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Emperor Perikles of Greece

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by Harv, Mar 24, 2020.

  1. Harv

    Harv Emperor Supporter

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    Continents map
    Emperor Pericles of Greece
    No Huts
    No Events

    I finally figured out why random leaders is so popular. It is because it is what shows up on the settings for a custom game. :)

    Here is the start:

    Spoiler :

    upload_2020-3-24_17-23-27.png



    I will be adding my initial thoughts as I go along. Initial save is attached.

    First thought: Holy visibility! I can clearly see almost all of the squares in the BFC, all but three. Those remaining three, I can see what they are. The only way I can see other than settling in place would be to move the scout to check out if there is any seafood to the north.

    Second thought:
    Spoiler :




    Third thought: Did I give you a bad screenie? I am looking at the forest tile at (-1,3) and have no idea if there is coast to the north of it or not.
    (It looks like coast and tundra to me. That means we are on the northern edge of a continent or island.)

    Added initial demographics.
    Spoiler :

    upload_2020-3-24_18-41-56.png


    The scout: First move is obvious and it will show some of the north coast. There are three possibilities for the second move.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Mar 24, 2020
  2. Harv

    Harv Emperor Supporter

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    I decided to move the scout one square and give a little bit more visibility. I could not think of any other direction to move him.

    Spoiler :

    upload_2020-3-24_20-24-1.png


    So there is no orphaned food source to the north and there looks like there will be lots of tundra. I will probably move one more northwest to the hill. It might grant more visibility and I do not think there is anything to the west of us that might change my mind where to settle.

    I suppose it IS possible that at a spot like (-3,0) there is a plains gold mine that we miss because I settled in place and this might become visible if I move to the southwest. Hang on......
    .....no I think it's all forest and I will see nothing further in that direction. These tiles will be revealed when I settle in place, so I think that is the next move, then finish the move with the scout.

    It looks like if I settle in place......
    Turn 15 - Worker
    Turn 19/20 - Corn Farm
    Turn 24/25 - Pig Iron Mine

    Research path....
    Turn 10 - Agriculture
    Turn 18 - Mining
    Turn 32? Bronze Working

    So we have a Worker sitting around doing nothing for about 7 turns.

    .....and our starting techs are doing us absolutely no good!
    Fishing - No seafood resource. Maybe we end up working that lake.
    Hunting - We start with a Scout. Maybe he finds a better spot for a second city more quickly.
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2020
  3. Harv

    Harv Emperor Supporter

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    4000 BC

    We should name our scout, shouldn't we? I have a very new computer and just got CIv 4 for it and have not downloaded the BUG mod. I might make that a project while waiting overnight for input.

    Spoiler :

    upload_2020-3-24_20-43-46.png


    Eventually, I decided that was the best place to move the scout, getting on a hill and a whole bunch of visibility. We are unlikely to find anything further north.

    It also pretty much decides that Athens should be settled in place.

    Spoiler :

    upload_2020-3-24_20-46-23.png



    Gold! We have gold!

    That means our Worker has something to do until Turn 31 and we have a very good chance of having Bronze Working by then, especially with the gold! It also means we will also grow Athens to Size 3 and work all the tiles, corn, pig iron, and gold.

    About research: Is there a gambit I am supposed to use to research nothing and cancel my research project every turn, in case I run into an AI that starts with Agriculture?
     

    Attached Files:

  4. sampsa

    sampsa Ghost

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    Yes, though I'm not sure why it's a gambit. You are not gambiting anything. :)
     
  5. Harv

    Harv Emperor Supporter

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    Well, I think we can get at Settler at T35 and Bronze at T32. I think the next decision point is when we encounter somebody.
     
  6. Gumbolt

    Gumbolt Phoenix Rising

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    Agr/min/BW would be main techs here. AH can be delayed if you build mine.

    Cancel research for first 5 turns in case you meet an AI.

    Not really had time to look at this. If I can I will try and get more involved. Your in safe hands with Sampsa.
     
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  7. Harv

    Harv Emperor Supporter

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    The first five turns? Why not more?

    I am experimenting with this a little bit, because it is pretty new to me.

    Added: Starting demographics.

    Spoiler :

    upload_2020-3-25_18-4-45.png

    upload_2020-3-25_18-4-55.png


    There is a Charismatic leader out there and we appear to be the only Creative leader.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2020
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  8. sampsa

    sampsa Ghost

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    Because it only works until T5, then you have to choose a tech or all your :science: is allocated to a (random?) tech.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2020
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  9. Harv

    Harv Emperor Supporter

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    Thanks. Does it work at any point later than Turn 5?

    I don't know if it is a random tech. It might be the last project I started and cancelled. I can try to replicate results.
    EDIT: Maybe it is random. I ran a turn and the points went into Archery.

    This also gave me a bit of time to "optimize" the movement of the scout as well as I could see it, with the objective of exposing as much good land as possible. We are trying to find more city sites.

    Early Exploration, Part 1
    to Turn 5 / 3800 BC

    Turn 1 - (-3,3) - We can see a north coast forming and tundra and some ice cap. This is probably where we will find our copper.
    Turn 2 - (-5,2) - We can now see the possibility of a city site on a plains hill with fresh water from a lake, corn, and sheep.
    I chose this route, because I could see a lake and this was the furthest north I could go and catch visibility around the lake in the next turn.
    Turn 3 - (-6,0) - We now see a river and flood plain and more corn. Somewhere around here will be another city site.
    Turn 4 - (-8,-1) - We see more of this river.
    Turn 5 - (-10,-3) - There is more gold! I see a total of 4 gold tiles so far!

    We also met our first opponent!

    Spoiler :

    upload_2020-3-25_19-37-21.png



    It's Napoleon of France and they start off with Agriculture.

    It looks like this exercise nets us 2 beakers. They might come in handy.

    Here is the territory we have scouted so far.

    Spoiler :

    upload_2020-3-25_19-39-5.png



    For scouting - I think the priority is to expose as much land as possible. I have been trying to go from hills to hills. Failing that, then I move to a forest. The hills maximize visibility. The forest gives us a chance if we encounter some wild animal. We are still kind of dead if we land next to a bear.

    There is lots of gold, but if we find copper, that might determine our next city site. I would also like to expose the area to the south of Athens, because it is close.

    Explore around the gold and that river?
    Path back home?

    I think since it is Turn 5, there are still many turns before we have a settler, so there is lots of time to explore.

    If we lose the scout before we finish the worker, is it worth building another scout?

    Added: In other news, we know where Paris is!

    Spoiler :

    upload_2020-3-25_20-28-0.png


    Paris is at (-14,0).
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Mar 25, 2020
  10. Gumbolt

    Gumbolt Phoenix Rising

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    Make sure you reveal all land round your capital.

    I never build a 2nd scout. Just keep it on forest tiles or move 1mp to keep safer. Ideally it should fog bust first city. Don't think barbs arrive for first 12 or so turns.
     
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  11. sampsa

    sampsa Ghost

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    Losing the scout is actually not very easy if you move it mostly only one tile at a time. After the animals disappear there are no more 2-movers and it's rather impossible to lose the scout unless you get greedy with exploration. If you lose your scout for some reason, you shouldn't replace it. Warriors do a much better job as they can also kill barbs.
     
  12. Harv

    Harv Emperor Supporter

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    I was moving the scout two tiles to hills if possible for better visibility. My idea was to expose as much land as possible. Forest is another good choice for the extra defense. If I move 1 tile to an open space, are we still vulnerable to a panther?

    City sites:
    It will be determined based on the location of copper, but the plains hill at -5,2 looks good. It gets corn and sheep at size 2 for 9 hammers towards another settler. The desert at -4,-2 gets corn and gold, only 6 hammers, but lots of commerce. There might be one more to the south where we have not explored. However, copper is going to decide this.

    This also implies AH is after BW, then TW.
     
  13. sampsa

    sampsa Ghost

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    For the first 5T, definitely move two, since there are no animals yet. Post T5, you are vulnerable to animals. Of course, forested hills are kinda safe. You are vulnerable to panthers, but they spawn only in the jungle and you shouldn't be going to the jungle usually. You are more vulnerable to ending movement next to a bear.

    Good thoughts. The northern corn+sheep site is otherwise a bit underwhelming, but food is food. Desert gold+oasis is OK, but nothing great and will remain a small city. The river area to the west is lush and it would be great to beat Napoleon to it. For example, the grass hill 1W of corn? Hill would help to defend against Naps.

    Yes, no hurry with AH really, BW is much more useful (chops, reveal copper).
     
  14. Harv

    Harv Emperor Supporter

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    Yes, once past the special tiles, those cities don’t have much.

    I think I’m looking at T35 (2600 BC) for settler. Is that too late?

    That river is the prize.
     
  15. sampsa

    sampsa Ghost

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    I think it's the best you can do. I'm assuming start a settler size 3. Worker improves first corn, then mines pig, then mines gold?
     
  16. Harv

    Harv Emperor Supporter

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    I think T33 if I start at T21 and size 2. 4 turns at 7 hammers and 8 turns at 9 hammers. We would lose a couple of hammers on the warrior and have a gold mine that is doing nothing and only the scout to escort the settler.

    Right now, I don’t think it’s worth it.

    Grass hill by the river - I think that misses the corn.
     
  17. sampsa

    sampsa Ghost

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    You have 3 strong tiles so you should grow to three without a doubt.
    Which one? There is a green hill right next to the corn.
     
  18. Harv

    Harv Emperor Supporter

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    There is much work to be done!
    to Turn 15

    There is not much going on yet. Regarding the scout, since we have figured out the location of Paris, we do not need to go much further west and exploring the area south of Athens would be better.

    Turn 7 - We landed on a hill next to a wolf and defeated the wolf. The next turn a panther was in sight, so I took that as an opportunity to get out of there. Later we sighted a lion, but we were able to dodge him.
    Turn 10 - Agriculture
    Turn 15 - First worker complete

    This is the city site you are still thinking of?

    Spoiler :

    upload_2020-3-26_18-0-30.png



    From here, it still looks obvious. Farm corn, mine pig iron, mine gold, grow to size 3 on that warrior.

    Push the scout a little further south. I followed the advice to only move one tile on the desert and it might have worked. The scout might do well to fog-bust somewhere near a city site. We will also have to find ourselves some copper.
     

    Attached Files:

  19. Gumbolt

    Gumbolt Phoenix Rising

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    Size 3 is a no brainer given the gold.

    Lots of interesting land. You never quite know if Nappy has metal or not. Flat land is never safe for scouts.

    I think you have 2 cities near the corns. A city near those flood plains looks good. Albeit unhealthy? Really pends where Nappy settles. Immediate land round your capital is not great.

    If Nappy has metal he will eventually go war mode. For now play the map.
     
  20. Harv

    Harv Emperor Supporter

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    Preparing to settle new lands
    to Turn 26

    We pushed the scout south and we encountered Genghis Khan.

    Spoiler :

    upload_2020-3-26_20-32-53.png



    So I seem to like sharing islands with aggressive leaders! I don't know how far south Genghis Khan is. We will explore along the jungle line westward.

    Turn 17 - Mining. So that little trick at the start of the game allowed us to finish mining exactly.
    Turn 19 - Somebody founded Hinduism. It remains to be seen if there will be a religion on this continent. So far, it looks like we are on the bigger continent. If not, then I am sharing an island with Genghis and Nappy.
    Turn 21 - Athens grew to size 2.
    Turn 26 - Warrior in Athens.

    Micro: At size 2, I decided to work the lake for three turns, because that would finish the warrior exactly when Athens hits size 3. So this means we are missing 3 overflow into the settler, and it is possible that we get the settler one turn later. I might have done better to save this micro for when we were building the settler. I will count once again how many hammers we will have towards the settler. I will aim for 80, plus a chop and see if it could have been done one turn sooner.

    Spoiler :

    upload_2020-3-26_20-41-31.png



    I will try to do a coordinated fog-bust with the French and Mongols and clear a path to where I think the next city will be. We might also do well to have the scout positioned to get a good view of that river.

    Most likely, copper will determine the location of Sparta.
     

    Attached Files:

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