[GS] Gathering Storm: Toa Rush OP

[yottazeta]

How do you counter Toa Rush?
They cost 0 maintenance gold.
- 5 Attack Reduction on nearby Enemies...
They are stronger than swordmen...

 

[MarigoldRan]

You don't. The only thing more OP than toas are 3-promoted Incan skirmishers.

 

[The googles do nothing]

If you have an early UU try to take the fight to them. If you don't build archers and know how to use terrain to your advantage. Melee units like Toa are slow on land so make sure you give your self time and see them coming. In GS ancient walls are strong enough to cause Toa serious damage without a ram. I would think Toa would get the embarked debuff at sea so try to catch them there.

 

[Victoria]

I would think Toa would get the embarked debuff at sea so try to catch them there.

Sadly the Toa are -5 at sea also and sit underneath navy ships as they move 4 tiles.... they buff your navy! They did have war canoes to be fair and carry shrunken human heads to scare their enemy.

Toa have weaknesses. Not very bad ones like the Warak’aq but they are there. The Warak’aq also has that ability of move after fire which is quite OP.
Basically knights is enough unless they have a general. Xbows is likely best because they do not suffer the -5.

 

[MarigoldRan]

Regardless, I've stopped playing both Maori and Inca as they're simply unfair. Mali is fun and definitely NOT OP in the early game.

(unless you start leveraging city states with your insane cash, at which point they're quite powerful).

 

[WideCoast]

So if one is to try out forward settling and rushing a capital would you recommend straight up warrior spam or slingers -> AH->Archery->upg slingers to archers and go or beeline construction for TOA and go?

E: or start with warrior spam and upg. TOA if you get there before wars are over? ( I assume warriors upg. to TOA)
E2: to make it a tad more complicated enemy might be AI or Human

 

[Victoria]

So if one is to try out forward settling and rushing a capital would you recommend straight up warrior spam or slingers -> AH->Archery->upg slingers to archers and go or beeline construction for TOA and go?

E: or start with warrior spam and upg. TOA if you get there before wars are over? ( I assume warriors upg. to TOA)
E2: to make it a tad more complicated enemy might be AI or Human

You need construction, this takes a bit of time, spam warriors but not too early unless you want to early attack with them, I would look at Getting bronze working quite fast and building an encampment first as you really need to be pushing a great general. It is not necessary but getting a Toas speed up before they can do +3 themselves helps. You also may well need a Ram amd Oligarchy so there is a bit of work to do. A good player does not just create units and pwn, they plan well to get best effect. You may want a quad or 2, these are very powerful early amd only Kupe knows about them at the start of the game.

 

[WideCoast]

You need construction, this takes a bit of time, spam warriors but not too early unless you want to early attack with them, I would look at Getting bronze working quite fast and building an encampment first as you really need to be pushing a great general. It is not necessary but getting a Toas speed up before they can do +3 themselves helps. You also may well need a Ram amd Oligarchy so there is a bit of work to do....

Yeah Well I guess thats why my wars sometimes end fast and sometimes dont xdd

But I take it you prefer TOA rush?

I'm sorry, but I didnt really get that bolded part? Dunno if its my non-native english or lack of GS hours or what

 

[Noble Zarkon]

I have Toa's, Oligarchy and Giant's Causeway in my current game - which will not last much longer lol

 

[Victoria]

But I take it you prefer TOA rush?

If I am playing Maori then the toa is a very cheap early form of knight. Against other units it is 3 strength points less than a knight and 8 points less against cities. They are also very good at sea helping your navy to the point where Phoenicia is no threat.

I'm sorry, but I didnt really get that bolded part?

I was meaning that there is a Toa lvl 2 promotion that gives +1 MP which really helps but having a great general before that helps Toa's a lot. The do not need the extra +5 combat form a GG but the speed really helps them. It is a shame the logistics card is not available earlier.

I have Toa's, Oligarchy and Giant's Causeway in my current game - which will not last much longer lol

no GG?, I guess that would just be too much.

 

[Noble Zarkon]

no GG?, I guess that would just be too much

I forgot about Boudicca but she's there alright

 

[Victoria]

I forgot about Boudicca but she's there alright

That’s a mower Toa

 

[HorseshoeHermit]

I thought it was Hungary that was busted. But I guess those require some setup. Being able to just build the units yourself might get you an army faster, I guess?

... no, Hungary is definitely still stronger. City-States make armies without any care to do any city development because they're not alllowed to build city things, so you just hop over, levy, make the army counts modern FOR FREE, and fight with 4-move weapons that ain't yours. But only Hungary's plan keeps rolling. Game Over.

 

[Victoria]

no, Hungary is definitely still stronger.

incorrect, play hungary on immortal or deity and you will see what I mean

Nubia is more broken as are the ones that start strong. Inca is also quite broken with it's Warak'aq... Hungary... as soon as you realise you cannot get a CS you are just a faster district builder... which is not as good as a good district adjacency player.

 

[Hans Tork]

I thought it was Hungary that was busted. But I guess those require some setup. Being able to just build the units yourself might get you an army faster, I guess?

... no, Hungary is definitely still stronger. City-States make armies without any care to do any city development because they're not alllowed to build city things, so you just hop over, levy, make the army counts modern FOR FREE, and fight with 4-move weapons that ain't yours. But only Hungary's plan keeps rolling. Game Over.

Hungary is actually a bit more luck based on Deity and requires rushing scouts early. I cannot comment on the Maori and Inca as I have not played them.

 

[HorseshoeHermit]

incorrect, play hungary on immortal or deity and you will see what I mean

Nubia is more broken as are the ones that start strong. Inca is also quite broken with it's Warak'aq... Hungary... as soon as you realise you cannot get a CS you are just a faster district builder... which is not as good as a good district adjacency player.

I didn't take the OP to be describing single-player.