Few questions about warmongering in civ

[Morthis]

I'm just curious, do most people feel warmongering works well on normal, or do you prefer a slower game?

I'm asking because I always feel like I run out of time so fast. Now I'll admit, I always seem to postpone things too long (oh just these last few buildings in my hammer cities, oh just a few more techs for a better unit, etc). Maybe part of it is a problem with my approach to this.

To me it always feels like if I start a big war, by the time the war is over, the units I'm using are already long outdated. Maybe part of it is because I only build up big SoD's when I'm planning to go to war (as opposed to always training), or because I try to finish off an opponent entirely if possible, but it just seems like the game moves too quickly for longer wars on normal.

So I guess my question is, does the game really move by that quickly on normal, or am I approaching this the wrong way? ><

 

[kooboo]

All the arguments You gave are valid.
The game is a bit too quick on normal for proper warmongering.
Units move the same speed on all game speeds, but everything else is slower on Epic and Marathon.

 

[troytheface]

massive archer to longbow armies.

they last the longest in my experience.

 

[JTMacc99]

Units move the same speed on all game speeds, but everything else is slower on Epic and Marathon.

That seems to be the kicker. It is simply the amount of time it takes to MOVE your army that seems to eat up all of the units' useful lives at Normal speed.

On Epic, which is my favorite, it takes exactly the same amount of time to move all the units up to the front or across the ocean, but it is taking 50% more time to research the technologies that will out-date those units.

Also, I fall into the same pattern of waiting until everything seems to be overwhelmingly in my favor before my DoW. Give a shot at going to war once in a while when you think you've got a strategic advantage but might not yet have the giant stack of units available right then. You'll probably find that the AI isn't ready to go to war either.

For example, if you can bring cannons to a battlefield when the other guy is still pre-gunpowder, upgrade every possible treb to a cannon and declare war the next turn. Axemen and Longbows can clean up a city after you shred it to pieces with a dozen cannons. As long as you have enough units to HOLD the cities you take, you can worry about drafting an army of soldiers later. Press your huge advantage while you still have it. Waiting around until you have the big army to go with your cannons is just giving the AI more turns to rake in the commerce and hammers from those cities that could easily be yours today. Know what I mean?

 

[z0wb13]

slower game speeds and smaller maps tend to increase the efficiency of warmongering, so much so that marathon speed is rather unbalanced unless you play on the largest maps.

also, faster game speeds make any miscalculations more deleterious. epic-speed is more forgiving of many stupid mistakes, like leaving a citizen specialist on for a few turns or wasting worker movements.

i did a poll that sort of addressed this; you can find it here. but i find that normal-speed is too much like sim_city, like it's just lots of watching bars filling-up and buildings appearing, while marathon is like a bad game of risk.

 

[Cashew]

I play on quick speed and it works fine. I can't even imagine how easy things would be if I played on normal where people can't slave units as fast.

 

[Windsor]

You don't have time for long wars and especially not long preparations. Some things to consider for more efficient warmongering:
- Have 1-2 military cities that (almost) only produce units all the time.
- Scout, scout scout!
- Know what you want to achive, and most of the time you want to have objectives that don't need reinforcements to complete.
- Know when to attack and beeline the tech(s) needed.
- Rush chop/wip/draft/buy/upgrade your army once the tech is researched!!!
- If you pillage or just take a few cities you may cripple your opponent enough to make him an easy pick later
- Don't be afraid to accept a peace treaty (10 turns) to regroup, reinforce and possibly get som nice techs.
- Fast moving(horse archers, cavalry etc) stacks can be very efficient alone (weaker cities and pillaging) or combined with spies to take down cultural defenses.

The time-frame you have on normal game speed is more than enough for warmongering-stategies, but you have to be efficient.

 

[Derp]

Actually, The Great Attacko has something there. I was playing a game as Charlie once, and didn't have any resources, so I built up a massive army of Guerilla 3 longbows supported by lots of catapults and managed to wrest control of an entire continent from Monty and someone else I don't remmember. Good times. If anyone trys to tell you that archery units are weak and proctective is a horrible trait, don't listen to them ;-)

 

[PaulusIII]

Actually, The Great Attacko has something there. I was playing a game as Charlie once, and didn't have any resources, so I built up a massive army of Guerilla 3 longbows supported by lots of catapults and managed to wrest control of an entire continent from Monty and someone else I don't remmember. Good times. If anyone trys to tell you that archery units are weak and proctective is a horrible trait, don't listen to them ;-)

It is still a bad trait.

Longbows are inferior attackers to units one era behind them. While I understand this was an emergency measure, horse archers have them beaten while being much earlier in the tech tree. Even swords are superior attackers because of the availabily of the City Raider promotion.

Also, Attacko thinks catapults are for cottage plodding reloaders who cry home to mama. His 'advice' is BS as usual.

 

[Epic Username]

Why use Archery units to attack cities? I don't see how they are any better than swordies and Axemen.

 

[Woodreaux]

Why use Archery units to attack cities? I don't see how they are any better than swordies and Axemen.

If you batter the city defenders enough with siege units, it doesn't matter which units you use to finish them off. Archers and longbows have the Drill line of promotions, which melee doesn't.

 

[§L¥ Gµ¥]

You don't have time for long wars and especially not long preparations. Some things to consider for more efficient warmongering:
- Have 1-2 military cities that (almost) only produce units all the time.
- Scout, scout scout!
- Know what you want to achive, and most of the time you want to have objectives that don't need reinforcements to complete.
- Know when to attack and beeline the tech(s) needed.
- Rush chop/wip/draft/buy/upgrade your army once the tech is researched!!!
- If you pillage or just take a few cities you may cripple your opponent enough to make him an easy pick later
- Don't be afraid to accept a peace treaty (10 turns) to regroup, reinforce and possibly get som nice techs.
- Fast moving(horse archers, cavalry etc) stacks can be very efficient alone (weaker cities and pillaging) or combined with spies to take down cultural defenses.

The time-frame you have on normal game speed is more than enough for warmongering-stategies, but you have to be efficient.

+1.
good post. I agree with everything here. I usually play for one of the two warmongering victories in most games, and I only play normal speed, standard sized maps. It may not be the most efficient way at achieving victory, but more often than not it poses some unique challenges, and improves your overall effectiveness as a warmonger.

 

[BurN]

I'm just curious, do most people feel warmongering works well on normal, or do you prefer a slower game?

I'm asking because I always feel like I run out of time so fast. Now I'll admit, I always seem to postpone things too long (oh just these last few buildings in my hammer cities, oh just a few more techs for a better unit, etc). Maybe part of it is a problem with my approach to this.

To me it always feels like if I start a big war, by the time the war is over, the units I'm using are already long outdated. Maybe part of it is because I only build up big SoD's when I'm planning to go to war (as opposed to always training), or because I try to finish off an opponent entirely if possible, but it just seems like the game moves too quickly for longer wars on normal.

So I guess my question is, does the game really move by that quickly on normal, or am I approaching this the wrong way? ><

If you have a military tech advantage, go all out with it. You answered your question yourself.

massive archer to longbow armies.

they last the longest in my experience.

Yes longbows are great to attack with, I got my first settler win with them yesterday.