Final Version - "Corporations" abandoned?

[Izmir Stinger]

I know there were a lot of bugs associated with them, but I really liked the cults and guilds that used the BtS corporation mechanics. Have they been abandoned completely, or are they going to be re-enabled in a patch?

 

[Kael]

I know there were a lot of bugs associated with them, but I really liked the cults and guilds that used the BtS corporation mechanics. Have they been abandoned completely, or are they going to be re-enabled in a patch?

There are no plans to add them back. They were okay, but not great so they got cut. The best parts of them, like the Guild of the Nine allowing mercenary hires or the ability to earn the Gaelan hero, were kept but not tied to a corporation (Guild of the Nine and the Guild of Hammers became wonders, Gaelan became an event chain, etc).

 

[WarKirby]

There are guild-esque corporations in Fall Further

I'm guessing such things won't be in FFH though

 

[Izmir Stinger]

I liked them because they were another thing that made cities distinct from one another. Unless you are Tolerant, every city is just defined by its terrain and whatever population and improvements survive your assault. The presence of guilds gave some of them more uniqueness.

Ah well, great game anyhow. I am really enjoying the new scenarios.

 

[someone67]

...The best parts of them, like the Guild of the Nine allowing mercenary hires or the ability to earn the Gaelan hero, were kept but not tied to a corporation (Guild of the Nine and the Guild of Hammers became wonders, Gaelan became an event chain, etc).

Has anyone ever gotten Gaelan since guilds were cut?

 

[WarKirby]

I had no Idea Gaelan even existed.

Never gotten Mary Morbus either

 

[evanb]

Me neither

 

[Seon]

I once gotten Gaelan as a Calabim. Turned him into a lich and made him mutate bloodpets so that I could make über Flash Golem... Seriously, out of 50 FFH game I played it happened only once....

 

[Algeroth]

There are no plans to add them back. They were okay, but not great so they got cut. The best parts of them, like the Guild of the Nine allowing mercenary hires or the ability to earn the Gaelan hero, were kept but not tied to a corporation (Guild of the Nine and the Guild of Hammers became wonders, Gaelan became an event chain, etc).

Don't say that there is not enough crying fans of Cult of the Dragon.....Oh Mighty Kael, please look down to us, unworthy and bring back CotD.

 

[Elm]

I thought Gaelan only had channeling II, so couldn't be liched...

 

[Kael]

Don't say that there is not enough crying fans of Cult of the Dragon.....Oh Mighty Kael, please look down to us, unworthy and bring back CotD.

Why did you like the Cult of the Dragon?

 

[someone67]

I thought Gaelan only had channeling II, so couldn't be liched...

In the last changelog Kael stated that you could upgrade Gaelan to an archmage.

 

[Seven05]

Has anyone ever gotten Gaelan since guilds were cut?

Yes, a couple of days ago while playing as the Amurites. Pretty early in the game too, all things considered. I think that event is just really rare as that's the first time I've seen it in ages.

 

[Algeroth]

Why did you like the Cult of the Dragon?

Definitely not because it's mechanic, it was only a pain in my lower back (When I was not playing Kurios or Sheaim) or practically non-existent game-wise.

But it fit perfectly to the lore. (or my image of it).
And it was a immense player-generated quest, the kind of quests that are reason why we haven't vanilla quests in FFH. It gave me something to pursue, something different to wonder/building/unit building or conquering neighbours. It gave me a good feeling when I found it before the other civ and I could see how my agents are causing havoc in enemy lands (If i were Sheaim) or criticize thier intolerance (As Cardith).

 

[Kael]

Definitely not because it's mechanic, it was only a pain in my lower back (When I was not playing Kurios or Sheaim) or practically non-existent game-wise.

But it fit perfectly to the lore. (or my image of it).
And it was a immense player-generated quest, the kind of quests that are reason why we haven't vanilla quests in FFH. It gave me something to pursue, something different to wonder/building/unit building or conquering neighbours. It gave me a good feeling when I found it before the other civ and I could see how my agents are causing havoc in enemy lands (If i were Sheaim) or criticize thier intolerance (As Cardith).

Yeah, this is why it was cut. The flavor was excellent but the actual mechanic wasn't fun. Fun > Function > Flavor.

 

[Neomega]

Has anyone ever gotten Gaelan since guilds were cut?

I have. He came after a series of ethical questions.

 

[Algeroth]

Yeah, this is why it was cut. The flavor was excellent but the actual mechanic wasn't fun. Fun > Function > Flavor.

Isn't there any chance to return it back through events? Fun is derived factor and where someone take it from creating perfectly oiled (war?)machine, someone takes a more laid-back approach and merely watches what happens with his realm.

The problem with CotD was that it's only outcome was hurting majority of the civs. And nothing more. But could be possible to write events both positive and negative (with bonuses for S/K) tied to CotD building buildable only through random events?

 

[Kael]

Isn't there any chance to return it back through events? Fun is derived factor and where someone take it from creating perfectly oiled (war?)machine, someone takes a more laid-back approach and merely watches what happens with his realm.

The problem with CotD was that it's only outcome was hurting majority of the civs. And nothing more. But could be possible to write events both positive and negative (with bonuses for S/K) tied to CotD building buildable only through random events?

Its possible. But you are trying to rescue flavor here (ie: "we have a cool flavor idea, lets try to find a good function for it"). Its not that we never work like that, but in general its bad game design. Id rather work from the opposite, we have a functional game need to fill and then determine the flavor. If a mechanic isnt working, if it doesnt fill a functional need, then regardless of the flavor its probably doomed.

 

[Algeroth]

Its possible. But you are trying to rescue flavor here (ie: "we have a cool flavor idea, lets try to find a good function for it"). Its not that we never work like that, but in general its bad game design. Id rather work from the opposite, we have a functional game need to fill and then determine the flavor. If a mechanic isnt working, if it doesnt fill a functional need, then regardless of the flavor its probably doomed.

Ach, the reason why we don't have full 21 spheres, right? I get it, still Its hard to us, flavor junkies.

 

[Verdian]

I think my problem with the removal of the Cult of the Dragon is that when the guild (or whatever) was removed, all mention of the Cult was removed as well. A few events to keep the lore alive would be enough for some of us roleplay fiends. I wrote some for fun.

Spoiler :

I tried to keep the negative results not horrible (because they are more often) and the good results decent. But honestly, I just like writing this kind of stuff. I made it a chain, but it could easily work as separate events.

First Words (requires AC 20)
A man predicting the end of the world has begun preaching to the masses, and the masses are listening! He promises salivation in the arms of a Dragon God.

1) All men have the right to speak.
2) The man is nuisance and a fool. Silence him. (1 unhappy for 4 turns. This ends all future events in the chain.)
3) (requires Sheaim or Kuriotates)I have had similar visions. This man speaks the truth and must be heard. (religion removed for ten turns, gain a Great Prophet)

A Following Emerges (requires AC 50)
A large crowd of robed men and women wearing masks in the shape of a dragon's head has taken to the streets of [city]. They are not doing causing any harm, but are armed and preaching of the End of Days. Many of our citizens are scared.

1) Let them be, so long as they cause no harm. (2 turn of Anarchy)
2) I have seen the signs they speak of, and it would be foolish to ignore them further. Disperse the crowd and begin training a group of soldiers to deal with this threat. (lose 75 gold, gain a Dragon Slayer with some xp)
3) (requires evil) Kill them. I will not have my citizens feeling uneasy. (lose one population. This ends all future events in the chain.)
4) (requires Sheiam or Kuriotate) They speak with my blessing. Ensure that all throughout our lands hear their words. (random chance for all units in the players empire to gain the courage promotion (or loyalty), +1 happy in all cities)

The Followers Reward (requires a dragon unit to exist, AC 80)
Tales spread throughout your lands of a Dragon that leads their people to victory, and a Dragon Cult that is favored by the great beast. In these turbulent and fearful times, the hope of such protection is tempting to many.

1) I cannot stop them. Let those who wish to leave, leave. (lose 2 population, +2 diplo modifier with Kuriotates and Sheaim)
2) Employ the guards to remind our people that I, and I alone, can offer them the protection they need. (-4 unhappy for ten turns)
3) (requires Illian) Spread the tales of Drifa and remind our people that our return to greatness is near. (nothing)
4) (requires Kuriotate or Sheiam) Let the hopeful flood our streets! (gain +3 population in city)
5) (requires Dragon unit) The faithful shall follow in the footsteps of [dragon name], and be favored among all others. (gain 3 champions with the immortal promotion)