1. We have added the ability to collapse/expand forum categories and widgets on forum home.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. All Civ avatars are brought back and available for selection in the Avatar Gallery! There are 945 avatars total.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. To make the site more secure, we have installed SSL certificates and enabled HTTPS for both the main site and forums.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Civ6 is released! Order now! (Amazon US | Amazon UK | Amazon CA | Amazon DE | Amazon FR)
    Dismiss Notice
  5. Dismiss Notice
  6. Forum account upgrades are available for ad-free browsing.
    Dismiss Notice

Final Constitutional Poll

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Multi-site Demo Game: High Council' started by Octavian X, Feb 22, 2003.

?

Do you approve this constitution?

  1. Yes

    17 vote(s)
    68.0%
  2. No

    6 vote(s)
    24.0%
  3. (bad habit) Abstain

    2 vote(s)
    8.0%
  1. Octavian X

    Octavian X is not a pipe.

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2002
    Messages:
    5,428
    Location:
    deceiving people with images
    Based on this discussion, I will post a final poll approving our Constitution.

    This is the actual document:
    ------------------------------------
    The Constitution of Fanatikou

    Article A: All Civfanatics Forum users who register in the Citizen Registry are citizens of Fanatikou, subject to the approval of the Judiciary. Citizens have the right to assemble, the right to free movement, the right to free speech, the right to a fair trial, the right to representation, the right to demand satisfaction and the right to vote.

    Article B: Governing rules shall consist of the Articles of the Constitution, the Code of Laws and the Code of Standards. No laws shall be passed that conflict with an article and no standards shall be used that conflict with a law or an article.

    Article C: The government will consist of the Executive Branch, Legislative Branch and Judicial Branch.

    Article D: The Executive Branch is headed by the President, who shall be the designated player of the game. Directly below the President shall be the Domestic and Foreign Affairs Leaders. The Science and Military Leader shall report directly to the Domestic Leader, and the Culture and Trade Leaders shall report to the Foreign Affairs Leader. Each of these leaders will be generally responsible for the items found under the respective Advisor in the Civilization III game and esoteric aspects that fall under their department name.

    Article E: The Legislative Branch shall consist of the Congress and the Senate. The Congress will be formed of the entirety of the citizenry. The Senate shall be formed of the Provincial Governors, who shall be responsible for the care, management and use of the cities and lands of a province.

    Article F: The Judicial Branch will be formed of three leaders, one who is tasked with upholding the laws (Judge Advocate), one who is tasked with defending the citizenry (Public Defender) and headed by the Chief Justice. It shall be the main responsibility of the Judiciary to admit citizens into the game who shall have joined after February 16, 2003.

    Article G: All offices will be filled via election with terms lasting according to a fixed schedule based on game years. Terms shall be divided into 10 equal terms of 45 turns each and place elections accordingly.

    Article H: It is unlawful to play through actions, move troops, make deals or take any other action that would change the state of the playing game from that of the saved game.
    Exception: The structure of peace renegotiation treaties requires an action to be taken to view the bargaining possibilities. Specifically, once the deal is broached it must result in a new deal or a declaration of war. Once the bargaining possibilities have been noted the altered game must be immediately closed without saving. Further activity in the altered game is not allowed.

    Article I: The average of the number of votes cast in each of the most recent contested elections shall constitute an active census of citizens. The highest vote total of these elections shall constitute a full census (the Congress). A majority of the Congress shall be required to amend the Constitution.

    Article J: Elected officials must plan and act according to the will of the people.

    Article K: The constitution, laws and standards of Fanatikou can never be contrary to the rules and regulations of the Civfanatics forums. Moderators may veto any such constitutional amendments, laws or standards.

    Article L. Both President and Foreign Affairs Leader are de-facto ambassadors. Regular Ambassadors are elected each term. Ambassadors shall only be chosen when Fanatikou has made in-game contact with a rival civilization.

    Article M. In the event the positions of Domestic, Foreign Affairs, or any Judicial position becomes vacant, the President shall apoint a new leader to fill the vacant position.
    In the event the military, science, or any governorship position becomes vacant, the Domestic Leader shall apoint a new leader to fill the vacant position.
    In the event the culture, trade, or any Ambassador position becomes vacant, the Foreign Affairs Leader shall appoint a new leader to fill the vacant position.
    In the event the President vacates his/her position, the domestic leader shall become President, and shall appoint a new leader to be domestic leader.
    All appointments must be approved by the Council.
    In the event any leader takes a temporary leave of absence, he shall appoint a pro-tempore official to fill that position until the leader shall return.
    ------------------------------------
     
  2. Octavian X

    Octavian X is not a pipe.

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2002
    Messages:
    5,428
    Location:
    deceiving people with images
    If this gets passed, I plan to create a html document to post on the web as reference. If I did that, could we get it posted on the civfanatics.net Dmoecracy Game page?
     
  3. Goonie

    Goonie Lonely End of the Rink

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2002
    Messages:
    3,312
    Location:
    Kingston
    What did you add to donsig's constitution?
     
  4. eyrei

    eyrei Chieftain Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2001
    Messages:
    9,162
    Location:
    Cary, NC USA
    Article A needs to be rewritten. It can be interpreted as saying that the judiciary must review all new members. This is simply not going to happen. You do not have the means necessary to bring forward evidence to prove someone is a spy, and witch hunts will not be allowed.
     
  5. Chieftess

    Chieftess Moderator Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2002
    Messages:
    24,160
    Location:
    Baltimore
    I agree with eyrei.

    Not only will this be overwhelming for the judiciary, it's going to create conflicts with posters on this forum.
     
  6. CivGeneral

    CivGeneral Valkyrie Grand General

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2002
    Messages:
    42,390
    Location:
    Solitude, Republic of Nova Terra
    I also agree with Eyrei.

    This would cause a conflict with many of the newbie posters and possibly scare them away. I would Strongly recomend changing it.
     
  7. Chieftess

    Chieftess Moderator Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2002
    Messages:
    24,160
    Location:
    Baltimore
    Not to mention, it creates a sense of newbie bashing.
     
  8. Gingerbread Man

    Gingerbread Man Dark Magus

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2002
    Messages:
    2,078
    Location:
    Ooorstrailier!

    :rolleyes: Conflicts? Oh the conflicts. I return from a thread battle scarred. PLEASE NO MORE SPY ACCUSATIONS! They dont actually solve anything. They just make everybody offend each other like one big happy family.

    So, lets change the constitution to 'any suspicions of spies are to be directed to a moderator, and there is to be no thread or post about it.'
     
  9. donsig

    donsig Low level intermediary

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2001
    Messages:
    12,892
    Location:
    Rochester, NY
    Not only can it be interpreted that way, that is exactly how it is intended to be interpreted! All the teams in the MSDG have agreed to keep their team rosters public. At the very least we can check new applicants to our team against the rosters of the other teams. I see nothing wrong with doing this. It is not against CFC rules. Nor do I see anything wrong with placing this responsibility on our Judiciary. It may be a waste of time but it is our time to waste, is it not? I see no need to rewrite this clause of our constitution.

    Part of the trouble is that the game started before we were ready. Please give us a chance to get things together. Once our judiciary is set up and we discuss its proper role I am sure we can find that happy medium. Our judiciary can review and approve new team members in a professional way that will not be witch hunts. It can also be done without making new threads about any particular applicant.

    Also, eyrei, if you are going to post as a moderator please specify that you are doing so in order to avoid confusion.
     
  10. eyrei

    eyrei Chieftain Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2001
    Messages:
    9,162
    Location:
    Cary, NC USA
    It is against the forum rules, and this part of the constitution is going to be rewritten. If you suspect someone is a spy, refer it to a moderator and we will see if we can find anything out. Do not start a thread about someone you think is a spy! There are rules against starting threads that target other posters.
     
  11. Goonie

    Goonie Lonely End of the Rink

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2002
    Messages:
    3,312
    Location:
    Kingston
    I have PMed Thunderfall about all of this. He is the one who suggested this sub-forum be used for the weeding out of potential spies, so I do not understand eyrei, why you are trying so hard not to let us do this.

    Also eyrei according to your logic PI's are against forum rules! Are we going to stop those?
     
  12. eyrei

    eyrei Chieftain Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2001
    Messages:
    9,162
    Location:
    Cary, NC USA
    I believe Thunderfall has changed his mind, after realizing what was involved. And if I have my way we will also do away with PIs.

    For now, consider this an official warning. The next person who starts a thread that targets another poster is going to get a 3 day vacation. If you want to comment on this warning, PM me. Do not post your comments here. If you do, you will get a 3 day vacation. I hope I make myself clear.
     
  13. Octavian X

    Octavian X is not a pipe.

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2002
    Messages:
    5,428
    Location:
    deceiving people with images
    If Article A is going to be rewritten, may I suggest another way to write it?

    I have a few ideas.
    A. Require a few days' active involvment in the real democracy game. (ex. a post a day for five days)
    B. Compare name (not IP) lists with other teams.

    Looking back, if each of the MSDG teams abide by the ruleset as provided at the start, I am sure we will have no spy troubles. We will pass this constituion, with the specificed clause out all together, and discuss other means of checking for spys, if any at all.

    Also, to my first post: Can we get this up on the Demogame Webpage that has the link to the constituion? I can create an html version if necesary.
     
  14. Chieftess

    Chieftess Moderator Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2002
    Messages:
    24,160
    Location:
    Baltimore
    I can make a MSDG page, I have FTP access, as does Shaitan. Any of us can update it.
     
  15. Goonie

    Goonie Lonely End of the Rink

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2002
    Messages:
    3,312
    Location:
    Kingston
    @Octavian, I would love it if you would allow me to do a write up.
     

Share This Page