[GS] Gathering Storm Leader Ability Elimination Thread

[Disgustipated]

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [21] = 24 - 3 voted it up earlier, great ability, but it's too situational to keep voting. You may not get the water heavy map you want.
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [23]
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [22]
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [27] = 26 + 1 boring, but provides all game long. Not situational unless you are defeated in the first 20 turns.

forgot to vote on my usual time, so tomorrow's vote may be around 10AM PDT.

 

[679x]

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [21]
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [23]
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [19] (22-3) I'm downvoting this merely because I find it boring. I try to get suzerainty no matter what civ I'm playing as, so this doesn't make my game much different. It just rewards me for doing something I was already going to do. Which is fine, since it's so powerful. Definitely top 4 material. But I'm downvoting it here.
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [28] (27+1) I love being able to get early wonders with such little risk. Especially for Petra: even if it's some random spot in the middle of the desert that you want to settle a Petra city in, you can still get the wonder very easily by just bringing along a builder that you made in your capital or whatever. One builder clears over half of the wonder. Just buy the second builder in the city and bam, wonder in like 6 turns, even though there was no food and minimal production in the area prior. And now that city is good to go.

 

[The Highwayman]

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [21]
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [23]
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [20] [19+1] Fun or boring shouldn't have a bearing on what's strongest or weakest in my opinion. This ability helps me win faster, no question. Same argument can certainly be made for the remaining, but my personal best scores have the name Pericles next to them.
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [25] [28-3] It's impactful, but none of the remaining should run away at this point.

 

[Zyxpsilon]

Wow -- we're down to the last 4! Should be fun to tell them apart as they seem all fairplay if not outright OP. Well.. let's go.

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [22] (21+1) That much pillaging gets heavily OP fast.. yet coastal opportunities are ideal for his tricky Navy. So why not.
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [20] (23-3) It's not really about *HIS* controlled Luxury tiles but how many & where & when precisely. Two edge sword -- conditional.
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [20]
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [25]

 

[WillowBrook]

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [22]
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [17] (20-3) map and map size affect how useful, often small effect early (Aztec's other stuff make them big early, not this)
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [20]
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [26] (25+1) extra charge is great; the help with early wonders probably puts it on top

 

[enKage]

I vote slightly earlier as I will not be able to vote whole day probably.

I consider the most powerful were already eliminated.

Really not sure what to downvote. After septmber patcg AI is again very aggresive towards city states, at least on deity, so Pericles lost a lot, but...

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [19] 22-3. Two reasns.
1) You want to be at war all time to fully benefit. And you are not Alex to be constant war
2) The real king of pillaging is Suleiman. Corsars, available very early = all coastline cleared in 1 turn. OK, gets faith/gold from pillaging improvements instead of science or culture, but janissaries are halfprices, also bought by faith/gold. Anyway, districts give other yields, and you can pillage campus+library+uni one turn and still run away from city bombards. Harald cannot.
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [18] 17+1 That feeling when your warriors kill other playesrs' swords. Bonus strenght to any kind of unit and more powerful ammenities.
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [20]
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [26]

 

[Icicle]

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [19]
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [15] (18-3) I think this is a step below the other three.
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [20]
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [27] (26+1) I think this or Harald could be #1, but I just come back to how many builders I make, how early I want improvements up, and how much value over the course of the game even one improvement can get you. You get so much benefit from this.

 

[DogeEnricoDandolo]

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [20]=19+1 Declare war in the ancient era without capturing cities does not grant sufficient war weariness to become a thing. The next raiding ship that can be unlocked is the Corsair, unlocked 2 eras later, meaning 2 eras that your opponents can build up their infrastructure and a defense. With this, you force people to abandon the coast or never get a single district/improvement up for at least 2-3 eras. If they want to build Encampment and walls to defend this early on, let them, they lose more than you. Just move on to the next city and raid it instead.
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [15]
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [17]=20-3 This ability does not win you the game. More science wins you a science victory, more faith wins you a religious victory, more favor wins you a diplomatic victory, more culture does not win you a cultural victory. You are still at the mercy of civs that are more technologically advanced than you. Even the ability to grab suzerainty does not lie with this ability. It is with the acropolis.
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [27] <= The only

 

[Kmart_Elvis]

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [20]
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [12] (15-3) I think fourth place is fair for this. You are limited by map size and as someone who doesn't play large maps, I've never found this to be all that amazing.
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [18] (17+1) It's literally having the Collective Activism card that doesn't unlock until you reach Social Media!
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [27]

 

[Ceydezed]

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [20]
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [9] = 12-3 Even if you play large map you will need to work your way through more luxuries, if you are unlucky and you only have 1-2 around you, then you need quite some work to start make it happen.
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [19] = 18+1. High culture means 1) better science as you reach the policies faster, including the one with 5% of science per city states (and that is huge when playing Pericles), 2) better religion as you get faster to theocracy, 3) better culture and faster tourist policy cards, 4) diplo points quicker and 5) i assume better military policies, although this is probably less relevant. Culture does not only help you in culture games, or if it does then you do not know how to use it.
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [27]

 

[KayAU]

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [21] (20 + 1) This is not only powerful, it is also fun, it fits its civ very well, and it changes how you play. The ability is not only for warmongering either, as it is useful for popping goody huts, cleaning out barbarians with highly mobile squads of ranged and melee ships, and getting your ships out for defense, exploration (which boosts era score) and getting that early boost to Shipbuilding. This alone would have made this a good ability, even before you consider the pillaging, which is what takes it from good, to top tier.
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [9]
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [16] (19 - 3) I very much like this ability, as it gets you a lot of culture as the game progresses. Unfortunately, it really doesn't do that much for you in the early game, when it matters. The remaining abilities are all more impactful.
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [27]

 

[Leucarum]

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [21]
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [6] (9-3) It's good but time for it to go.
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [17] (16+1) The most consequential of the 4 remakning abilities. Considering this got knocked out ridiculously early in the previous list people seem to be picking up that it's a lot better than they thought. The amount of culture generated by this ability is huge.
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [27]

 

[Kwami]

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [21]
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [6]
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [14] (17 - 3) Powerful, but boring.
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [28] (27 + 1) Free builder charges are fantastic and last throughout the game, helping every victory condition. Building a bunch of early wonders on the cheap is also really fun. You can basically convert Gold and Faith into wonders. Fun!

 

[Architect]

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [18] (21 - 3) Better than a +5% flat culture per city state? Better than +1 CS per improved luxury? I don't think so.
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [6]
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [15] (14 + 1) Lots of powerful things are boring. Doesn't change the fact that they are the best.
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [28]

 

[BarbarianHunter]

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [20] (19+1) --- Not just science and culture from pillaging, but allot of science and culture from pillaging.
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [6]
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [15]
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [25] (28-3) --- Wonders and builder charges are nice and all but don't stack up when compared to the other 3.

 

[Datgingah]

15. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [20]
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [7] (6+1) you are always gauranteed one or two luxuries, and that’s enough for you to start feeling this ability. You don’t need the whole maps worth of luxuries for this ability to be effective. The fact that it starts good and gets better is important. Also nice it directly helps both domination and religious victories directly but every other ability is helped with the extra amenities indirectly.
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [12] (15-3) this ability is the most vulnerable to outside play, as others can conquer your city states or use envoys to take them from you. It’s good, but the least consistent of the ones left.
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [25]

 

[bbbt]

25. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [21] 20+1 Fun, strong, extra science boosts as soon as your neighbor discovers mining
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [7]
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [9] (12-3) Takes a while to kick in, AI conquers half the city states still
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [25]

I find it interesting we have two left - Montezuma and Pericles that are part of overall strong civs, and two left - Qin and Harald where the rest of the Civ is pretty meh and the LUA pretty much carries everything

 

[lotrmith]

25. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [21]
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [4] 7 - 3 How many luxuries do you start the game with? Let's be generous and say 1 unique luxury per city. How much combat bonus do you need to feel the impact (to even get above the random combat variable)? Let's say 5, since you know, other leaders with similar strength like Teddy have already been eliminated and he gets that +5 for free without having to settle new cities in strategic locations and work the requisite luxuries. At what point does this ability become a runaway... 10? So at 10 cities approximating 10 unique luxuries you're at a point where this ability wins you the game? I'd say having 10+ cities is what wins you the game, and this ability is the definition of a win-more ability. That is, after it makes it past the first couple decades of uselessness, and into a very short and of actual usefulness before becoming irrelevant in the grand scheme of your conquering.
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [10] 9 + 1 This one should win, as it's actually the strongest. Everyone around here saying how important culture is until the best culture civ and leader are on the chopping block up against what, an extra builder charge and a measly (yes, measly) little combat bonus? Pericles actually synergizes with his Civ ability and UB.
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [25]

 

[NullNullError]

I really like those last few remaining abilities. They all heavily change how you play the game. Gonna downvote based on gut feeling. Also which civ do you all think got misjudged by the community the hardest. I think trajan is probably the most controversial which is strange as he has a really simple ability. But thats not what im looking for just a this civ has rank 20 but deserves rank 5 kind of thing or the other way around. I think most of them fitting, gonna play a game of rome for certain just to give it a new look.

25. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [21]
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [5] keeps your empire happy. While most civs go for 8 or 12 cities max montezuma can go foe 12 or 18.
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [7] 10-3 a million culture a turn doesnt give you a win.
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [25]

 

[Weraptor]

25. Harald Hardrada - Thunderbolt of the North [22] (21+1) These pillaging rewards are awesome.
25. Montezuma - Gifts for the Tlatoani [5]
29. Pericles - Surrounded by Glory [7]
33. Qin Shi Huang - The First Emperor [22] (25-3) I'd rather have the three above than this.