Emperor Cookbooks. Toku (Japan)

[pnp_dredd]

to 400ad:

Spoiler :

Looked over our position and decided to continue peaceful REXing for a little longer. Settled the GP farm first and began teching Aesthetics. Blocking city will become military pump. The plan was for the next two settlers to the South and East, then one to the copper.

Pillaged Mehmed's resources and try for peace. No go. He sends some archers at me. I steal another worker.

1350bc Tao, Christ and Conf all founded this turn!

1125bc I get peace with Mehmed. I get the southern city in place but Mehmood whips out a settler and founds a city to the East of our capital.

Oh well, the settler heads for the Copper site.

525bc Oracle built somewhere

485bc Mehmed declares on Hatty. Around here I turn up research to 100% (probably a bit early)

290bc Mehmed has two workers just hanging out there. I can't resist so I declare and take them. At this point I have around 6 axes, which isn't enough. Cut off his Iron (identified by a 5 hammer mine) with an axeman.

125bc discover aesthetics. Traded for IW and sailing to Joao. Couldn't get Alpha for Aesth from Joao or Pacal.

20bc Mansa finally gets Alpha. I trade him Maths for Aesth. Trad Maths+Aesth for Alpha+archery. IW for Poly+masonr. Alpha for priest and mono. Can't currently trade for Monarchy or Calendar.

Begin Literature. Having a look around, I really need religions/happy resources. The current 5 pop caps just sucks.

10AD take Ankara losing 1 Sword.

130AD Complete Literature. Begin GL and NE next turn. Not 100% confident that I'll get GL. Still need some more XP for HE.

145AD take Instanbul, losing about 4 axes and a couple Swords. Join a GG into my soon-to-be HE city. Take a cease fire with Mehmed.

220AD declare on Mehmed again. He's spread his axes out, some aren't in cities. Take Edirne without loss.

300AD Academy with GS into Kyoto (capital)

330 Destroy Mehmud's 2nd last city without loss. Temporary CF again.

355 Get COL, trade for currency/calendar. begin building courthouses.

Mehmed has a single crappy city left.

It may be more interesting to take the CR2&3 axes to Kublai. He's got no metal, and hasn't yet got Longbows. Mansa's got Longbows so he's not a target.

I've got 3 pure cottage cities, plus the capital is a hybrid (will rock once it gets GL).
The GP farm (National Epic) will be online in around 15 turns.
The other three cities are unit pumps - Osaka is building HE. Copper city has Maoi. Instanbul will also be a good production city.

Overall I think this is a well-balanced position. That's a nice way to say that I haven't really had any specific goals! I've taken out Mehmud with minimal military but haven't begun on Kublai. I've got some commerce cities going, but only just got COL/currency/calendar. The GP farm is just about to come on line.

I'm looking forward to seeing how others tackle this save.

 

[pnp_dredd]

oh yeah, this might help!

 

[Gumbolt]

There also seems to be changes in the scores and in the AI attitude to us. I don't know how this will affect gameplay, but if we all use the same save, everything should be OK.

RJM

Lets see how it works out. I am not sure if the builds and time to build items in cities have changed. Not sure if world builder resets all builds. Still it would have affected all Ai and human players I guess.

I see Dredd has got to the end of the round so it shouldnt be a huge issue.

All new players are welcome to join this next round!

 

[Ignorant Teacher]

WB affects GP bar and tech progression AFAIK. I do think it affects the AIs as well. We could just use Fluxx's original save, couldn't we?

 

[Fluxx]

My save was 3.17 remember . Btw I upgraded my version now.

The only thing that bugged me a little, was the whipped warrior in Tokyo. Also the warrior in Osaka is resetted

The city lost his pop, but the warrior did not come out .

In any case I played my rounds. Actually I played it twice . One peacefull settling, one aggressive towards Mehmed.

Ill figure out for myself which I like the most, and will post the 400 AD save later today.

 

[RJM]

My save was 3.17 remember . Btw I upgraded my version now.

That's not a problem is it? AFAIK, 3.19 will read 3.17 saves.

RJM

 

[gcm4738]

Jumped in to play this round...

I feel pretty good about it so I'm going to post before I read anyone else's to see how badly I did!

I played on 3.19. The only weird thing I noticed was a lot of religions got found quite early - Is this on random religions or something? Or is there something else unusual going on?

Notes on my round to 400AD:

Spoiler :

I took the "aggressive towards Mehmed" approach. First settled up north for copper, turned out some axes while researching IW. Then started spewing out swords. It took most of the round to do him in. Kept 2 cities. The second one down to the SW of Istanbul isn't ideally placed, but I needed it to block Mansa. Note: There is a small path open still. I had to block and close borders with KK to prevent him settling up there - you can see his settler/keshik right there. It will have to be watched now for MM trying to do the same and borders will have to be closed unless the culture boundaries pop first to seal it off. Then it's watch for galleys I guess and backfill as quickly as possible.

Upside - Killed Mehmed. Took 2 cities including Istanbul/Stonehenge. Got Aest first and backfilled some needed techs. Manging to stay just ahead of the happy cap by converting to Bhud along with KK and MM and building temples. Diplo relations ok. Troops have some good experience. Infrastructure/economy already rebounding from the war and should be ok in a short while - although I'm a little behind in techs atm. 1 GG settled in production city up north. Another GG is about to pop next time there's any war. Popped 2 GS. First went for Academy in Kyoto. Thought long and hard about the second, but finally went for academy in Tokyo? (city to the SE of cap) for two reasons - It looks like it will be a great commerce city, although it's not there yet (still building library!) and I needed the culture there to seal borders... Researching CoL right now, it might be too late for trade bait, but once courthouses start going up everything should be looking pretty good. There are several good spots left to backfill/settle, economy permitting. Fogbusting in place. Cities should be adequately defended (esp against MM). Could actually retire a few more units depending on how adventurous you want to be...

Downsides - Tech situation could be better, but that's the price of early war. Curious to see how well you guys did with this if you sacked Mehmed. Lost 2 fishing boats to barbs. I hate that. Haven't got anyone out exploring right now.

Comments/criticism welcome

 

[Gumbolt]

My save was 3.17 remember . Btw I upgraded my version now.

The only thing that bugged me a little, was the whipped warrior in Tokyo. Also the warrior in Osaka is resetted

The city lost his pop, but the warrior did not come out .

In any case I played my rounds. Actually I played it twice . One peacefull settling, one aggressive towards Mehmed.

Ill figure out for myself which I like the most, and will post the 400 AD save later today.

You are meant to play the save once and post. Playing it twice gives you map knowledge and Ai knowlege too. People may choose to take into account you played it twice at time of voting.

 

[Gumbolt]

WB affects GP bar and tech progression AFAIK. I do think it affects the AIs as well. We could just use Fluxx's original save, couldn't we?

The save must be the one posted. Any 3.17 saves will not be eligible for voting this round. Are are the converted.

 

[gcm4738]

@ pnp_dredd

Spoiler :

You were able to expand, tech, build, explore *and* conquer Mehmed... I don't know how you did that. I'm doing something wrong I know I lost some efficiency because I deleted about 8 units after Mehmed was gone, so I overbuilt slightly... but I didn't think I'd done that badly.

Nice round

 

[Fluxx]

You are meant to play the save once and post. Playing it twice gives you map knowledge and Ai knowlege too. People may choose to take into account you played it twice at time of voting.

Ah sorry I wasnt aware of this.

In that case it will make my choice easy and pick my first save .

I will start making screenshots, expect the post later tonight or early tomorrow, cheers!

 

[Fluxx]

Ok, so here is my save.

Very peacefull techy save.

Spoiler :

So I alreayd started the path of aestetics earlier, but then I noticed I could fairly fast research masonry. That coupled with the placing of Osaka, I could not resist.
Masonry it was, then aestetics and it paid off.

The pyramids in Japan!
Representation, lovely!



somewhere in between I got the option to swap to Hinduism. All the civs except for 2 I knew where hinduist so it was a no brainer.

Also Mehmed started to send out some archers. By smartly engaging and provoking them, I managed to kill a good number of them with little casualties on my side, while expanding.
Mehmed offered peace with nothing in return, which I took before he started to cause more trouble then he was worth. (for example stirring up his hinduist friends.

After that I started placing cities, trying to block Mehmed as much as I could. Mansa however started to get revenge on me for early blocking and started aggressively settling to the west/south.

I managed to grab the good spots still though, made most of my cities cottage/2 scientist cities (under representation).

So when I had the chance I bulbed philo.



In the meanwhile with the help of Organised religion, my capital happily build TGL, and it paid off in dividends.



Now for the end looks. Because of heavy cottaging/seafood/rep, I managed to get far ahead in tech.
Backfilled everything I needed, and still got a very decent monopoly on Philo.

8 cities, few turns to CS, good bunch of money still under my belt.



tech overview. As you see we are far ahead of the rest. Mansa as always is pretty much on par, Pacal got some stray techs, but nothing major. Mansa is one of the buddhists loners anyways, and alot of AI's do not like him.




Diplo overview. Very solid relations with most of the civs.

Mehmed we will destroy sooner then later. Mansa will trade you anything no matter what.
Only thing is Kublai, have to be a bit carefull, but nothing to worry much about.



Tech overview, you see everything is filled at 400 AD. Pretty good, so I say myself.




civics overview. It is very possible to swap to CS/Pacifism after choosing the right GP farm.



city overview.

170 beakers, not the best, not the worst either without GP farm, Bureaucracy and University.



In the end I am happy with the long prospects of the game, pyramids + TGL is very powerfull. 8 cities, healthy economy, 2 very good GP farms, 450 AD CS, all very positive.
I am unhappy that I did not conquer Mehmed yet, either samurai's, or the most feared Japanese rifllemen will solve that though.

 

[Gumbolt]

I have had a disaster of a round!!! lol

Spoiler :

I started off forgetting I was at war with Mehed and didnt notice his archer stack.I managed to fend this off. I then saw a second stack of 5-6 units including swords. Luckily i got the oracle and bribed KK into the war and made peace trading a tech.

Mehed actually took a city off KK.

I then started a second war with Mehed taking all but his capital near KK land.

I built Mids, GLH and HG in various cities.

Then came the bad news. Economy almost on strike and out of blue JoaII DOW me. A small stack goes at my most southern city, I fend off 4-5 units. I thought I was safe after this.

No such luck. My warrior in KK land spots a stack of 7-8 JoaII units. By the time they reach my eastern border he has 2 swords, a phant, 4-5 chariots, 4 catapults and 1 HA. About 13-16 units in all overall.

I attack the stack with 5-6 units.

I have had to retake the city 3-4 times now. I have had to whip many unit.

My tech side is a disaster. I am way behind the AI. Although mids and GLH is a help.

I really have played a bad round. Nothing quite seemed to go right. Ho hum.

I played to 415ad in error.

 

[Inso]

I also had an abysmal round!

Will post the result when I get back tomorrow, its not pretty.

 

[Gumbolt]

I also had an abysmal round!

Will post the result when I get back tomorrow, its not pretty.

No one said this map would be easy.

Spoiler :

I do think JoaII will be the Ai to watch late game whichever save we choose after this round.

I do think constant warfare does kill off a game. I failed to establish the GP farm as i was too busy bashing Mehed. trouble was my score at one point was half joaII. Ackkk. I do need to load my pics.

 

[Fluxx]

Going for a worker grab most often is more about nullifying an AI and giving your a starting advantage then it is actually finishing off the AI.

Spoiler :

As you can see f.e. in my 2nd round you can pretty much block Mehmed, and still be peacefull. At the moment he got 5 cities, of which 3 are pretty much worthless. His tech disadvantage is absolutely huge, resulting in an easy steamroll of our choosing.
In the meanwhile he will still build buildings/GP, which we can use later to our choosing.

Good luck for the remaining players!

 

[Jumbled]

Here's my run through 'til 400 AD for the second round. Not the best of rounds but no absolute disasters either.

Spoiler :

EC1: Tokugawa, 1500 BC – 400 AD
Research: IW, MC
Mehmed wasn’t ready for peace, so I hurried to hook up the copper, and start producing some military units. I also whipped a library in the capital to get a scientist running. A dangerous barb archer also wandered into my borders just a turn or two after starting the save, but fortunately my warrior survived to defend Tokyo with just a sliver of health left. Eventually, after I’d produced a few cover axemen and stolen another of his workers, Mehmed was ready for peace.

Stuck my GS academy in Tokyo as it looks like being a good commerce city in the future. Built up my forces for another run at Mehmed. Hatty seems to be a worst enemy of a few different AIs, so I break off open borders with her. Settling a couple more locations is a priority so that Mehmed can’t box me in. He beats me to founding a city down south by one turn, forcing me to built it further west than I’d planned, but I have a decent amount of land in the end. Once my forces are built up, I dec Mehmed again and go after him. Took his nearest city but at a high cost, with the Ottomans getting a few lucky rolls. It’s way too close to Tokyo, but I keep it anyway in order to squeeze Mehmed.

Meanwhile, a couple of AIs have decced Hatty and ask me to join, but I definitely have enough on my hands right now. My economy’s in a bad way at this point and I haven’t got enough forces to crush any of his cities just yet. I pillage a bit to keep my cash up, and take out his iron supply. Metal casting finishes and I trade it around for a few useful techs, but foolishly skip alphabet.



At 400 AD the situation’s passable but not great. I’ve got Mehmed on the back foot but my economy’s down the tube. Fortunately, there’s a good chance I’ll be able to make some useful trades once Kublai gets alphabet, as he’s pleased with me. Leonidas has spawned, and is waiting to either make a super-medic or settle in a production city. I’ve also left it with a crucial decision to make regarding the war. Mehmed will take peace at any time, but won’t pay for the privilege. However, I have just enough troops in place to likely take/raze one of his cities first...

All in all, I didn’t play it particularly well, but the game still has potential. I made two big mistakes. The first was offering Mehmed peace the first time rather than going all-out war and crushing him before he got IW. The second was not grabbing alphabet among the tech trades I made earlier to allow me to start building research.

Land:

Tech trading:

Tech tree:

 

[Gumbolt]

Ok, so here is my save.

Very peacefull techy save.

Spoiler :

So I alreayd started the path of aestetics earlier, but then I noticed I could fairly fast research masonry. That coupled with the placing of Osaka, I could not resist.
Masonry it was, then aestetics and it paid off.

The pyramids in Japan!
Representation, lovely!



somewhere in between I got the option to swap to Hinduism. All the civs except for 2 I knew where hinduist so it was a no brainer.

Also Mehmed started to send out some archers. By smartly engaging and provoking them, I managed to kill a good number of them with little casualties on my side, while expanding.
Mehmed offered peace with nothing in return, which I took before he started to cause more trouble then he was worth. (for example stirring up his hinduist friends.

After that I started placing cities, trying to block Mehmed as much as I could. Mansa however started to get revenge on me for early blocking and started aggressively settling to the west/south.

I managed to grab the good spots still though, made most of my cities cottage/2 scientist cities (under representation).

So when I had the chance I bulbed philo.



In the meanwhile with the help of Organised religion, my capital happily build TGL, and it paid off in dividends.



Now for the end looks. Because of heavy cottaging/seafood/rep, I managed to get far ahead in tech.
Backfilled everything I needed, and still got a very decent monopoly on Philo.

8 cities, few turns to CS, good bunch of money still under my belt.



tech overview. As you see we are far ahead of the rest. Mansa as always is pretty much on par, Pacal got some stray techs, but nothing major. Mansa is one of the buddhists loners anyways, and alot of AI's do not like him.




Diplo overview. Very solid relations with most of the civs.

Mehmed we will destroy sooner then later. Mansa will trade you anything no matter what.
Only thing is Kublai, have to be a bit carefull, but nothing to worry much about.



Tech overview, you see everything is filled at 400 AD. Pretty good, so I say myself.




civics overview. It is very possible to swap to CS/Pacifism after choosing the right GP farm.



city overview.

170 beakers, not the best, not the worst either without GP farm, Bureaucracy and University.



In the end I am happy with the long prospects of the game, pyramids + TGL is very powerfull. 8 cities, healthy economy, 2 very good GP farms, 450 AD CS, all very positive.
I am unhappy that I did not conquer Mehmed yet, either samurai's, or the most feared Japanese rifllemen will solve that though.

Spoiler :

In terms of science this game looks stronger. Peaceful games can be useful at times. My main worry is KK 12-13 strong stack at your border. You are not his best friend. This could be a problem as that stack might reach your capital easily.

 

[Gumbolt]

Any more likely to play this round? We are running 3.19 now dont forget. I can leave it anoother 24-48 hours if be or we can crack on.

 

[Ignorant Teacher]

I'm going to play this as soon as I finish the LHC Genghis. I should finish it tonight or tomorrow afternoon. If you can leave it open for 24 more hours, I'll appreciate it.