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[NFP] Ethiopia Update Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by sonicmyst, Jul 13, 2020.

  1. PhoenicianGold

    PhoenicianGold Emperor

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    Of course, I believe we are in agreement that it doesn't necessarily portend anything for VII.

    And I also agree that Rough Rider likely derives from some alternate concept art and was just the best way to give players some more America without creating a second leader.

    But I still find it somewhat suspicious that there would have been concept art developed for CdM in a Venetian mask. As far as I can discern, the mask would not have been a necessary element for a "Magnificence Catherine" design. In which case the deliberate choice to put a mask on her suggests some sort of pro-Italian agenda, even if its as benign and minor as wanting the French leader to feel more Italian because we aren't getting Italy in VI.

    But I still suspect that there was always "something Italian" about why the devs chose CdM specifically for the base game.

    Eh possibly although I thought they dressed her in black and made her the espionage leader because something something Game of Thrones. And since pop culture isn't very nuanced, I figured the wine glass was just an attempt to mimic Cersei. It definitely feels more "I'm gonna poison someone with this" than "let's party."

    EDIT: In fact, going back to the mystery of why Catherine needed to wear a mask for this outfit, if Black Queen Catherine was supposed to be a Game of Thrones sendup, then Magnificence Catherine definitely feels like they wanted to send Catherine to Italy to join the Assassin's Creed. Again, mask to me still communicates espionage LA, which would make sense if Catherine led another civ, but not if she has a luxury LA.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2020
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  2. Lily_Lancer

    Lily_Lancer Deity

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    So what are the original Roosevelt/Catherine, will they be remained, changed or removed?
     
  3. Alexander's Hetaroi

    Alexander's Hetaroi Deity

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    Original Catherine remains the same.
    Original "Bull Moose" Roosevelt will lose the Rough Rider and the combat bonus on home continent, but keep national park bonuses and maybe get other bonuses.
    Teddy won't change if you don't get the alternate versions and either version of Catherine or Teddy can show up in the game or be chosen by the player.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2020
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  4. bbbt

    bbbt Deity

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    It could also be exploratory. I.e. I've seen consistent comments that people wished leaders changed outfits based on era ala 4. They now know approx how long it takes them to make alternate outfits for the same base leader model. A variable to throw in the project plan/feature grooming - okay we could do 3 different outfits per leader, it would take X resource approx Y hours. Keep or cut for another priority?
     
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  5. Lily_Lancer

    Lily_Lancer Deity

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    I'm just curious what will the original Roosevelt be. The new Teddy is definitely stronger than the original one, and the original Roosevelt only keeps his national park bonus?
     
  6. PhoenicianGold

    PhoenicianGold Emperor

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    Are we talking changing outfits for VI? Because rendering two outfits doesn't seem like it would scale well for estimating how long it would take to design over forty for the entire cast. Or nearly 100 if they did three as you proposed.

    I'm surprised anyone wants this. Seems like a total waste of development resources to me.
     
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  7. Alexander's Hetaroi

    Alexander's Hetaroi Deity

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    There probably is more but they haven't revealed the reworked original one yet. All we know is old Teddy is now focused on National Parks and appeal while the military side is solely for "Rough Rider" Teddy.
     
  8. Snarf054

    Snarf054 Chieftain

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    Since modders are still handcuffed in Civ VI anything new is good IMO even if it's something I would rarely play like apocalypse mode. But I am really stoked for secret societies. Maybe not so much for what it is now but more for the possibilities of what it could become. If a good modder took them and changed them into something more akin to guilds or the like the possibilities are amazing. Most of your real secret societies started out as something similar. You could have something like the Templars which were a religious society, a military society, and a merchant society all rolled into one. The Golden Dawn with alchemy and occultism aspects. Religious cults, fraternities and groups like the Illuminati that are more political focused, Militias and anarchist type groups that would take a military terrorist tact. You could even play with them on a deeper level and have them go from their original more benign origins to a more sinister type organization as they are promoted. I don't mind them as they are now the whole "Oh God No, Vampires!" thing doesn't bother me one bit. If I can stomach GDR's then bring on the dragons!

    Having a new Civ is always a good day, and a new district for me to use horribly incorrectly as usual is not a bad thing either. The two current leaders that got tweaked are perfect no matter what IMO because both are easily in my Top 5 least liked list.
     
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  9. bbbt

    bbbt Deity

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    Yeah I'd agree it's unlikely.

    But my understanding with game development is that the programming generally takes a lot more time than the art time in a lot of games. Or at least that the art can't start til a lot of the engine work is done.

    It's why you see a lot of 'cosmetic DLC' in other games. It's basically trying to keep the art department busy/income generating while the core engineers are working on the engine and mechanics. Previously companies would just lay off art resources between major games/updates.

    With Civ, I think the DLC civilizations are mostly those 'content DLC' (i.e. mostly art and not engineering resources). But they could be spit-balling more 'art resource' heavy options depending.
     
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  10. clapyourhands

    clapyourhands Prince

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    Imma be honest, I can't look at the persona pack models without thinking that Teddy and Catherine somehow both look like they went to a Halloween party dressed as themselves. Not sure how else to describe it, haha.
     
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  11. Jewelrunna

    Jewelrunna Prince

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    I play on Deity and Emperor, for your information. :)
    Deity when I want a decent enough challenge, Emperor when I want to relax. If I want a real challenge, I play a fair one like Dota or some fighting games; not one where the AI just gets a bunch of bonuses. Not particularly fun when the only competition comes from the fact the AI gets overbuffed, and they still make stupid decisions.

    That aside, everything you've makes it abundantly clear that you don't really understand what you're talking about. You speak about things in extremely vague terms with no concrete examples of how the game actually functions, and are simply slinging around insults as an argument. There are plenty of examples of Deity and multiplayer games on Twitch and Youtube, and you will literally see what I'm saying be applied. It's going to be very hard to fit the Diplomatic Quarter into your build order, which could have a negative impact on City-State diplomacy. You said yourself that people are having "skeptical" reactions to it, and I'm simply having a skeptical take as well.

    The fact that you're out here arguing against the very concept of a metagame tells me that you really have no idea what you're talking about. So I'd simply like to leave it at that. I could be wrong about the impact this change is going to have, and I've been very clear in that sentiment in every post I've made here. It's a first impression, not a clear science. But you're just rambling on about nothing in particular and not really arguing against any point here, so time to move on. :)
     
  12. Thenewwwguy

    Thenewwwguy Emperor

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    i’d rather have had two more civs/alt leaders than alt teddy and catherine tbh
     
  13. Alexander's Hetaroi

    Alexander's Hetaroi Deity

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    I like the idea behind them. But to me I would rather not have any more leader personas.
    Well actually I would take maybe a nicer version of Pedro who won't attack you for gaining a new great person.
     
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  14. Kupe Navigator

    Kupe Navigator Prince

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    and get rid of that HORRIBLE leader model.
    actually add Phillip to that list.
     
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  15. The Civs 6

    The Civs 6 Prince

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    A certain someone is a narc!
    I'd like to echo that point - to me these societies have a sinister feel, and some sort of deeply consequential nerf that they could impose on your Civ would be very flavorful for that.

    I just want to add I'm not a fan of the diplo district idea - but mostly because it just seems to further place early-mid game production on a pedestal. I'm interested in the concept of having to "enable" the envoy game, but just not how it fits into the game as it is.

    Unless they are just toying with the idea of turning all districts into "one per empire", which I think would be a pretty interesting.
     
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  16. acluewithout

    acluewithout Deity

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    That’s exactly the right word. Sinister.

    The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents. We live on a placid island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of the infinity, and it was not meant that we should voyage far.

    I mean, if we’re going to do Cthulhu and Vampires and Lost Island of Moo, lets do it properly. I look forward to Giant Sightless Penguins and Mass Insanity.

    ... But seriously. There should be some negatives.
     
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  17. GenyaArikado

    GenyaArikado Judge of Love

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    Mangificence Catherine is literally based on this picture (plus a mask)
     
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  18. King William I

    King William I Prince

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    No. The Hapsburg chin must stay. Also, I wouldn't say no to leaders clothes changing by era. Just because Civ III biffed it doesn't mean they shouldn't try again.

    Back on topic, I'm actually glad they went with fantasy societies. Actual societies we know about well enough to warrant inclusion are either Eurocentic, memed to the point they're more ridiculous than what we have, the 'facts' we know are pute conapiracy or just flat out lies, or any combination of the three.

    And I'm glad the vamps don't sparkle
     
  19. The Civs 6

    The Civs 6 Prince

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    A certain someone is a narc!
    I mean I loathe this as a criticism, but the fantasy tropes they are invoking here aren't exactly universal themselves.
     
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  20. Kwami

    Kwami Emperor

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    Why do you all assume that these alternate looks existed before the last few months? I really doubt it.
     
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