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Found a city on a resource?

Discussion in 'Civ4 - General Discussions' started by jrexchandler, Aug 18, 2008.

  1. jrexchandler

    jrexchandler Chieftain

    Joined:
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    Hello All,

    It seems that I always think of these questions when I'm at work and can't test them out.

    I've seen the game suggest that I found a city on top of a resource (corn, rice, etc). If you do that, is there any way to build the necessary improvement on that tile?

    Thanks,

    Rex
     
  2. Defiant47

    Defiant47 Peace Sentinel

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    There is not, although you automatically gain that resource in your cities once you have the necessary technology.

    When the base yield of a tile (not counting forests or flood plains) is higher than a city tile (2 food, 1 prod, 1 comm) for either of the three things, then the city enjoys that higher result.

    I.e. plains hills gives 2 prod without anything on it. If you settle on plains hills, then you get 2 food, 2 prod, 1 comm from your city tile.

    I.e. plains hills with copper gives 3 prod without anything on it. If you settle on plains hill with copper, then you get 2 food, 3 prod, 1 comm from your city tile.

    There are various reasons to settle on top of a resource, but it's usually better to try to avoid it: the yields from building the appropriate improvement are much better.
     
  3. Refar

    Refar Chieftain

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    You will get acces to the ressource if you make a city on top of it (if you have the needed tech). Most of the time working the the ressource plot will give you better yield hoever. Still there are occasions where settling on a ressource is the right thing to do.
     
  4. jrexchandler

    jrexchandler Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2008
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    Thank you for the quick response.

    One more question. Using your example above, if I build my city on a hill with copper, will I be able to use that copper to build axemen, etc?
    Or, if I build the city on sheep, will I get the +1 happiness (or health) that an improvement would give?

    Or, would I just get the increased food, production, commerice?

    Thanks again,

    Rex
     
  5. Joshua368

    Joshua368 Warmongering builder

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    You'll still have to connect the city to your capital via roads/rivers/ocean, but yes, you'll get the resource with all the benefits other than the good workable tile.
     
  6. Aleenik

    Aleenik Pwnzor

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    I always try not to build cities on resources
     
  7. Wolfshanze

    Wolfshanze CFC Historian

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    That's not been my experience... unless something really screwy is going on, no matter where you settle... hills, desert, forests, jungles, plains, tundra... with or without any kind of resources underneath you... I check it in game... it's always "2, 1, 1"... no matter what age, no matter what techs... "2, 1, 1" is what I always get with every city, no matter the tile I settle on with or without resources on it.

    I've seen several people say that's what happens (getting more if you have x or y on the tile), but I've never once seen that be the case... maybe it says that in the readme or manual, but it never happens in my games. :dunno:

    For many reasons, I never settle on top of a resource unless the sole purpose is to secure it near an enemy with superior culture and/or in danger of having it pillaged.
     
  8. Defiant47

    Defiant47 Peace Sentinel

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    The city that's on copper and any other cities that are connected to it, will instantly get access to copper and be able to build axemen once you research Bronze Working.

    That is correct.

    You would also get the increased f/p/c, but only if it's relevant. For example, a sheep puts +1 food on a tile. If you settle on a sheep on a plains, the tile will have 2f1p, and the city will still have 2f1p1c. If you settle on a sheep on a grassland, the tile will have 3f, and the city will have 3f1p1c (1f higher than normal). Of course, this is inferior compared to the improvement, but it's something to keep in mind.

    np :)

    The fact that you never settle on top of a resource probably means you haven't experienced it much :p

    Try it in worldbuilder (or even in a game you have right now): settle a city on a plains hill, and it will have 2 hammers on the city tile. This is especially useful in food-poor cities: better settle on a plains hill rather than grassland hill.
     
  9. Wolfshanze

    Wolfshanze CFC Historian

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    No... seriously... I've seen a lot of topics like this, so I have long paid attention to what I get and don't get... no matter what, it always says "2, 1, 1"... hills, forests, grasslands, on top of resources (I may not settle them, but I conquer plenty of AI cities on resources)... I just always have "2,1,1" as the default no matter where the city is or what it's on.


    EDIT:
    I just double/triple checked... the only thing that seems to make a difference is hills/plains tiles... I can get 2,2,1 out of them, or 2,3,1 on a hill/plain with coal/iron.

    If it's grassland... 2,1,1
    If it's desert... 2,1,1
    If it's hills/grassland... 2,1,1

    Seems kinda lame to me... I would think founding a city on fertile grassland next to a river would give you a better start then a city in the middle of a desert... but it doesn't.

    I in fact try and found my cities in the worst possible locations (assuming the area itself is rich)... if there's a lot of grassland and one desert in an area, I'll found the city in the desert because I can make the grassland useful with improvements. If grassland is 2,1,1 with a city and desert is 2,1,1 with a city, but desert is uselss in a BFC and grassland is great in a BFC... where you going to found that city?
     
  10. Defiant47

    Defiant47 Peace Sentinel

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    1. Forests have no effect on this phenomenon (since they are immediately cleared once the settler builds the city)
    2. Hills do not guarantee a bonus: a grassland hills would give 1f1p baseline (check what it says on the city tile)
    3. Resources do not guarantee a bonus: a gem (despite the immense bonus when improved) gives +1 commerce, so if you settle on a non-riverside grassland gems, the tile has 2f1c (no change in city tile)
     
  11. Kietharr

    Kietharr Chieftain

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    Generally, I only settle on a resource if:
    1. That town has pathetic land and I just really need the resource to meet short term needs (Occasionally tundra copper is the only kind you've got at hand, also in high food starts getting a tundra silver/fur city early is quite handy even if it can't work the tiles)
    2. I REALLY need to save the few turns it would take to connect said resource
    3. Said resource is one I need and it's on enemy borders or close enough to be culturally absorbed or pillaged early in a war
     
  12. Kiwi Tyrant

    Kiwi Tyrant Evil Jollification

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    I settled on an Elephant resource and got 2 base hammers off it.......
     
  13. Virtual Alex

    Virtual Alex Chieftain

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    It's well documented in the GOTM and SOTM and all the other OTMs if you ever read those threads. They often spend 50+ posts talking about where to settle the first city, and have screen shots and everything.
     
  14. Jerrymander

    Jerrymander Epistemologist

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    Hunting and Calendar resources are often the only tiles that won't be affected adversely if you settle on them.
     
  15. quill18

    quill18 Chieftain

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    Sure it does. It gives you +2 Health for fresh water. :)
     
  16. GooglyBoogly

    GooglyBoogly Freakamongus

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    It also allows for levees in the late-game will will turn improve riverside tiles with +1 :hammers:
     
  17. grumbler

    grumbler Chieftain

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    For two examples of getting bonuses by settling on plains, see below.

    Obviously, you'd usually be better of avoiding the resource tiles to get the full bonus yields by building improvements.

    Resource tiles with more favorable short vs. long term yield gain ratios would be the aforementioned ivory resource or perhaps a marble resource on plains hills.
     

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  18. BerserkerCR3

    BerserkerCR3 Chieftain

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    The base is 2 and 1 for food and production for any city. You never get less.
    When you settle a city, you will get the highest amout for food, and the highest amount for production.
    E.g. Plains with Elephant tile gives 1 food 2 production. Combined with your city which gives 2 food 1 production, you get a city that gives 2 food 2 prod since these are the highest numbers.

    and

    E.g. Grassland with Corn tile gives 3 food 1 production. Combined with your city which gives 2 food 1 production, you get a city that gives 3 food 1 prod since these are the highest numbers.

    The best scenario is settling your first city on normal maps is on plains hill with stone or marble. It will give you 2 food (base for city) and 3 prod (base 2 for plains hill and +1 for the wonder resource). (Also you have a really good reason to use the bonus of an already connected wonder resource and a high production to get Masonry and an early wonder.)

    Another reason to settle on a resource is if it is on another landmass and I need the resource right now and the city will be crap anyway. Typically Iron or Oil.

    Anyway, I will sometimes settle on corn knowing that I am losing on it in the long run. Settling on an elephant is even more beneficial since you do not always lose a turn in moving the settler there, and the normal yield of that tile is not as impressing as that of corn.
     

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