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Emperor Cookbook V: Saladin

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by ChromiumL, Mar 18, 2009.

  1. ChromiumL

    ChromiumL Warlord

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2008
    Messages:
    263
    The Emperor Cookbook is a concurrent succession game series to help readers learn how to play and win at Emperor level in Civilization 4: Beyond the Sword, v3.17

    This is the 5th game of the series.

    For more information or to discuss the format, please visit the Monarchist Cookbook Bullpen.

    ========

    Our fifith Emperor Cookbook game features Saladin. We will be playing at Emperor difficulty, epic speed, standard size fractal map (with low sea level). This is NOT an isolated/island start! Huts and events are disabled for this game, as they tend to make things more random.

    Here is the info on our leader, his unique unit and building as well as our starting position and settings:

    Spoiler :


    Our Fearless Leader:



    Our Starting Location:



    His UU:



    His UB:





    ========

    Round one lasts from 4000 BC - 1500 BC.

    Please play this round and submit your report into this thread by next Sunday (22nd).

    IMPORTANT: Please use spoilers if you want to discuss opening strategies prior to starting the round

    At the end of your Round, please remember to name your save with your name, game and Round # & game date (i.e. "EC2 Round 1 MyName BC-1500.CivBeyondSwordSave"). (And please don't forget to attach it to your Round report, either! )

    ========

    Roster:

    YOU! - contributor, voter - our most important fixture, the readers who follow the threads and play along.

    Now that we have upped the difficulty level, we will return to the 'best ball' system of selecting and playing saves. What this essentially means is that after we have completed each round, everyone will have a chance to vote on which save is in the best position. The winning save will be used for the next round.

    If there is any player who is strong at Emperor+ level, it would be great to have you post your saves to show us how it's done. However, I request that any of you who realize your round was far superior remove your save from the voting. This rule is intended to ensure that the game doesn't get into a overly strong winning position after only a few rounds (because what fun is that?).

    Voting Rules:

    1. You may NOT vote on your own save (but you are encouraged to state the strengths and weaknesses of your save)
    2. Only those who have posted a round may vote (those who are shadowing are always encouraged to express their opinion!). If someone misses a round, but have played all previous rounds, they may vote.
    3. Don't vote on a save that has voluntarily been removed from the running by the person who submitted it.
    4. At the end of each round you can vote on 3 saves for first, second and third place. I believe that these votes should be made publicly in order to allow for as much discussion as possible. I strongly encourage you to explain why you are voting for a particular save. This is one of the best ways to learn, and that's what this game is all about! If you feel uncomfortable voting publicly, PM me with your vote.
    5. How you vote is up to you. Some people may want to vote for the 'best' save, others may vote for saves which they feel provide the best learning experience. Just make sure to explain what criteria you are using for your vote (overall best, best learning experience, etc).

    After a couple days for voting and discussion a winner will be declared and we will move on to the next round.

    =======

    And with that, let the Game begin...

    ========

    Intrathread links (ToC): (note, the turn sets are subject to change, this is a tentative schedule to get this first round underway, we are still trying to find the best length for each round)

    Round 0: The starting save (this post)
    Round 1: 4000 BC - 1500 BC- MkLh
    Round 2: 1500 BC - 400 AD- Lansky
    Round 3: 400 AD - 1100 AD- Now Playing!!
    Round 4: 1100 AD - 1500 AD - upcoming
    Round 5: 1500 AD - 1700 AD - upcoming
    Round 6: 1700 AD - 1820 AD - upcoming
    Round 7: 1820 AD - 2050 AD - upcoming
     

    Attached Files:

  2. I-imp

    I-imp Warlord

    Joined:
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    I, the humble Prince/Monarch player, decided to play through this to 1500 BC. Honestly, I felt I could have done better (Like not letting the initial warrior get eaten:cry:) Maybe I could have even founded a religion, but felt it best to opt for something else. Like agriculture.

    Actually, I don't know how to write a report, so I'll let someone else go before me.
     
  3. timmy827

    timmy827 King

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2007
    Messages:
    657
    Location:
    Sunnyvale, CA
    I've spent too much time playing RB variants so I don't really know my skill level, but I would say that I am normally comfortable playing at Emperor.

    Spoiler :

    I doubt this first save is going to be the best though. Did not try for religion, could have had one though. Settled 1E to get very nice capital site. It was very tempting to settle 2nd city to get the pigs/gold in initial screenshot but as it became clear we are on peninsula, I pushed east with 2nd and 3rd cities to avoid being boxed in. That may have been suboptimal as it seems no AI's are at close to us - have met 4 but not found borders yet. Exploration has not been great, had poor luck getting explorers killed but that has been balanced out by good luck so far with a rather thin barb defense.

    Near priesthood for intended shot at Oracle (marble hooked up), although not sure what to take - with only Mansa founding a religion among met AI's I am tempted for CoL.

    Settler has just finished for city 4 and I have aimed at putting it south for pigs/gold by having worker road there and ready to chop for its monument, but other options are out there.

    Map and lands:

     

    Attached Files:

  4. Leventis

    Leventis Warlord

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2006
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    262
    The start looked like fun so I had a crack as well:

    Spoiler :




    Like timmy827, I thought 1E looked quite inviting and so I settled there, losing a turn in the process. Early tech path went Agri, Mining, BW and AH. Then went for masonry, pottery and got to writing before the other 4 civs. Took OB with Gilgamesh and scouted his land but the other 3 seem waaaay away somewhere SE. I decided against going after hunting --> archery as I often do, which meant I was forced to found a copper city. Settling in place at the start would have meant that copper would be attainable after the 2nd border pop, but I didn't have this option. I decided to settle here:



    Not a great 2nd city, truth be told, but I had little choice. I borrowed the corn from Mecca to give it a growth spurt for a while since the capital has plenty of food. Should be fine post irrigation and make a nice production city.

    Settled Damascus to grab marble, wheat and cow.



    The peaks aren't all bad, since when the border pops I will at least have a better fogbust to the east. And really, there is no rush to expand at the moment -- I was tempted to settle further out but it seemed risky to overstretch without a decent number of axes, not to mention the financial strain. The goldmine only goes so far.

    Have a handy Woodsman II warrior runing around out east:



    A few barb archers came for my capital just as I was getting a few axes out, but not before they razed a cottage.



    I also got a madrassa out really early in the capital to help boost the goldmine research. As yet, I haven't got OB with anyone except Gilgamesh (not much point), so will wait until I find the other civs.





    View attachment Leventis Emperor Cookbook BC-1500.CivBeyondSwordSave
     
  5. RJM

    RJM Prince

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2007
    Messages:
    335
    I have a question about the starting position. If you have already played any moves, please take care how you respond to avoid giving information about the map.

    Spoiler :
    There is a tile three south of our starting position that has access to pigs gold and corn - plus a flood plain. It seems to be coastal, although this needs to be confirmed (for example by moving the warrior). If it is coastal, do people think it's worth moving there before founding the city - particularly since in our starting position, the only visible resources in our fat cross are gold and wine? Alternatively doe we use it as a second city site. Should we move east to get the corn in our fat cross even though this also delays city foundation? Is there a case for moving north-west and founding on the first turn?


    RJM
     
  6. assass1n

    assass1n Warlord

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2008
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    275
    Location:
    Pune,India
    Food is crucial for capital, I would settle with corn in BFC
     
  7. RJM

    RJM Prince

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2007
    Messages:
    335
    Good point. It is possible that there is a food special in the BFC if we settle in place - there are 9 tiles that are not yet visible. Does the map generator guarantee us three resource specials?

    RJM
     
  8. assass1n

    assass1n Warlord

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Location:
    Pune,India
    First Round

    Spoiler :
    Techpath was
    Med > Agri > Min > BW > AH > Masonry > Pottery > Writing > Priesthood ( 1 Turn )

    Lost my screenshots PC restarted :mad:
    Met Musa :D Shaka,Giggles,GK :D
    Settled 1 City near the copper
    Another near the pigs
    We already have a route with Shaka and Mansa founded Hindu :goodjob:
    I got Stonehenge but don't think the Oracle would be necessary though I have researched Priesthood



    This is the save
    View attachment Emperor Cookbook assass1n BC-1500.CivBeyondSwordSave
     
  9. MkLh

    MkLh King

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2008
    Messages:
    903
    Location:
    Finland
    to 1500BC:

    Spoiler :

    I skipped an early religion because IMO it's not a good tech path for a civ that lacks almost all worker techs. Tech path was AG->AH->Mining->BW->Pottery->Writing->Poly->Priesthood, started CoL.

    Medina claims bronze, built Stonehenge also:

    Civ4ScreenShot0511.JPG

    1500BC: An annoying barb archer is about to pillage a gold mine. But that's just the price for placing Medina 2 tiles away from Bronze (I wanted that fish).

    Civ4ScreenShot0514.JPG

    There's a lot of land here:

    Civ4ScreenShot0515.JPG



    View attachment Emperor Cookbook BC-1500.CivBeyondSwordSave
     
  10. helemaalnicks

    helemaalnicks Warlord

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    234
    Spoiler :
    I don't get this game. I started a game, grabbed bronze on the first city. Though I'd be safe for the first border pop. No clue what I did wrong as opposed to f.e. the guy who founded horse city as his 3rd city. Barbarian entering my borders 2350BC:



    I'll submit a safe later where I'm almost dead.

    Ok, wasn't too bad, went into my borders, pillaged the corn, and went out again. Must be some kinda bug. Anyway. 1500BC, got bronzen fish up, and wheatcow marble. I just told shaka im not gonna stop dealing with the vile mali, and I will probably have a woodsmen 3 warrior next turn.

    Save:
     

    Attached Files:

  11. RJM

    RJM Prince

    Joined:
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    Spoiler :
    I decided to move my warrior ne to get as much map visibility as I could before deciding where to settle. After a lot of thought, I go for the plains site, adjacent to the coastal tile. Lost my warrior to a lion!
    1900 BC meet Shaka (by boat), but an archer arrives a few turns later, so he's on the same land mass. My techs were mining, BW, agric, pottery, writing, fishing, sailing, masonary, poly.

    RJM
     

    Attached Files:

  12. shyuhe

    shyuhe Deity

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    Location:
    Gone fishing for the summer
    It's irrigated corn to boot. You definitely want that and gold in your starting BFC.

    edit: and by gold, I mean the plains hill one, not the crappy desert one. Although irrigated corn + pigs + desert gold may be good as an alternative capital site. And yes it's coastal. Or at least on a big lake. The plains tile NW of the gold isn't "fresh".

    @hel:

    Spoiler :

    Barbs will enter borders if they're up against them and see an improvement they can pillage. But it doesn't mean they' continue towards you capital at such an early year. Also, I would settle the second city with copper in the first ring. Second ring takes too long to get access.

     
  13. RJM

    RJM Prince

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    Spoiler :

    I tend to run my defenses on the light side, but 2 warriors guarding 3 cities in 1500 BC is heroic! And 1 warrior guarding 3 cities leaves me speechless - whatever works for you I guess.

    RJM
     
  14. helemaalnicks

    helemaalnicks Warlord

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    Spoiler :
    lol, I know, miscalculated the bronzepop i guess. If I had axes as soon as the bronze got hooked I'd be fine, but that's obv not the case here. But the guy with the 3cities no copper setting has'nt build that much either. I guess I should've sidetracked through archery
     
  15. Leventis

    Leventis Warlord

    Joined:
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    Spoiler :
    Well, 3 cities + 2 warriors + Emperor = Welcome Barbs.
     
  16. helemaalnicks

    helemaalnicks Warlord

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    Spoiler :
    2 cities, one of em trying to hook bronze asap, but already know about it being bad. Im greedy, my second city shouldve been cr**y, or I should've settled in place. I know I seem like a newb with my save :D. But I haven't run in serious barb trouble for about 10-15 games now, so I'm not too worried about this aspect. Just bad timing on the mistake, doing it on a public game ;). However, if you look at the above saves, I'm not the only one falling for greed>defense mistake on this map. My save has a woodsman 3 going for it, consider that when voting, I could always whip the axes if I get in serious trouble.
     
  17. budweiser

    budweiser King of the Beers

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    There isnt much non-spoiler discussion about what to do first here. I think you move the warrior 1 NE to see whats there. Then move the settler 1E into the woods, possibly settling there next turn depending on what is revealed.

    Research AG, then Pottery, then mining? Or maybe AG, Mining, Pottery?
     
  18. helemaalnicks

    helemaalnicks Warlord

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    why pottery so early? I never did that before...
     
  19. budweiser

    budweiser King of the Beers

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    Partly because you are only 2 techs away from it, and early cottages will allow a bigger initial expansion. The UB is also a Library, you will want that sooner rather than later.

    Now, the gold partly mitigates the value of early cottages, but it also allows a higher happy cap so you can work more cottages.

    Now a certain strategy is becoming clear, once we have an improved tech rate via gold and cottages, we can begin to tech up the religion line, and make a stab at the Oracle. We could take MC from that, make earlier forges and increase happiness yet again. Or we could Oracle HR or CoL.

    This is the kind of discussion that I think people may find helpful.
     
  20. shyuhe

    shyuhe Deity

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    Here's a totally different take:

    Spoiler :

    I moved the warrior 1NE and didn't find anything new. I decided to go coastal though and sent the settler 2S from the start. I found the oasis and settled next to it, setting research to polytheism. Voila! Hinduism :D

    Here's the 1500 BC screen:



    Wonders are going very slow so oracle for CoL shouldn't be a problem here.
     

    Attached Files:

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