Featured Game 1 Pre-Discussion

[Thalassicus]

Download Game 1
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Click Here to read about the GotVEM competition. This thread is for discussing strategies ahead of time for the Game 1 start location. Please DO NOT post in this thread if you started the game. Two spoiler threads will be opened on Monday September 9th to discuss games in progress.

Game 1 Start Location

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• King difficulty.
• Normal speed.
• Normal map size (8 players).
• Created with Continents Plus map script.
• Default advanced game settings.
• All victory conditions enabled.
• Washington of America:
  • +1 sight for land units and -50% Cost to purchase tiles.
  • Pioneer Forts replace Walls, adding +25% Surplus Food.
  • Minutemen replace Skirmishers, adding +5 and the Recon 1 promotion.

No paid DLCs will be used for this game. Before the game starts on Friday, take these 2 simple steps to temporarily disable any paid DLCs you have:

1. On your Windows desktop, create a new folder "DLC - Backup."
2. Move all paid DLCs* to the backup folder from:
   C:\Games\Steam\steamapps\common\sid meier's civilization v\Assets\DLC

*Leave the Shared folder and DLC_01, the free Mongolia pack.

Continents-Plus has more powerful islands and offshore citystates than Continents maps. If you like the maps used for the VEM Game of the Month series, I highly recommend downloading the Explorers DLC for the capability to use the Continents-Plus and Pangaea-Plus map scripts in your own games. I feel this is the best DLC for Civ 5. These map scripts quickly became my favorites in the Civilization series, and provide better VEM gameplay than the standard maps.

 

[Txurce]

Pretty outrageous all-around starting place, with the hills in place for mid-game production.

Before plunging into the pre-game warmup, which version of VEM should be used with this game?

 

[Seek]

Out of curiosity - why the delay for game start?

Also, is there a desired VC?

 

[Txurce]

Out of curiosity - why the delay for game start?

Also, is there a desired VC?

1. To have a pre-game discussion!

For example: where to move first turn? I think the Warrior definitely goes to the NW hill two tiles away, but the Settler could move across the river onto the hill for extra hammers. Is the first build a Scout? I would think so. But what to research? Pottery for the Sugar? Or Mining for the Marble?

And so on.

2. All VC's are active. With some civs like the Mongols there will probably be a huge tilt toward Conquest, but otherwise it adds what ought to be an appropriate level of variety to approaches.

 

[Thalassicus]

I want to ensure the current VEM beta is free of major bugs for a general public release on Wednesday. That will be the version for Friday's game start. (The map is stored as a scenario so the mod can be updated until then.) Weekends are good since people have more free time.

 

[EsoEs]

I'm not a great judge when it comes to evaluating starts, but if I were playing by myself I'd probably just go for a reroll. The fish are nice mid/late game especially if you can found some more cities on the coast and grab commerce but I don't see a lot of opportunities for production.. Im not an expert and I could be dead wrong, but I would probably just reroll.

That being said, this is why I love GoTM, it forces you to play games sometimes out of your comfort zone as a player, and you can really learn a lot by doing that, especially when you have other members of the community playing/strategizing along with you. Im psyched for VEM's first GoTM, lets get it goin!

 

[EsoEs]

Hmm on second thought looking at the start it has great food capabilities and I think a specialist economy could be pretty powerful. The UB really adds to that, grabbing the +2 food on defense buildings tradition policy seems sweet and maybe a Chivalry rush to get the Hemjei Castle depending on how many horses we pick up.

 

[Thalassicus]

I've added a Strategic View of the start location.

Wonders get +15% construction speed from Marble. Stonehenge instantly boosts city borders to a 3-tile radius. This would immediately acquire sugar, fish, extra river tiles, and a total of 6 hills. Masonry then Stonehenge is a very interesting possibility with this start location.

Sailing is also a quick detour from Calendar. The land to the north might be an island, so Sailing and Optics could hook up extra Pearls and Sugar for at least 8, or a 520 boost if the luxuries are traded. Sailing also unlocks Triremes for naval exploration, which is very important on Continents Plus maps.

 

[Seek]

1. To have a pre-game discussion!

For example: where to move first turn? I think the Warrior definitely goes to the NW hill two tiles away, but the Settler could move across the river onto the hill for extra hammers. Is the first build a Scout? I would think so. But what to research? Pottery for the Sugar? Or Mining for the Marble?

Yep, I'll certainly move the warrior to the same place. I'm tempted - if the there's anything decent to the west - to settle two tiles west, just for some decent production before t75 (right there with you, EsoEs!) and get away from all that ugly marshland: The pearls can wait. The first build is a scout, always a scout. Mining is a safe bet, at the very least you can chop the forests on the hills and mine them up. Pottery has potential, but since there are no Granary resources around, I'd go mining first, do a little scouting, then decide whether to go Liberty or Tradition (doubt I'll want to go Honor with America). If Tradition, maybe try to jump on the GL, but hooking up the Marble will take a long time, so I'm not sure if it'll be feasible - though it is king.

Thal, you changed the map, didn't you! Makes it a bit more interesting, though, so no complaints.

 

[Txurce]

Yep, I'll certainly move the warrior to the same place. I'm tempted - if the there's anything decent to the west - to settle two tiles west, just for some decent production before t75 (right there with you, EsoEs!) and get away from all that ugly marshland: The pearls can wait. The first build is a scout, always a scout. Mining is a safe bet, at the very least you can chop the forests on the hills and mine them up. Pottery has potential, but since there are no Granary resources around, I'd go mining first, do a little scouting, then decide whether to go Liberty or Tradition (doubt I'll want to go Honor with America). If Tradition, maybe try to jump on the GL, but hooking up the Marble will take a long time, so I'm not sure if it'll be feasible - though it is king.

Thal, you changed the map, didn't you! Makes it a bit more interesting, though, so no complaints.

You call choking on luxuries "a bit more interesting"?

Legendary aspects aside, it's actually a tactically rich, classic GOTM start (nice, Thal), in that it offers genuine choices (and food for discussion) right off the bat.

Moving west two tiles does transform the position by putting all those hills on the second level, instead of the third. Growth will require a choice, unless the warrior finds grassland to the west - a lighthouse or clearing those swamps?

With regard to a Granary, my game's not open right now, but isn't sugar one of the Granary bonus resources?

 

[Thalassicus]

Granaries give +1 on most edible plants: wheat, spices, bananas, and sugar.

Washington is also very powerful at early rapid expansion:

1. Sight range to locate city sites.
2. Pioneer Forts to defend and grow new cities.
3. Purchase discount to claim land.

With the source of Marble nearby to speed world wonder construction, the Pyramids are an effective way to build our first settler without halting capital population growth. The Pyramids also boost tile improvement construction, which is mainly useful for expansive empires.

 

[Txurce]

Yes, granaries give +1 on the edible grasses: wheat, spices, and sugar.

If not absolutely wrongheaded given game circumstances, I'll be building a Granary. I cannot resist that combination with a Pioneer Fort. And on the other extreme, if I settle in place, I may build Stonehenge for the first time since it was reconfigured.

 

[Gorhaax]

1. Washington is best going wide.

2. Move the settler to the north side of the river; the hills will provide extra protection, production and allow access to 3 sugars instead of 2.

4.Build Scout first, since going wide, then worker or wonder (based on tech's done)

3. I'd go Pottery, Calendar, Fishing. Pottery gives access to granary, which is great with improved sugar. Calendar will give you stonehenge, 2 GE point, 1 hapiness and full borders, and plantation, to work the sugar for extra gold and food. Fishing will give you the ability to get the pearls.

5. Go Mining so i can start working the marble and hills, then Optics for water crossing to the NE.

6. Policies: Liberty, Collective Rule (for settler), then Metocracy for production boost.

7. Send Warrior scouting in the hills NW, when scout is built send him SW then bring him back for scouting across water when optics is finished

Plan may change

 

[mitsho]

The other possibility is to send the warrior over the river, so he can turn south more quickly. The desert to the north is a river with flood plains and an oasis, but what's South of the swamps? On the other hand, the first Scout can more through there quickly so...

It's king difficulty, so we can quite safely make a Stonehenge or Pyramids rush. I actually haven't built Stonehenge ever in the three-tiles version, so I tempted to go there.

The Delta of the Northern River (north of sugar) looks like a good place for the second city right from the start, and Washington should go wide best, not? It also looks to me that Thal moved that Marble to that hill (aren't they in flat terrain normally), so that we'd have to buy it (and use the American UA). What's the order for the tiles acquisition? Sugar-Plains-Clams-Plains-Marble?

I wouldn't move the settler one north, the additional Sugar isn't worth losing the first turn. Also, a Coastal Capital is worth a lot. If there's a cultural city state nearby, I might even go for the Great Lighthouse Merchant.

Too soon to tell...

 

[Gorhaax]

Why isn't worth one turn? You can get extra gold or luxury goods in trading. Also is that a Jungle on the hill just N of the river? If I were to put a settler on it would it devalue the Jungle?

 

[timbuktu]

Could be quick combat actived? Battling animation just waste of time.

I would move the warrior to southwest ( - and / ) to see if there are hills or some resources and consider to move the settler there to build capcity.
Second city may be in that dessert title or oasia, for sugar and vessels creating.

 

[Seek]

Why isn't worth one turn? You can get extra gold or luxury goods in trading. Also is that a Jungle on the hill just N of the river? If I were to put a settler on it would it devalue the Jungle?

It's forest. That hill looks prime now (Thal changed it yet again) - I expect I'll settle there unless the warrior scouts something nice to the west.

 

[mitsho]

Why isn't worth one turn? You can get extra gold or luxury goods in trading. Also is that a Jungle on the hill just N of the river? If I were to put a settler on it would it devalue the Jungle?

The third sugar is next to a stone tile. It's in the vincinity of the capital. Chances are high that you will be able to build a city in that region picking the sugar and the stone up. Besides, you lose a hill tile and you lessen your chances for a second river-coastal city up north. (although that is still possible, you need to scout there first).

The defense-potential of the city looks immense, I give you that. It's a hill tile surrounded by plains and a river around it. The Archer can pick off anything, but the melee units will still stand in the plains. The question is rather wether you need a defensible capital site that much. What about the other cities? If you go tall OCC-style, then you need more production. Otherwise, that sugar will belong ot another city, and that is ok.

On second thought, with the granary bonus and all, it might work and it's certainly a special solution. It's not a bad move, not at all. I just don't see it as giving a big edge.

 

[Thalassicus]

I suspect staying put or moving to the hill will depend on what the warrior reveals. Both of those choices seem like good options, and possibly even Seek's idea of 2 tiles west.

Could be quick combat actived?

--- 3. Vanilla Bugs ---
Combat: "Combat ended" event does not fire if no combat animation plays. This affects quick combat, strategic view, and defeating non-combat units.
Workaround: Avoid quick combat, and use normal view for combat situations and between turns.

Using quick combat breaks all mods that interact with combat. That vanilla bug is unfixable because it's in the game core only Firaxis has access to. I work around it by multitasking combat: while the combat animation plays I go do other things, like giving workers orders.

 

[timbuktu]

Little offtopic.
So not working profesional army can be result of quick combat activated? I will check it soon.