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Fixing Hills and Lowering Production Costs Seems to Fix a Lot of Issues

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by isau, Oct 29, 2016.

  1. isau

    isau Deity

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    Just wanted to throw this up here. I directly edited all of terrain files so that hills have a net +2 value instead of +3 (+2 hammers instead of +2 hammers +1 food), matching flat tiles. That seems to fix a lot of brokenness, and I think it's where the main game needs to go.

    Without that edit, a start with forested hills is 50% stronger than a start without, possibly even more than that if there are a lot of hills around. Forests still provide +1 hammer (25% stronger than a normal tile) but no longer are these tiles often as good or better than actual resources.

    I know Firaxis has had hills tuned this new way through all of the preview builds and it seems to be intentional, but after trying both methods, I'm convinced the old Civ 4 and 5 method was superior. The issue is that a forested hill that provides +1 Food +3 Hammers is not only overpowered but has no tradeoffs, making it possible to maintain/grow population while also building quickly. It literally functions as a bonus resource on every tile, and if you don't roll hills nearby, you are eating a huge penalty. By removing the bonus Food they have, high Food starts are actually somewhat competitively valuable.

    This of course makes the already long build times even longer so I reduced those too. Seems to produce much better game.

    As an aside, giving the bonuses of an Oasis to their adjacent tiles makes them coveted tiles, which I quite like.
     
    CaiusDrewart, zagosya and sanchopanda like this.
  2. rpgalon

    rpgalon Warlord

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    yeah, nerf hills, nerf factory, nerf power plant, reduce production cost of later era stuff you unlock, increase science/culture required for techs/civics, nerf science generated from population, nerf comercial hub, nerf the 100% cavalry prod card, nerf horseman, nerf Sumeria, nerf Germany, nerf Scythia, make housing easier to get, make amenities more punishing for wide play.

    Make it impossible for civs to start the game away from fresh water.

    This is my wish list.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2016
  3. isau

    isau Deity

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    I'm guessing this is supposed to be sarcastic.

    "Nerfing" hills is hardly a thing. It's restoring them to where they were in previous games, where the values worked.

    I wonder if you will be upset when they undoubtedly do make some of the changes in your list, because they have in every Civ game ever released. At this point I and some others are just trying to give pointers on where to make those edits.
     
  4. zagosya

    zagosya Chieftain

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    specialists (not buildings) should provide most part of great people points
     
  5. rpgalon

    rpgalon Warlord

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    I love how people in the internet are so uptight that when you say anything that is not a big compliment, the first thing that comes to their mind is that they are being provoked.

    There was no /s in my post.
     
  6. isau

    isau Deity

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    I still don't know if you're being serious. I just read it again and your post still reads as sarcastic to me. Sorry I misread your tone if that's not the intent.
     
  7. Iron Angel

    Iron Angel Classified

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    Nope, it comes out pretty much like that for me as well.

    Perhaps you should give constructive criticism, instead of just sounding like a jerk?

    FYI. There was no "/give me compliments" in OP's post.
     
  8. rpgalon

    rpgalon Warlord

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    I said yeah, yeah = agree, I agree with the hill nerf, I proceeded to say what I think should be worked on, no one commentated on my post saying if agree/disagree only said it was sarcasm, probably because you guys think the stuff I said makes no sense and shouldn't be changed.


    Also, the matter was finished in isau second post, but you just had to make a post to call me a jerk and add nothing, perhaps you should give constructive criticism.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2016
  9. isau

    isau Deity

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    At this point I think we're all in agreement at least, so now that I understand what rpgalon was saying, I will say I agree with most of his list.
     
  10. teakbois

    teakbois Prince

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  11. CaiusDrewart

    CaiusDrewart King

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    I think this is a really good idea. When I start around grassland hills there's barely any need for farms at all. With your system, there's once again an interesting decision between building stuff faster and growing faster. Right now you'd be crazy not to work all the hills you can.
     

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