G-Major 42

[Denniz]

While the general Hall of Fame is an ongoing competition, we like to run time-definite competitions between updates that we call Gauntlets. Standard Hall of Fame rules (*) still apply, but any games meeting the settings will be counted towards the Gauntlet.

[size=+1](*) Please read the >> HOF rules << BEFORE playing!
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Settings:

• Victory Condition: Conquest (though all victory conditions must be enabled)
• Difficulty: Monarch
• Starting Era: Ancient
• Map Size: Huge
• Map Type: Big and Small
• Speed: Epic
• Civ: Portugal (Joao)
• Opponents: Any
• Version: 3.17.001
• Date: 26th December 2008 to 26th January 2009

Must not play as Inca.

The earliest finish date wins, with score as a tiebreaker.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

. So much island hop micro.

Monarch/epic = blast the AIs to pieces with classical units though.

 

[The-Hawk]

I thought I'd give this a try to hone my post-astronomy warring skills. Since I mostly play games with an eye on HOF, I rarely play for military victories when AI's are overseas. Turns out I didn't accomplish that, 7 of 10 AI's were on the big continent with me. The whole early game felt like a normal conquest, except the fact that I needed to build an economy to research to Carracks. By the time I was ready to go after the stragglers, I was way ahead, so the amphib piece of the campaign was mostly overwhelm with massive numbers. Pretty inefficient game, I think I will try again and shave a few centuries off (I think my date was 1580 AD).

 

[The-Hawk]

This post is in reply to a discussion started in another thread. I thought I would move it here in case anyone else is playing this gauntlet and wants to chip in ideas...



I've been warring a little later. I decided to play 10 AI's so I had less to conquer. With a huge map, this makes for lots of open space, so I thought an early rush would be hard. Also, since we know we need to tech up to Carracks, wasn't sure I could ignore early REX.

I built 5 cities including at least a couple of good commerce cities so I could keep later captured cities. I did a CS slingshot and teched up to maces and cats before my first war in 160 AD (other than a couple of worker steal wars). By 400 AD I had knights, all the rest of my conquest was done with knights and cats, later knights and trebs. Many of the AI's had pikes, maces, and LB's. The pikes generally were a pain, but since I was keeping many captured cities, I had ability to build big stacks. I never killed off an AI, ended up with all 10 vassals.

Having said all that I suspect this can be done way faster. The fastest conquest on HOF at monarch is 1690 BC. This was done with Inca so it is hard to compare to Joao. However, loading up with 17 AIs and an ultra-early rush to clear the main continent is probably the fastest way to go. I.e. conquer early, then tech to get to the other continents.

I am in the middle of a second attempt, but still using 10 AIs and knights for conquest. I think I will improve my first time, but probably not by a lot.

 

[ParadigmShifter]

Just realised I need a monarch conquest game, and big and small, so I'll probably give this a go. Last time I played Jaoa was a conquest on Prince, I just used knights, trebs, macemen and jumbos.

I think it is worth teching to astronomy, maybe bulb it, because transporting all your troops in carracks is a pain. Also, they tend to get sunk by enemy caravels far too easily for my liking. It's a bit easier if you build alot of triremes and upgrade them though.

 

[erikthecelt]

Thanks for the strat Hawk. I've got a bunch of questions.
How many cities before the first war?
Do you have Feudalism before it starts or do you kill the first AI outright?
Is the tech path after CS to Machinery? When do you insert Construction and Currency?
What do you build in your core cities?

 

[The-Hawk]

I just submitted a better game: 1335 AD. It is not accepted yet, but I will use that game to answer your questions.

How many cities before the first war?

I had three worker steal wars. My first real war was in 190 AD.
By 190 AD, I had founded 8 cities (capital plus 7).

Do you have Feudalism before it starts or do you kill the first AI outright?

I had Feudalism before my first war. However, in this case, I finished off the first AI even though he would have capitulated. He only had two good cities, needed to raze the rest so the two I kept would not be culture pressured.

The remaining 9 AI's all capitulated. I generally kept 3-6 cities from each, probably razed 3-4 each.

Is the tech path after CS to Machinery? When do you insert Construction and Currency?

Tech path:
Ag
BW (to chop settlers)
Wheel
Pottery (pottery early because I had a couple of good FP sites)
IW (popped from a hut)
Hunting (popped from a hut)
Writing
AH (no pastures, or would have been earlier... but needed to find horses)
Myst
Medit
PH
CoL
Math
CS (from Oracle)
Alpha
Sailing (trade)
Masonry (trade)
Construction (needed something to build while I research to maces)
Metal
Monarchy (trade)
Poly (trade)
Machinery
Mono (trade)
Currency (trade)
Feudalism
Calendar (trade)

(first war)

Horseback (trade)
Guilds
Compass (this may have been a trade)
Engineering (just for the movement bonus)
Optics

At this point, turned research off, don't need more. I sent out a couple of carracks with workers on board to look for the other AI and for huts.

Theology (trade)
Astronomy (popped from a hut)
Aesthetics (trade or capitulation)
Literature (popped from a hut)
Banking (trade or capitulation)
Music (trade or capitulation)
Paper (trade or capitulation)

research back on, also building research in many cities since I had nothing better to do

Gunpowder
Philo (trade or capitulation)
Drama (trade or capitulation)
Chemistry

What do you build in your core cities?

Capital: Settlers, workers, Oracle, granary, library, forge, barracks, stable. Lots of units.
My 7 pre-war cities: Settlers, workers, granary, forge, barracks, stable, courthouse. Then units.
Cities captured in early or middle wars: Courthouse, then units. One got the FP.
Cities captured in late wars: no buildings, just units.

 

[erikthecelt]

More questions
- what did you do to pop borders or did you just let it happen if a religion spread?
- did you let your capital grow at all our did you just build settlers until after pottery?

 

[The-Hawk]

what did you do to pop borders or did you just let it happen if a religion spread?

For most of the game, I let religions pop my borders. Now that you asked this, it reminds me I did build a monastery for the science boost and so I could spread Confusianism to two of my early cities that were being stubborn about accepting it.

Once I was able to get music, if a captured city had something nice outside the nine-box square, I would build culture to pop the borders.

did you let your capital grow at all our did you just build settlers until after pottery?

Sorry, I oversimplified my capital builds. I did my normal early rex: worker, then warriors to steal some more workers. The warrior builds lets the capital grow. Here was the detailed build order for Lisbon:

worker - warrior - warrior - warrior - settler - settler - settler - granary - Oracle - Library (only one I built all game) - Monastary (forgot about this) - Missionary - Missionary - Barracks - worker (didn't have enough) - cats and maces - stuck in a stable somewhere - knights

The other 4 settlers were built by other cities while Lisbon built Oracle. By the way, I generally would not built this many settlers before Oracle, but at this lower level you can get away with it.

 

[erikthecelt]

but at this lower level you can get away with it.

 

[The-Hawk]

...and the beauty of HOF... if you don't get away with it, you simply abandon and try a new game.

 

[ParadigmShifter]

LOL this game is not going to plan No-one is dead by 1585AD, Shaka just captured my heroic Epic city, I captured the Pyramids from Capac, had to defy an AP resolution to do so, as well as Shaka have the balanced and stable Genghis in the game. At one point 5 civs were at war with me. Fun game though... Just traded nationalism for replaceable parts and am 9 turns away from rifles so with my large empire I'm going to start drafting I think, that should get the game back on track a bit.

 

[erikthecelt]

...and the beauty of HOF... if you don't get away with it, you simply abandon and try a new game.

I'm starting to run out replays regenerates .

I need to pop at least BW in order to get Oracle in on time but then I still too slow getting the first war going with cats/maces. Just can't tech fast enough.
I'm having another try though

 

[ParadigmShifter]

Still no civs dead at 1850 in my game but Genghis is about to be retired I think.

Capac is down to 1 city on my landmass and has a medium sized island with more cities but he signed a defensive pact with score #2 Zara.

Well I guess I need a time win if things don't go according to plan If I can stop Charlemagne or Hannibal launching a spaceship of course.

I guess there's going to be some ugly modern warfare soon. Hannibal is about to get tanks though

 

[erikthecelt]

I have a 1420 win waiting to be checked with a +200k score thanks to The-Hawk for his instruction. All these years I've been playing and I never understood the early REX.

I stole one worker from Bismark and pillaged him back to the stone age. He became my first conquest, I rolled him with swords and cats and kept most of his cities. The rest capitulated although Peter held out for a long time.

I could have been faster if I had known I couldn't pry Optics out of a vassel Had I gone straight for Optics after Guilds it would have been done earlier.

Now I just have to wait and see if it qualifies. (fingers crossed)

 

[erikthecelt]

So what happened? I'm third out of three with that 1420 date

 

[The-Hawk]

I think you might now be 4th out of 4. My 1335 date is now 3rd place. Hopefully the frontrunners will post some tips .

 

[ParadigmShifter]

Heh, probably going to lose this game, not lost at monarch for a long time

Charlemagne has many vassals and when I invaded Capac and took his last city on the big continent he vassals to Zara. My civ is the largest and controls the centre of the big continent but my research is slower than the rest of the AI. Beelining computers for the internet now, not sure I'll get it since I need to finish researching radio and plastics first, and Christo Redentor has already gone so that is an idea of how behind I am.

Genghis capitulated to Charlemagne after I demanded all his cash prior to the war on Capac, Charlemagne, Pacal and Hannibal (Charlies vassals) invaded soon after.

Spies are so annoying in this game, only now getting around to building sedcurity bureaus everywhere.

Shaka is the only civ who isn't part of a team, and he has nuclear missiles...

Charlemagne and Shaka recently competed Apollo anyway.

I'll probably play this out to the bitter end because it is a good game and I really need some practice at modern warfare.

 

[erikthecelt]

I think you might now be 4th out of 4. My 1335 date is now 3rd place. Hopefully the frontrunners will post some tips .

I suspect some SGOTM players with time on their hands


I'm trying to get one last game done now. 450 AD and I'm whipping out carricks but no horses - I have to go and get them off Peter

 

[Kamino]

Hopefully the frontrunners will post some tips .

I am curious. How do you know 1335 is 3rd ?

Hopefully the frontrunners will post some tips .

Well, I have submitted 2 games : wins in 1230AD and 1020AD.

I played my usual REX strategy.

*** Map Finder one night :
- plain hill start
- at least 1 gold or 1 gem
- at least 1 food ressource
- grassland rivers and/or flood plains
- lot of forests to chop
- no barbarians

I started 5 games and ended 2.

*** The opening is very important :
1) 1 worker first (15 turns) then mine the gold / tech BW first (26 turns)
2) 1 warrior for huts and steal workers (with luck, you can spare lot of turns during this phase, this is why I started many games in parallel)
3) chop 3 more workers to chop faster
4) chop settlers

*** Build a strong specialist economy :
1) Axe rush a neighbour
2) Lisbon : grow to max pop, cottages, library (later academy with 1st GS)
3) CS sling shot
4) Chop Pyramids for SE Economy
5) Switch to Rep/Bur/Caste/OrgRel


*** Prepare total war :
1) Tech Guilds (Knight), Engineering (+1 move on roads), Theology (+2 XP)
2) Mace/Cat rush another neighbour
3) Explore the map to plan invasion order
4) Build granaries, courthouses, barracks, stables
5) I even tech Litteracy and build Heroic Epic & GLib (Not sure about this)
6) Switch to Police State/Vassalage/Theocracy and build Knight only

May need carracks to invade oversee's AI

Then conquer the world.