Foreign Office (Turns 141 - 160)

[Robi D]

I had sent off this message last night

Dear fe3333au,

Here is our proposal for our technological sharing partnership.

MIA will research Astronomy, Physics and Theory of Gravity and give these technologies to Doughnutia.

In return Doughnutia will research Gunpowder and Banking. Doughnutia will also give MIA 500 gold to help MIA's research.

Both MIA and Doughnutia agree to only share the above technologies with a third party if both teams agree to it.

That at the conclusion of these trades the techonolgical partnership may either be extended further or discontinued subject to talks between both parties. If one or both parties decide to discontinue the agreement any outstanding technonlogy must still be completed.

This is a draft so if you feel there is something missing or some wording could be better then don't be shy in putting forward your ideas.

Robi D
Foreign Minister, Doughnutia

However it seems fe3333au had a similar idea at the same time and sent one to us at the same time

To the Nutter Government ... For Your Eyes Only !!!

I have been instructed to send you this urgent official message.

We are still waiting for a response to our proposal let me say that we totally understand that RL does interfere with the game, but the game swiftly cycles on.

AND ... It has been 2 Weeks since we sent our proposal which detailed a list of topic options we wished for you to address.

To date, we have received nothing but nebulous promises and teasing gestures, nothing concrete, only small titbits lacking in substance, an absence of anything for us to properly consider.

Some of us are beginning to suspect 'deliberate' time wasting, some less stable among MIA are beginning to see subtle nefarious webs of deception being spun in our direction. While my voice is discordant to these, even I am becoming steadily unsure of your motives. I must warn you that the Spectre of Paranoia (the Destroyer) has been sighted lurking in the darkened backalleys of Athens (especially under the shadow of our wondrous sundial)

We are excited about the possibilities of our two great teams linking together, but I stress again that the game turns are being rapidly played and sent. Therefore we require post haste your thoughts on trade options and especially your intentions regarding the KISS situation or we will have no option but to assume the worst.

We are happy to take this in steps, starting with the Gunpowder and next technology trade.

I attach this for your immediate perusal and comment

Spoiler:

Article 1 – Doughnuts and MIA hereby agree to a sweeping nonaggression treaty.
1.1 Neither side will attack the other's units or end their turn inside the others borders without express permission.
1.2 This nonaggression treaty will last a minimum of 35 turns.
1.3 It can be cancelled anytime after the 35th turn by 10 turns written notice to the other team.

Article 2 – Doughnuts and MIA hereby agree to cooperate on researching technology.
2.1 The Doughnuts will immediately provide the secret of Gunpowder to MIA, and MIA will reciprocate with the knowledge of either Banking or with Astronomy.
2.2 If team Doughnut chooses to receive Astronomy, they will also pay MIA an additional 100 gold. (Gunpowder monopoly cost = 1440. Astronomy monopoly cost = 1680. Banking monopoly cost = 1560)
2.3 Upon receiving Gunpowder, MIA will immediately being researching at top speed to learn the secret of Chemistry (Monopoly beaker cost = 1800). Immediately upon leaning this technology, MIA will make it available to team Doughnut for 40% the value in gold = 720 gold.
2.4 Doughnuts may pay MIA for Chemistry with
a) one lump sum of 720 gold, or
b) 10 equal payments of 75 gold and Gems for 20 turns, or
c) 20 equal payments of 40 gold and Gems for 20 turns.
2.5 Once MIA has completed Chemistry, they will immediately begin work on Physics (monopoly beaker cost = 1920). Dnuts will begin work on Metallurgy (monopoly beaker Cost = 1920). As soon as these techs are done, they will be traded straight across.
2.6 MIA and Doughnuts hereby agree to not trade, sell, or gift any technology received from the other team to team KISS without the express permission of the other team.
2.7 MIA and Doughnuts hereby agree that even after the final tech trade specified in this agreement is completed, they will give first preference to the other team in future tech proposals, at least for the rest of the Middle Ages.
2.8 MIA and Doughnuts hereby agree that there will be a 10 turn period after the treaty has been dissolved before any of these technologies can be passed onto KISS.


We hope the numbering system will help us clearly discuss any concerns or modifications you'd like to discuss on this treaty.

Again – we have some key decision to make here soon, and the longer it takes us to get a deal, certain things (like Gunpowder) will become less valuable to us. Even if we can get a broad agreement in principle, we are confident we can satisfactorily resolve any minor issues that remain.

Looking forward to hearing from you and to many years of peace and cooperation!



We give 24 hours for your response ... No reply will be an answer in itself.

I sincerely hope that you do not over react to this letter, but I stress again that you have had 2 weeks to discuss, draft and respond to our proposal.

Regards

Feaurius III
MIA Foreign Offices

While i may have been slow a few times in responding it has only been since the weekend when we talked that there was actually an agreement to make an offer, before that time we had only talked about the possibility of one, i guess MIA are in a hurry. Anyway they seem to have gone into very fine details in their post, so what is the feeling, is it acceptable

 

[killercane]

How do we get them to not realize KISS is doing Chemistry and giving it to us. My proposal is to tell them we are doing chemistry right now, we will give them chemistry + banking + gold eventually for Astro, Physics, ToG. Hold back the lump sum payments to see how things pan out, or give them a small bit to help some deficit research on their part.

This whole deal is contingent on getting us to rails quicker I assume. Then an inevitable backstab. At about the same time as this deal ends, KISS will have Mil Tradition. We will have 30 or so MWs to upgrade and I assume KISS will have 40-50 horses or so for that same purpose, maybe with Leos. We could end MIA at that time with this current deal, though this would not gain us a tremendous amount and would only help KISS ICS their continent.

I do not know how to handle the diplomacy of the Industrial Age but we need to carefully consider it and get a deal in place. The first clause in the deal should be that the agreement supercedes all and any agreements with any other nation, since we are using the devious device of "first deal holds true over subsequent deals" to screw MIA.

 

[Robi D]

How do we get them to not realize KISS is doing Chemistry and giving it to us. My proposal is to tell them we are doing chemistry right now, we will give them chemistry + banking + gold eventually for Astro, Physics, ToG. Hold back the lump sum payments to see how things pan out, or give them a small bit to help some deficit research on their part.

This whole deal is contingent on getting us to rails quicker I assume. Then an inevitable backstab. At about the same time as this deal ends, KISS will have Mil Tradition. We will have 30 or so MWs to upgrade and I assume KISS will have 40-50 horses or so for that same purpose, maybe with Leos. We could end MIA at that time with this current deal, though this would not gain us a tremendous amount and would only help KISS ICS their continent.

I do not know how to handle the diplomacy of the Industrial Age but we need to carefully consider it and get a deal in place. The first clause in the deal should be that the agreement supercedes all and any agreements with any other nation, since we are using the devious device of "first deal holds true over subsequent deals" to screw MIA.

The problem is i don't think we can get them to stay away from chemistry, and give KISS techs rpresents its own problems, because in my discussion over the weekend it seems MIA are checking the tech front every turn, as they knew we got gunpowder the turn we got it and that we discovered education. I have sent a message to KISS to tell them we may have to re work the plan to make it work for us, i'm hoping they get back to us soon, i've tryed to stall MIA a little by posing some questions about the deal

 

[killercane]

We could have KISS give us chem a few turns after them I suppose, adn say we researched it... What leads you to believe that we cant get them to stay away from chemistry?

 

[Kuningas]

2.3 Upon receiving Gunpowder, MIA will immediately being researching at top speed to learn the secret of Chemistry (Monopoly beaker cost = 1800). Immediately upon leaning this technology, MIA will make it available to team Doughnut for 40% the value in gold = 720 gold.
2.4 Doughnuts may pay MIA for Chemistry with
a) one lump sum of 720 gold, or

I understand that MIA has Banking and Astronomy. This is how we should act first trade Gunpowder for Banking, then MIA will research Chemistry. Buy it and Astronomy for lump sum of gold approximately 1500g. Meanwhile K.I.S.S. will research Metallurgy and give it to us. At last stage trade Metallurgy for Physics with MIA. Wait 10 turns as is agreed on deal and give all three techs (Banking, Astronomy and Physics) to K.I.S.S. At that point K.I.S.S. will give us MT.

 

[killercane]

I understand that MIA has Banking and Astronomy. This is how we should act first trade Gunpowder for Banking, then MIA will research Chemistry. Buy it and Astronomy for lump sum of gold approximately 1500g. Meanwhile K.I.S.S. will research Metallurgy and give it to us. At last stage trade Metallurgy for Physics with MIA. Wait 10 turns as is agreed on deal and give all three techs (Banking, Astronomy and Physics) to K.I.S.S. At that point K.I.S.S. will give us MT.

Now that makes good sense then, I didnt know MIA was so advanced. Its an excellent deal for us.

 

[killercane]

In the inbox:

Hi Rob

I know this is unprosseional but I'm a bit pissed, so excuse the bluntness ... AND time is an enemy.

BUT we already have Banking !!!

This whole scenario will take time ... but to start, we will send Banking to you for Gunpowder unless we receive orders to the contrary.

Then, once this is received we really must address the latest proposal sent.

This is also dependent that you agree NOT to pass Banking onto KISS

Talk to you soon

Fe of MIA

 

[killercane]

I gave a short reply that Fe must talk to Robi and I will duly send guns when we get an agreement in place.

 

[Robi D]

Ok i also got a PM back from scoutsout. While KISS and us where planning to get a tech jump on MIA i don't think that will be possible given MIA's offer, however both KISS and ourselves stand to make a lot of gold by getting MIA to do the brunt of the research.

So send the guns, i have PM fe3333au that we are doing so and i've told him that i will PM him tomorrow about whether we want banking or astronomy.

The offer is astronomy and we give them an extra 100g or just banking for the guns.

Personally i would go with astronomy and let them do chem while we rake in the gold

Edit- i didn't read the posts propery the first time, 1500g and guns for astrononmy and banking is also a very good option, i will put it to fe when i talk to him tomorrow

 

[killercane]

K sending guns, we can work out gold later.

 

[Robi D]

Ok i told fe3333au that we sent the guns, they will send back astronomy next turn and we will send 100g. They have agree to give us banking as well but i told fe3333au to hold off sending for a few turns so we can raise the gold. I think that will be 5 or 6 turns at our current rate.

Dear Robi_D of the Doughnutians

MIA would be more than very happy to send you both technologies if that is your desire.

Gunpowder next turn I have already started constructing variously sized mortars for an aerial display that will not only light up the very heavens above Athens, but of a magnitude that you in Nut Land will surely be able to see and hear.

Our condition of course will be that ALL the other clauses are agreed to ... which is just a formality if I am not mistaken

I will be on AIM for a while so chat when you can.

We await your instructions but will send Astronomy if we don't hear anything to the contrary.

We have much to discuss for KISS will soon be aware of our relationship, can't wait for those sparks to fly.

Sincerely

Feaurius III
MIA Foreign Minister

 

[Robi D]

Latest letter from MIA.

Dear Doughnut Government

Firstly congratulations on the Chocolate Pyramid, this should really help in out settling KISS.

We notice the presence of your mounted warriors within the cultural zone of our newest city, in the spirit of being new allies we will allow them the curtesy to stay for now. We assume that the polite request to remain inside was lost in flight somewhere as formal manners are one thing that we have never been able to fault with the Nutters.

We therefore respectfully request another note be sent outlining your intentions with these units, of particular interest is the duration of stay within our borders as we have, like you to us in the past, a requirement that both teams respect each others borders.

Under instruction by your MIA diplomat, we have been instructed to ignore and dismiss the very last message sent by your Turn Taker. Robi_D and I are also in the process of discussing the overall MIA/Nut scenario on an 'official' diplomatic level (we are waiting for his AIM to be fixed before we can chat) as there are many issues to discuss.


Sincerely

Feaurius III
MIA Foreign Minister

 

[Robi D]

Here is the formal treaty from MIA for us to sign

 

[Aigburth]

The treaty is very clear about not trading techs with KISS, do we plan on honouring this?

 

[Kuningas]

here is the signed treaty, page 1&2 are same.

 

[Nobody]

It seems to me that this treaty is in breach of the simpsons protocols.

 

[killercane]

It seems to me that this treaty is in breach of the simpsons protocols.

This agreement was expressly proposed by KISS and has their permission, therefore no violation of that. Now how to trade techs to KISS under Simpsons is a different matter, it may require KISS to declare war, I dont know.

 

[Aigburth]

If KISS dropped off a stack near our core and demanded techs, how could we refuse

Of course this would not escape the attention of the game admins, need to think of something devious and legal.