Fighters/Tri-Wings

Dunkah

Emperor
Joined
Feb 7, 2007
Messages
1,190
Location
Just north of Boston
At some point in time did the strength of intercepting get reduced?

I used to be able to put a load of 5 Tri-Wings on a carrier and have no problems with attacking aircraft.

Currently every time I bring my navy within flying distance of any city with 6 aircraft I am doomed.
Turn 1 the 6 aircraft bombard my carrier. Despite the fact they are all set to intercept and have an extra intercept skill their intercepting seems fruitless. I have yet to shoot down an enemy aircraft. My carrier dies.

So I rewind and try again bringing a second carrier also filled with intercepting aircraft. 10 Aircraft with double intercepts. Turn 1 carrier number 1 dies, turn 2 carrier number 2 dies. every turn after that I lose 1 of my battleships until my navy is crippled.:crazyeye:

This was never the case before. It was always a race to see who got air first if they did then I would have to hold off my Navy until such time as I could get Aircraft Carriers and fighters to fend off their fighters and bombers. But now even that seems to be fruitless.
 
Sounds like some kind of weirdness.
It's true that you'll almost never shoot down a plane with a single intercept, but you should do serious damage to them at least, and then shoot then down on following turns if they attack, especially if it's your fighters vs their bombers.

It's been a long time since I've used aircraft much - are there some issues with relative strengths? Are there missing penalties vs ships, or crazy bonuses vs ships? I vaguely remember at one point seeing a +50% vs naval promotion.

I'm assuming equal tech, you're not complaining that your WWI triplanes can't fight off WW2 bombers, right?

We also at one point at least considered giving the aircraft carrier built-in interception; it doesn't do enough as it is, and air cover is supposed to be some of its role, so giving it some built-in AA would be a useful thing.
 
I'm talking mainly Tri-Wings vs. Bi-Wings.

They should not be able to sink a carrier first turn especially if it has 5 Tri-Wings all on intercept with double intercept chance.
I thought that once you intercepted a flight it did little or no damage.
 
I thought that once you intercepted a flight it did little or no damage.
That's certainly how it's supposed to work AFAIK.

But they're each seriously damaging a carrier (significantly higher tech) even when intercepted?? That needs some kind of fix.
 
@Dunkah

I don't know either, but I will do some investigating for you.

Edit:

Preliminary search shows nothing has been changed with regard to tri-planes or interception.
Anything else about your setup I need to know?
 
I am a little further along now.

My Jets are doing 16 to 24 damage to Bombers. Those bombers are in turn doing anywhere from 22 to 16 damage to my units.

Setup.
Using version 3.16 latest I think.
Unit adjustments mod.
DLL by Whoward with:
Pontoon Bridges
Grateful Settlers
Passable Forts
Flagships
Also the UI DLC
 
Are you able to tell me what promotions are active on your and the AI units?
 
Looking through the Civilopedia, I note that Biplanes, Bombers, and Stealth Bombers get the "Bonus vs Sea" promotion *twice*. Perhaps that is the source of the problem?
 
I'm checking through the promotions to make sure those are working correctly. The sea bonus is definitely listed twice as one bug.
 
So I eventually finished this game.

At the end I had Jets set on Intercept. On a carrier. Max load (5). All five had 100% intercept skill.

They got attacked by 12-ish Bi-Wing bombers. (I couldn't tell exactly how many because my eyes glazed over waiting for all of them, plus they went back and forth between three separate battles all involving Bi-wing bombers while it was Ashbunipals turn). Sunk my carrier... 0 Bi-Wings shot down.

It was rather funny.
 
In CEU_Promotions_end.sql, look for this

INSERT INTO Unit_FreePromotions (UnitType, PromotionType)
SELECT DISTINCT Type, 'PROMOTION_SEA_BONUS_II'
FROM Units WHERE CombatClass IN (
'UNITCOMBAT_BOMBER'
);

Remove the second (duplicate) copy of it. That should be a start to help with it. (My copy of promotions is more heavily edited at this point as I've been doing other things to the overall mod or I would upload the fix)

Fighters should all have 100% versus air units (and helicopters) as well. Check that that's active.
 
The second part (the 100% versus air part) was inactive as the default promotion was removed without replacing it as a reduced promotion. Meaning fighters and bombers fight at equal strength.

That's combining with the doubled sea bonus to make it ridiculously strong to attack with bombers without having to do any sweeping for interceptors.

This is not intended so far as I know/can tell. The intent was simply to reduce the bonus to 100% as fighters and bombers had strengths equaled now instead of off-set with a super-high bonus (150%). It's an easy fix at least. (replace the bomber's duplicated sea bonus with a "promotion_anti_air" for "fighter" as a unit class). Give me a couple days to finish the other stuff for the revamp mod and it should all be out.
 
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