Finer Details Go Over My Head, Help (i.e.: civics, buildables)

[tman2000]

I just can't really sort out how to prioritize or use certain bonuses in the game. Certain civics, certain social policies of civs like the Shawnee. The city-state buildables.

Like, how does a +1 gold +2 science buildable help me when I'm at +300 science? I always have something to produce, and already have three or four trade-offs. When will a little buildable help? And I can't even build these things in most tiles because of adjacency trade offs.

I almost always ignore half the civics, focusing on key civics or whether there's a settlement limit upgrade or some specific wonder I want. Although, it seems like half the wonders kind of suck.

I just still can't wrap my head around how to prioritize and sort out some of these more nuanced bonuses. I just kind of ignore them as they don't seem to really affect the trajectory of my game.

Adding to that, there are bonuses which are more cogent to me, but I don't know how to use. Like, Russia has a civic that makes troops withstand snowstorms better. Got it, super clear. When do I ever use that? Like, maybe once in a game? When would that shift the tide one way or another?

Same goes for Commander upgrades. A few of them are cool, and some make perfect sense. Like initiative or slotting 2 more units. But some are very esoteric. It "would be nice" to plan around and use these abilities, trading off other things like standard initiative upgrade or combat upgrades. But when would I actually use these? It seems really hard to scheme my way to use these upgrades where it actually makes a tide turning difference. The commando ability I guess is something you could totally apply on certain maps for certain cities. I faced a monster Inca once that had FOUR layers of single tile terraces with a cliff behind them in a row. But then, commander radius. What is the commander radius? If you can scale cliffs, that's great, but then the logistics of getting past four layers of cliffs with a one tile commander radius instantly prevents the usefulness of the ability, as the logistics of cycling in fresh troops to keep scaling will fall apart as you get up one or two layers.

So, anyway, any thoughts or tips? Is it possible that a lot of these bonuses really are just kind of "dev theoretical" and you'll just never really apply them? Or is there some actuarial alchemy behind using these more arcane civic bonuses that I'm too smooth-brained for?

 

[ThichN]

I've said this in another thread, but I think the issue is that there is not the same sort of hyper-optimization of Civ6, which is throwing folks off. A lot of the decisions you mention above do have perfectly valid uses in different circumstances and the strategy is finding when and where to make those decisions. There is not necessarily the "best" decision. There is the decision that will be most interesting, the decision that will allow you to pivot, the decision that will give you more yields, the decision that will help you build tall, the decision that will come from using an ability, and vice versa. Etc.

This is where their cheesy catchphrase "Build something you believe in" comes from.

 

[Yzman]

Maybe its just me, but often when I take some of these +1 science type policies....my science seems to go up way further than it would suggest. I think that is pre any bonuses, specialists etc.

 

[stealth_nsk]

Maybe its just me, but often when I take some of these +1 science type policies....my science seems to go up way further than it would suggest. I think that is pre any bonuses, specialists etc.

Yes, exactly. All percentage bonuses are applied after additive ones.

 

[Smegger213]

Have you tried the show policy yields mod? https://forums.civfanatics.com/resources/leonardfactorys-policy-yield-previews.32012/
It gives you a better view of what you will get with most of the policy options.

 

[evonannoredars]

At the moment I just hope whatever I'm doing is getting me more yields. I'm holding off using many UI mods at the moment because I want to be able to better feel what they change in future UI updates, I'm really hoping they improve the super unhelpful 'other' section in the yield breakdown and improve the individual city yield panels (I am slowly beginning to cave though, that one above looks so good...)

 

[chazzycat]

for city state buildables there are a few considerations:

1) will it last long enough to recoup investment? they get wiped at the end of the age.
2) how many rural tiles of the appropriate terrain do you even have? Some small looking bonuses can add up if you can spam it all over.
3) is it a better option than their other rewards?

For me I haven’t built any yet, but I keep looking for the right opportunity.

 

[Yzman]

for city state buildables there are a few considerations:

1) will it last long enough to recoup investment? they get wiped at the end of the age.
2) how many rural tiles of the appropriate terrain do you even have? Some small looking bonuses can add up if you can spam it all over.
3) is it a better option than their other rewards?

For me I haven’t built any yet, but I keep looking for the right opportunity.

I built some outposts that gave me gold...they were a nice mix when I couldn't build my own civ one. I basically covered all of my farms, mines etc with one of the 2 and I was raking in crazy amounts of yields.

 

[chazzycat]

I built some outposts that gave me gold...they were a nice mix when I couldn't build my own civ one. I basically covered all of my farms, mines etc with one of the 2 and I was raking in crazy amounts of yields.

Yeah, I think there is plenty of room for them in some situations. It just hasn't lined up for me yet. Either I've already spammed my own UI in my rural tiles, wanted one of the other rewards more, or friended them too late.

 

[Graethyenne]

Yeah, I think there is plenty of room for them in some situations. It just hasn't lined up for me yet. Either I've already spammed my own UI in my rural tiles, wanted one of the other rewards more, or friended them too late.

Aren't the CS buildables ageless? Man, I am gonna feel silly if I have been doing that wrong......

 

[chazzycat]

Aren't the CS buildables ageless? Man, I am gonna feel silly if I have been doing that wrong......

can't speak to this directly, but I have read several posts of people saying they go away at the end of the age despite being listed as ageless in the tooltip. And it kind of makes sense for that to be an error in the tooltip rather than a bug, considering that the rest of CS bonuses only apply to the current age.

 

[Yzman]

Aren't the CS buildables ageless? Man, I am gonna feel silly if I have been doing that wrong......

They can only be built in the current age since that is only when you are surezein of them. The yields of them are ageless however.

Here is my las game, end of modern era, showing company posts that I built in exploration. It certainly appears I am still getting the yields.

 

[Yzman]

They can only be built in the current age since that is only when you are surezein of them. The yields of them are ageless however.

Here is my las game, end of modern era, showing company posts that I built in exploration. It certainly appears I am still getting the yields.

Actually now that I am looking at this does it appear that I am getting the 4 gold but none of the other yields?

Here is the save if anyone can investigate better than I can. I also have several mississippi and shawnee improvements scattered about...

 

[tman2000]

I've said this in another thread, but I think the issue is that there is not the same sort of hyper-optimization of Civ6, which is throwing folks off. A lot of the decisions you mention above do have perfectly valid uses in different circumstances and the strategy is finding when and where to make those decisions. There is not necessarily the "best" decision. There is the decision that will be most interesting, the decision that will allow you to pivot, the decision that will give you more yields, the decision that will help you build tall, the decision that will come from using an ability, and vice versa. Etc.

This is where their cheesy catchphrase "Build something you believe in" comes from.

Well I'm playing Buganda now and thought it would be cool to do a culture sprint. I have like +700 culture per turn, so even if I raid an entire civ's 6 city homeland (most of which is behind walls by the way), with the bonuses to pillaging, I'll never pillage more than 5 turns of culture. And pillaging is extremely inconvenient due to the mobility cost.

 

[tman2000]

for city state buildables there are a few considerations:

1) will it last long enough to recoup investment? they get wiped at the end of the age.
2) how many rural tiles of the appropriate terrain do you even have? Some small looking bonuses can add up if you can spam it all over.
3) is it a better option than their other rewards?

For me I haven’t built any yet, but I keep looking for the right opportunity.

But who has like 10 rural tiles that they just don't need? I guess warehouse yields keep? Maybe I just need more gold then I can put them in towns.

 

[Yzman]

But who has like 10 rural tiles that they just don't need? I guess warehouse yields keep? Maybe I just need more gold then I can put them in towns.

You put it over the rural tile and it keeps the yields. There is reason reason not to do it... Look at my screenshots above. Notice how the company post has significantly more yields than just the 4 gold it gives?

 

[tman2000]

You put it over the rural tile and it keeps the yields. There is reason reason not to do it... Look at my screenshots above. Notice how the company post has significantly more yields than just the 4 gold it gives?

Why did the production yield increase so much?

 

[Fluffball]

for city state buildables there are a few considerations:

1) will it last long enough to recoup investment? they get wiped at the end of the age.
2) how many rural tiles of the appropriate terrain do you even have? Some small looking bonuses can add up if you can spam it all over.
3) is it a better option than their other rewards?

For me I haven’t built any yet, but I keep looking for the right opportunity.

Aren't the CS buildables ageless? Man, I am gonna feel silly if I have been doing that wrong......

In my experience they are ageless.

How good they are is really up to the situation.

Either way I tend to use them as a gold sink at the end of an age as they can be built in towns as well, go on top of the base improvement and are ageless.

 

[Yzman]

Why did the production yield increase so much?

Would have to look at specifics in the file but it should be a combo of warehouse bonuses and policies that Shawnee have such as giving a production on plains etc.