't finish it before, as they would see it.

 

[Chamnix]

 

[Calis]

Ridiculous.

Anarchie (or d7 of Anarchie) is complaining that they always have to do their moves an Saturdays. He want a rule that changes this. Otherwise he threatens to leave the team/game.

But it seems that another player is going to take over. (PaGe).

I think that if the team is taken out of the game, the game is dead. this would cause a complete inbalance.

 

[Chamnix]

I can't really follow the discussion in the turn thread (since I'm sure Google's translation is imperfect, at best), but I don't understand why Anarchie is having so much trouble finding a turn player. The saves we send to them are typically downloaded 5-7 times - can't any of those people play a turn?