1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

French presidential election 2017

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by AdrienIer, Nov 20, 2016.

  1. AdrienIer

    AdrienIer Deity

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2010
    Messages:
    3,379
    Location:
    Paris
    The president is immune to justice. Literally. It's the worst part of our system.
    For example if Fillon had been elected the case against him would have been halted for 5 years.

    If the president was to die suddenly, the president of the senate would act as temporary president, with his only job being to organize new elections.
     
    Kyriakos likes this.
  2. Gigaz

    Gigaz civoholic

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2007
    Messages:
    1,229
    Location:
    Dresden

    Wikipedia explains the details. The french parliament can remove the president from office. When the presidency is vacant, there will be a new electio within weeks.
     
  3. Kraznaya

    Kraznaya Princeps

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2005
    Messages:
    6,822
    Location:
    Land of the Successor
    I'm not surprised that those condoning fascism would have such respect for the rule of law.
     
    Mise likes this.
  4. AdrienIer

    AdrienIer Deity

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2010
    Messages:
    3,379
    Location:
    Paris
    The parliament cannot remove the president from office. It can only remove the prime minister from office
     
  5. Kyriakos

    Kyriakos Alien spiral maker

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2003
    Messages:
    59,174
    Location:
    Thessalonike, The Byzantine Empire
    Actual - documented- corruption of some serious level.
     
  6. Commodore

    Commodore Deity

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2005
    Messages:
    12,059
    1. Who's condoning fascism and what evidence do you have to support that assertion?

    2. What about leaking emails about corrupt politicians violates the rule of law? In fact, most civilized countries have laws protecting people who do just that because they want the corrupt to be rooted out and exposed.
     
    Kyriakos likes this.
  7. AdrienIer

    AdrienIer Deity

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2010
    Messages:
    3,379
    Location:
    Paris
    I think you're mistaken on the meaning of the word patron. It just means boss, as in your boss at work (the person above you in the workplace hierarchy).
     
  8. Kyriakos

    Kyriakos Alien spiral maker

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2003
    Messages:
    59,174
    Location:
    Thessalonike, The Byzantine Empire
    I do know it means boss, it is used a lot in italian too (and one would know it from the movies already ^^ )

    It is what i was insinuating, that corruption is endemic to the 'high bosses' inner circle.
     
  9. Akka

    Akka Moody old mage.

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2001
    Messages:
    13,377
    Location:
    Facing my computer.
    French president have immunity from basically anything but treason (and probably murder and so on), which is one of the reasons Chirac was mocked for chaining two presidencies while he was under investigation (it was joked he did it just to not get convicted).

    It would take a tremendous amount of dirt to give the boot to whoever takes office, certainly not just some low-level corruption.

    If the president lose the office (like it happened with Pompidou when he died), then there is a new election for the office. The whole presidential legitimacy (as thought as de Gaulle when he established the Fifth Republic) comes from being elected by the nation, so it would not fit to have just someone else filling in on the fly.
    Except "boss" (as in "mafia boss") or "don" have (or at least can have) strong criminal connotation, which are entirely and completely absent from "patron". Think more of it as "executive director" maybe ?
    "patron" can have some very slight negative nuances, but it's more about "paternalistic" or "exploitative class warfare" theme than criminal ones. But in practice, it's just "the boss at my job" and really nothing more.

    So far, Macron have had little actual dirt about him, so maybe you should actually wait for some real corruption scandal before starting about condemning him as corrupt ?

    I mean, I really don't like him, and I'd really prefer not to have to vote for him, but I'd prefer to not like him because of facts, rather than make up facts because I don't like him.
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2017
  10. Verbose

    Verbose Deity

    Joined:
    May 17, 2004
    Messages:
    9,768
    Location:
    Sweden / France
    That's also why people in France are actually voting for Macron.

    Unlike Le Pen he hasn't really been in politics long enough to show any kind of color regarding how prone to corruption by it he might be.

    You can always comfort yourself with the possibility that all it will take is a bit of time and opportunity, and Macron will be as filthy as you like. But before that there has to be at least a bit of time and opportunity for it.
     
  11. Kyriakos

    Kyriakos Alien spiral maker

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2003
    Messages:
    59,174
    Location:
    Thessalonike, The Byzantine Empire
    ^Such a 'comfort' is the luxury of people not in countries ruined by the Eu, Verbose. So more fitting in your case, Non? :)

    I'd like to believe Macron would do something helpful, but even in this thread the consensus is that he won't, so why would anyone wanting change be inclined to care about Macron at all? Which is why i do not.
     
  12. AdrienIer

    AdrienIer Deity

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2010
    Messages:
    3,379
    Location:
    Paris
    I think he means well to some extent. It's something.
     
  13. Kyriakos

    Kyriakos Alien spiral maker

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2003
    Messages:
    59,174
    Location:
    Thessalonike, The Byzantine Empire
     
  14. Leoreth

    Leoreth Prince of Blood Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2009
    Messages:
    34,513
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    House of Hades
    Don't you just love it when information that has clearly been available earlier is leaked just in time to dirty someone's reputation with allegations, but not early enough to be subject to public discussion and scrutiny?
     
  15. innonimatu

    innonimatu Deity

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2006
    Messages:
    12,689
    The "leak/smear/whatever after the campaign is over" seems too inept indeed if it was meant to seriously harm a candidate. May even benefit him. Now I'm really curious about who did it.
     
  16. AdrienIer

    AdrienIer Deity

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2010
    Messages:
    3,379
    Location:
    Paris
    Some people looked into the files, and found Cyrillic stuff in the background. It's pretty obvious that it comes from Russia. Also one of the files had a "last modification by :" with a Russian name after it.
     
  17. Kyriakos

    Kyriakos Alien spiral maker

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2003
    Messages:
    59,174
    Location:
    Thessalonike, The Byzantine Empire
    Which seems a bit amateurish, no? Was there anything analogous in the case with Hillary? (no, there wasn't, lest we would never hear the end of it).
    If french media aren't allowed to report it anyway, why would someone seriously leak files when it is radio silence?
    Not that it matters. Might just be amateur crap, might be whatever.
     
  18. AdrienIer

    AdrienIer Deity

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2010
    Messages:
    3,379
    Location:
    Paris
    I agree that this Macron leaks are far more amateur-like than the US election ones.
    I wouldn't be laughing it off if the election was tight. Even an erratic spread of the info on twitter could have swayed the necessary 1% of voters, and it would be more efficient to do it at the last moment when Macron can't disprove the documents, which may be what Le Pen made a deal for. It's just that the only thing that could have swayed the election at this point would have been a huge reveal + a couple days of everyone talking about it everywhere on the media.
     
  19. Kyriakos

    Kyriakos Alien spiral maker

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2003
    Messages:
    59,174
    Location:
    Thessalonike, The Byzantine Empire
    It is just that when they leave a photo of you and your dog on the murdered body, chances are it was a set up :D

    (that said, i don't know if it made sense at all, cause as you say it wasn't supposed to be a contested result).
     
  20. Commodore

    Commodore Deity

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2005
    Messages:
    12,059
    That's the whole point of leaking information about a politician's corruption though. You don't want to give them time to formulate a good defense against it. Assuming the information is true (I'm not saying it is, but let's just assume it is for the sake of this argument), would you really want Macron to be given the time to find a way to trivialize it and sweep it all back under the rug? I wouldn't.

    I mean, if I all of a sudden discovered some juicy information that would completely destroy Trump's credibility, you can bet I would not release it immediately. I would wait until either the 2018 mid-terms or for the 2020 presidential election where releasing such information would have the maximum political effect while not giving Trump or other Republicans time to react and do damage control.
     

Share This Page