EU votes against freedom!!!!!

Mise

isle of lucy
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Basically, the EU currently mandates that no workers should work more than an average of 48 hours over (IIRC?) 17 weeks. However, the UK has an "opt-out". How this works in practice is, when you start a job, you have to tick a box to say whether you agree to work longer than 48 hours per week. So, if you don't tick the box, you cannot be expected to work more than 48 hrs per week averaged over 17 weeks. However, if you tick the box, you are allowed to work longer than 48 hours if you choose.

To me, this seems like a smashing idea. We have the right to work a maximum of 48 hrs per week on average, but we also have the right to work as long as we want. We have a choice. The EU, however, want to limit that choice.

And, in all fairness, so do Unions, and the majority of Labour MEPs. Gordon Brown and the Labour executive, on the other hand, want to protect our right to choose.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7786825.stm

UK work time opt-out under threat



The TUC says UK workers put in the longest hours in Europe

Britain has moved a step closer to being forced to limit the working week to 48 hours for all employees.

Euro MPs have voted in favour of ending Britain's opt-out from the EU working time directive.
Britain is determined to keep the opt-out and will now start talks with EU ministers in an effort to keep it.
The UK does not have a veto on the issue but it is expected to join forces with other countries who back its position in order to get its way.
A decision is expected early next year following "conciliation" talks with the European council of ministers.

Junior doctors
If Britain is forced to axe its opt-out, the law will come into force in three years' time.
Gary Titley, leader of Labour's MEPs, who voted to keep the opt-out, said the two sides were so far apart on the issue that the talks would probably end in stalemate and the opt-out would continue.
"Continuing with the status quo is the most likely outcome," Mr Titley told BBC News, adding that unlike many of his Labour colleagues he believed maximum working hours should be set at a national level.

Gordon Brown's MEPs have voted resoundingly against the opt-out that helps to protect British jobs
Alan Duncan
Shadow business secretary

But Mats Persson, of pressure group Open Europe, said there was a chance Britain would be overruled, as it had been in the past on the issue of junior doctors' hours.
MEPs voted in favour of scrapping the opt-out by 421 votes to 273, with the majority of Labour MEPs voting to axe it, in defiance of Prime Minister Gordon Brown.
Shadow business secretary Alan Duncan said: "On the day when unemployment rose above 1.8 million, Gordon Brown's MEPs have voted resoundingly against the opt-out that helps to protect British jobs.
"Reducing the flexibility of our labour market going into what even government ministers are calling the deepest recession we have ever faced, is an economic madness that only the Labour Party would be capable of."

'Obstruction'

Thousands of trade union members marched on the European Parliament to urge an end to the opt-out, ahead of Wednesday's vote.
And leaders of the UK's biggest union, Unite, urged British MEPs to "stop the UK's long hours culture".
But on Monday business minister Pat McFadden told the BBC it would be a mistake to end the opt-out during an economic downturn when people might need to work extra hours.

HAVE YOUR SAY
They couldn't have picked a worse time to try to stop people working when they need to. How about letting the person decide how long they want to work?​
Winston, UK
Send us your comments


The exemption from the working time directive was negotiated by the Conservative government in 1993 and is used to some extent by other member states, for members of the medical profession for example, although the UK is the only country which has opted-out of it altogether.
Conservative and Liberal Democrat MEPs say the opt-out should continue but Plaid Cymru MEP Jill Evans and the Green Party's two British MEPs are also against it.
Open Europe, which campaigns for EU reform, estimated ending it in 2011 - as some MEPs want - would cost the UK economy between £47.4bn and £66.45bn by 2020.
CBI deputy director general John Cridland said European Parliament amendments which would stop people being able to choose to work more than 48 hours would "replace opportunity with obstruction".
"If your partner has lost their job, should Brussels stop you from putting in extra overtime to support your family?," he said.
But the unions argue it is a health and safety issue.
Unite joint general secretary Tony Woodley said: "Tired, overstretched workers are not productive workers and are putting themselves and others at risk, such as in the transport industry where we know, for instance, that tired drivers are more dangerous than drunk drivers."
 
OMG socialism is evil. :run:

The EU is just trying to protect employees from being exploited.
 
I think I read a place that British workers had the longest hours and lowest productivity in Europe. A coincidence? Perhaps.
 
OMG socialism is evil. :run:

The EU is just trying to protect employees from being exploited.
We are already protected against exploitation -- all we have to do is tick a box, and we won't have to work more than 48 hrs per week. We are fully protected by EU directives.

However, we also have the right to worker longer than 48 hrs per week, if we so choose. The EU directive, if made mandatory, forbids us from choosing how long we want to work.

@Lillefix: Productivity is measured as output per hour, and labour hours clearly have diminishing returns. It therefore wouldn't surprise me if that were true. But production trumps productivity, IMO.
 
However, if you tick the box, you are allowed to work longer than 48 hours if you choose.

To me, this seems like a smashing idea. We have the right to work a maximum of 48 hrs per week on average, but we also have the right to work as long as we want. We have a choice.

The right to compete with other workers for more and more hours and for less and less salary, until you can barely sustain your life with your job.

Social measures like minimum wages and maximum hours have to apply for everyone, else they don't work.
 
You should more work illegaly then. You westerners have lost practice how deal with mad (euro)socialist ideas:p
 
I'm glad that someone has posted an interesting thread. I'm not glad that Labour are trying to screw up our lives even more.
A mere sixty-six thousand million pounds is small change, however, compared to the huge tax burden I'm going to bearing in a few years as I pay for corporate irresponsibility of the last few years.
 
The right to compete with other workers for more and more hours and for less and less salary, until you can barely sustain your life with your job.

Social measures like minimum wages and maximum hours have to apply for everyone, else they don't work.

Exactly. The EU is doing UK a favour.
 
You should more work illegaly then. You westerners have lost practice how deal with mad (euro)socialist ideas:p

Oh shut up :rolleyes: We have 40 hours max here, so who's the socialist?

AFAIK this rule doesn't limit overtime work, so what's the problem?
 
Wow. The EU would put me out of business. I put in more than that every week. Gotta love that anti-business approach.
 
Wow. The EU would put me out of business. I put in more than that every week. Gotta love that anti-business approach.

Yeah its incredible, no wonder we are an agrarian, deindsutrialised, non-car producing, smaller economy than the US.... oh, wait
 
Wow. The EU would put me out of business. I put in more than that every week. Gotta love that anti-business approach.

Most people actually do like it :p

The fact is that the productivity in most WE countries is pretty high, so this measure has very little negative effect on the economy.
 
The right to compete with other workers for more and more hours and for less and less salary, until you can barely sustain your life with your job.
I don't see any of that happening at the moment. You've created a problem where none exists. We have a pretty comprehensive welfare state -- I would support that safety net to help people who fall off the employment ladder. If I want to work more than 48 hrs per week, I should be allowed to do that.

Social measures like minimum wages and maximum hours have to apply for everyone, else they don't work.
Minimum wage raises people's wages. Maximum hours reduce people's wages. Some help :rolleyes:


@Winner, not all jobs have "overtime". Mine doesn't.
 
Most people actually do like it :p

The fact is that the productivity in most WE countries is pretty high, so this measure has very little negative effect on the economy.

How in the world can a small business survive if you don't let them work more than 48 hours per week?
 
The main political reason for the opt out is that there will not be enough Emergency Service personal to go around. The NHS has been poaching doctors from all four corners of the globe just to stand still, if they had to limit doctors hours don't bother phoning 999 after 9 o'clock - would any government stay in power having to tell the electorate that?
 
How in the world can a small business survive if you don't let them work more than 48 hours per week?

uh you can work unoffically as a owner. And people can always work more for overtime pay, with is more then normal pay
 
I don't see any of that happening at the moment. You've created a problem where none exists. We have a pretty comprehensive welfare state
That you do and so when jobs become less attractive, due to longer hours (or lower wages), you'll find more people being supported by welfare, because they'll be less motivated to really find a job.

Minimum wage raises people's wages. Maximum hours reduce people's wages. Some help :rolleyes:
It may not be helping you, but consider if you can get somebody to do the work for two, then you hire that person instead of two average guys. There's nothing wrong with that.
There's also nothing wrong with making a guy work 80 hour weeks, if it's within the law.
So if our representatives want fewer hours for whatever reason, then they'll have to level the playing field for all.
 
You're forgetting that there are people who need to work more than 48 hours per week, or else they can't feed their families.
 
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