Forced Revolution by the game code? (SOLVED)

PSG

Warlord
Joined
May 6, 2021
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102
I had rock solid stability. Adopted France and started spamming Exhibition halls. I watched stability go down some, but I watched it every turn to make sure nothing went badly. Had a random event pop up took the +20 Stability as a precaution then I started seeing my stability start dropping. First turn 10% down, then 7% next thing I knew I was down to just below 70%. Switched up build to Commons Quarters. Killed a couple farms to put up +30% stability commons quarters (+60% stability in 2 turns), but my stability kept plummeting. I must have added about 400 stability over the next 20 turns and then bam I'm in a revolution. Huge continent map and had not even met another player. I only had 2 cities total with a ton of outposts. There is not a good reason gameplaywise for this to happen. Is there a bug or did the designers decide to get cute give France a chance for a revolution regardless of game play?
 

kaspergm

Deity
Joined
Aug 19, 2012
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Did you have some trade deals for luxuries being blocked by grievances or something? I think that can give you pretty severe stability hits if you've bought a lot of luxuries from one player.
 

PSG

Warlord
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May 6, 2021
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102
Did you have some trade deals for luxuries being blocked by grievances or something? I think that can give you pretty severe stability hits if you've bought a lot of luxuries from one player.
I had zero relations and zero trade routes.
 

aguaacrobata2

Chieftain
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Jun 19, 2019
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Location
La Plata, Argentina
Have you moved away from the center of any (or some) of the Civic axis?? When you are at the center of each of them you get the maximum stability reward, and as you move to the extremes you lose it in exchage of other reward (like stability, industry, food, influence, gold...)
 

fortydayweekend

Warlord
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Nov 20, 2009
Messages
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Can you post the tooltip showing when you hover over the stability # in a city? That will give a breakdown of all the sources of stability and instability.

If we're just guessing though, my guess is pollution.
 
Joined
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north of Steilacoom, WA
Did you have some trade deals for luxuries being blocked by grievances or something? I think that can give you pretty severe stability hits if you've bought a lot of luxuries from one player.

The biggest Stability hit I ever took in any game was when my major trading partner (as in, over 15 Luxury Trade Routes) was Vassalized by a country who was not friendly. They canceled the Trade Agreement, and in one turn the Stability in every one of my cities went from 100+ to 35. I had to scramble like mad to get it up again, because I had, of course, been unthinkingly relying on the Luxury Trade to keep Stability up - hadn't built a Commons Quarter anywhere, or any other Stabilizing infrastructure.

Lesson Learned (by me, at least)
 

PSG

Warlord
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May 6, 2021
Messages
102
I am leaning more to a programming error that pushed something negative which caused additions to actually be subtractions. I had zero relations with other empires. I was just starting to get pollution so maybe the glitch was with that, but it seemed to accelerate when I chose the +20 stability from an event choice. Maybe that is what caused the problem. Maybe it applied a negative instead of a positive. At that stage of the game in all my other games I have never chosen stability that late in the game because I always want the science, cash or industry.
 

Eagle Pursuit

Scir-Gerefa
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Don't forget you can alleviate some Stability issues by detaching Regions from the city that is struggling.
 

fortydayweekend

Warlord
Joined
Nov 20, 2009
Messages
239
Could be a bug, or could be you've missed something like pollution. There's a few opaque mechanics in the game that can cause stability to tank.

Tooltip when you hover over the stability number should let you know either way, if there's integer flipping it'll be obvious.
 

Elhoim

Iron Tower Studio Dev
Joined
Nov 3, 2004
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2,657
Location
San Isidro, Argentina.
Yeah, when a territory generates more than 20 pollution per turn, each quarter gets -15 stability. Hopefully they tweak the whole system soon so pollution is a problem you can solve and not one you have to avoid.
 

PSG

Warlord
Joined
May 6, 2021
Messages
102
I played a game last night to mimic what happened. The stability bar turns pink and when you mouse over it you get a message about how your stability is moving. The max it says the bar can move is 3% either way and it gives you it's target level of influence if nothing changes. In my game last night I was able to build enough stuff/policy change my way out of hitting zero. The game I was forced into revolution it did not let me even though I built over 200 + stability in Commons Quarters in a about 10 turns and continued to build. It was not pollution since I had nuclear fusion.
 

PSG

Warlord
Joined
May 6, 2021
Messages
102
Well, regardless of the specific problem that's your general problem. You need trade deals for luxuries.

One doesn't have to have trade deals. I just build many Commons Quarters. This also builds up my influence. I have played many games since the game in question and mostly the same way. I have been able to stop the stability bleed in every game before and since. There had a negative integer problem that caused me to be unable to stop the bleed. In the Spiffin Brit's video he clearly shows the negative integer problem with the nuclear missile upkeep so they have a massive issue with their coding. Why won't anybody accept that it exists with other parts of the game? It's not pollution. It's not lack of trades. It's a coding bug.
 

Karmah

Emperor
Supporter
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Mar 3, 2011
Messages
1,128
Yeah, when a territory generates more than 20 pollution per turn, each quarter gets -15 stability. Hopefully they tweak the whole system soon so pollution is a problem you can solve and not one you have to avoid.
One we can solve using solution like.... god I'm missing a case study of this issue being solved , but they are prospective/sci-fi I guess.
there is nuclear fusion that does help in game . that being said ,I'm not an expert , I never ran into pollution being an issue.
 

PSG

Warlord
Joined
May 6, 2021
Messages
102
I figured out basically what was going on.

A builder culture gets 20 stability when t completes a district. When a player has been a builder culture for the entire game and switches to a scientific culture the +20 no longer applies so when I was headed towards zero stability it didn't matter what I built. The game seems to have stored up so much negative stability by that point it didn't matter what I did. There is still probably an issue with the code in the way it stores up negative stability, but at least I know what is going on and I have a new strategy to try out......
 

KrikkitTwo

Immortal
Joined
Apr 3, 2004
Messages
12,418
I figured out basically what was going on.

A builder culture gets 20 stability when t completes a district. When a player has been a builder culture for the entire game and switches to a scientific culture the +20 no longer applies so when I was headed towards zero stability it didn't matter what I built. The game seems to have stored up so much negative stability by that point it didn't matter what I did. There is still probably an issue with the code in the way it stores up negative stability, but at least I know what is going on and I have a new strategy to try out......

I think the thing is Target Stability (what your stability will move towards) v. Current Stability (your actual stability is right now)

Target Stability is basically from Districts (-10 for most, bonus for some others) and Resources (+4 or +10 per copy) and Territories (-20 after the first)... with effects from Wonders, Civics, infrastructure, etc.

Current Stability usually just moves to Target Stability, but....Builders get a +10 to Current Stability every time they build a District... but it can't go more than 100.

So yeah, your Target Stability was probably -500 or so and your Current Stability was 100, and then you switched to France and it dropped by -5 every turn.

The only thing to do is get that Target Stability up to 35

To do that, look at the Stability breakdown and find the "Base Value"

"Base Value" = 40 +- "Fudgefactor" to keep our results in 0-100 range

so if you are stuck near 0 Stability (current), You probably have a "Base Value" of something like 240.... which means you effectively have a "Target Value" of -200... and you have to get Garrisons/Commons/Civics/etc. 200 just to begin to move your stability up.
 
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