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Foreign Policy and General Diplomacy

Discussion in 'Team CivFanatics' started by Caledorn, Jul 28, 2012.

  1. YossarianLives

    YossarianLives Deity

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    Awesome diagram Caledorn! I like it :goodjob:

    Our NAP with RB expires at the beginning of T100. We also have an agreement with them to notify one another about other teams that we meet.

    Our NAP with WPC expires on T100 and includes a clause that neither team comes within one tile of each other's borders. We also suggested a notification agreement with them. Although this was never officially agreed on, both teams seem to be honoring it.

    The end date for our NAP with UCiv is not entirely clear, but most likely T92 or T95. I think we should push for the T95 interpretation, but be prepared for them to take an earlier view. This NAP also has clauses that we notify each other of the other teams we meet, and that we not approach their borders.


    Would it be helpful to have a thread like this one to keep everyone up to date without having to follow every post in every thread? Here's Sommerswerd's description of the thread's purpose:

    Spoiler :
     
  2. Maga_R

    Maga_R Has quit civ

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    Thread like this would be simply awesome! I have just joined the team and in spite of several hours of reading various threads I still have very vague understanding of what is going on :-( Some things seems to be decided in-between threads, lol
     
  3. Caledorn

    Caledorn Emperor

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    Thanks for the nice feedback :D And also thanks for providing the info, Yossarian :)

    I will update the current one now, and then make a new version tomorrow with team locations.

    Having a What's going on-thread sounds like a great idea, but may I suggest it's divided up into either 3-month intervals, or that it follows the current turn-thread intervals? With the latter I mean that if we have a current turn thread e.g. Turn 150-175 (I assume we will shorten the intervals at some point from the current 50 turns), we have a similarly created "What's going on (Turn 150-175)"-thread.
     
  4. vranasm

    vranasm Deity

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    It looks like great beginning, but imo we need 2 more things

    1) we need to have it more colorful
    2) we need there more information about the teams... aka "rivals", "allies", "helpful", "bad at civ" etc.

    it would be neat if you can get there even some information about the status of other teams between them, but I can't find a good way to do it, so maybe just in the sense of some text pointers.

    for example the war that is going on it would be great to have it there and especially if you could get there relative positions of teams against us and between them... would make the overall strategy layer situation much cleaner.
     
  5. Caledorn

    Caledorn Emperor

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    I agree with all this, and will try to incorporate it in some way. For number 2 that you suggest, perhaps color-coded dots that indicate our current status with the teams, with a dot-explanation at the bottom?

    For the suggestion about getting more information about status of other teams between them, we need to have a separate one for that, which I am already planning to make when the time is right. With the current suggested update of placing the teams in their relevant positions on the map, it's easy to incorporate current wars on this one though. :)
     
  6. vranasm

    vranasm Deity

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    it could be really just text saying "we consider this team friendly", "beware of this team", "biggest rival"

    while some of these are maybe obvious, it wouldn't be bad to have it on hand.

    otoh open borders, contact can be done with lines as you say.

    I didn't meant it as a ingame mechanics tool, more human relationship tool, so everyone is on the same page after looking on the image.

    Lines are good for trivial relationships (like open borders), but very bad if you need to describe precise feelings of the team about another team.
     
  7. Maga_R

    Maga_R Has quit civ

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    To make it simpler you can just color-code them accordingly. E.g. RB - threat level orange, lol
     
  8. Caledorn

    Caledorn Emperor

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    Here we go. Take 2.

    Spoiler :


    I spoilered it because it's so wide it "breaks" the thread layout. The space was needed though :)
     
  9. 1889

    1889 Mayor of H-Marker Lake

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    Wow! That is really sharp Caledorn.
     
  10. vranasm

    vranasm Deity

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    looks fantastic! I think overtime you will better it since evolution is always needed, but for now it made the picture very clear for me...


    now our diplomats should fill in some of the "none" attitudes

    are we sure the world is flat or wrapped? if wrapped maybe some arrows on edges to remind everyone that we have some southern neighbor to watch for too...
     
  11. Caledorn

    Caledorn Emperor

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    Thank you - I modified it using little nice circles in the upper right corners with this suggestion. Excellent suggestion :) (I.e. that means the one posted above is actually take 3)

    Thanks both of you :)

    This will be a constantly evolving thing, and I'm pretty sure I'll add things as I go. I've made good use of the layers and grouping in Photoshop (Which probably wasn't the best choice of tool for the job, but it's one I'm very familiar with after using it since 1997), so updating it as needed is quickly done. If you guys have suggestions for other symbols or additions, please voice your suggestions!

    I will shorten down the "Our Attitude to them" to say only Our Attitude, and I will add a line where we can state what we think their attitude are towards us. For now I don't think we have much theory about that with any of the teams yet though.

    Also, the map is toroidally wrapped - and that's about all we know. We suspect, based on the map making thread, that there is ocean between the N-S wrap, and that E-W is connected by land. But it's really too early to tell about the ocean. There is strong evidence of wrap between E-W.

    I will also add little arrows to the war symbols, denominating who declared the war. Doing that immediately.
     
  12. Caledorn

    Caledorn Emperor

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    I have added the diagram to the first post for easy reference. Whenever I update it, I will overwrite the file on dropbox, so make sure you use Ctrl+F5 (or whatever your way of enforcing an overwrite of your browser cache is) to ensure you are loading the actual latest revision and not just the image from your browser cache. :)
     
  13. 2metraninja

    2metraninja Defender of Nabaxica

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    I think better solution will be to just add new files in the spoiler and date stamp (in civ turns maybe), so we can have a back-tracking ability to see how relations developed during the game.
     
  14. Caledorn

    Caledorn Emperor

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    Ah, thank you for pointing out that. I didn't think about the back-tracking. Will do it as you suggest :)
     
  15. YossarianLives

    YossarianLives Deity

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    Wow, amazing diagram Cal! That looks awesome. I love the symbols for each teams civ, really nice touch. I feel pretty confident you placed Poly, CivFr and CP in the correct positions on the map.
     
  16. Maga_R

    Maga_R Has quit civ

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    Looks great, Cal! You could make the threat circles bigger for clarity. BTW, my remark "RB -threat level orange" was just an example, I have no idea how they - and others - should be classified
     
  17. Maga_R

    Maga_R Has quit civ

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    Switching to the topic of our overall strategy and how we can leverage SPI treat, I had an idea for a religion-based alliances. I will try to explain briefly. I understand that our goal is not to start war anytime soon? On the other hand, we seem to have problems with securing long NAP - or sometimes any NAPs. Now that we have Judaism and (can run) OT I thought we can offer to spread religion to our partners - in exchange for an unit (or some kind of future repayment) on a condition of long NAP. Civs without religion should be very interested. Since we have SPI, we can get cheap temples, so we should have shrine soon - then, we will get some income from this strategy. But what should be much bigger payoff is that civ that would take our religion would likely invest in it - built temples, spread it to other cities - so their incentives to ditch it (and us) would diminished. Once we can get - with help of our brothers and sisters in faith - Apostolic Palace (everybody should help, as we would be sharing the benefits) - there will be even more incentives to join us (or stay in) in this mutually beneficial agreement. And AP generates very neat bonus for temples - that we get on the cheap because our SPI threat. Of course, our holy city will be very tempting to many, so by no means we should neglect our defenses.

    This is all purely theoretical - I never played MP, probably not even SPI leader yet. What are your thoughts? Have religion-based alliances been tried in MP?
     
  18. talonschild

    talonschild Drive-By NESer

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    That sounds like a good idea to me - though he extent of my MP experience is friendly games vs my dad and sister and about half a dozen AIs (myself of Noble, dad on Warlord, sis on Chieftain, blast her).

    Now, whom would we bind to us? WPC seems natural, as a crowning touch. Spanish Apolyton - sure, why not? Especially if we snag AP. RB is no good. UCiv might be wise. The Germans? Apolyton? CivFr? CP? Who knows?
     
  19. Maga_R

    Maga_R Has quit civ

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    I would say whomever is interested. At this point, it seems to me most important thing is to be in a majority alliance.

    RB already have religion - we can offer to spread ours to them, but they will probably not be interested in compensating us for it, so the idea would drop. Then, they could not blame us for out-religioning them.

    The neat part is that our religion in a break-away alliance member we will have espionage benefits. On the other hand, that may make some teams think twiece about our offer - especially those remembering team Amazaon. Just throwing out ideas - never tried this.
     
  20. 2metraninja

    2metraninja Defender of Nabaxica

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    AP is nice. And people who dont have religion till late do tend to prefer the AP religion for sure. But I never built the AP in a MP I think. It is just too away from the tech paths I want to follow. And I can say I never saw a religion alliance in MP, at least I dont remember such. Sometimes people start to spread the AP religion in their cities if only for preventing a religious win. (Yes, I saw once a religious win in a MP pitboss and I was once 1 vote away from losing the game to one devious Polish ;) hlopak. He needed like 433 and he got only 432 or something like this). Will be hilarious to try and win Religious Win though in an ISDG :D Everyone will be afraid of our espionage and we will win trough the meek word of our priests :D
     

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