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General Planning: War Gaming the Map

Discussion in 'Team SANCTA' started by Krill, Dec 14, 2008.

  1. Krill

    Krill Chieftain

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    Well, I was considering what a GE would give us; insta pyramids if they aren't built by turn 105 is nice, but not exactly crucial to us, would only be really useful if we also bagged MoM for alot of free civics changes and went to a lot of golden ages. Instant AP would possible annoy so many people we would get dogpiled just to destroy it and a religious victory is just so much cheese. Save it for mining Inc would be...farsighted, possibly. Instant Hagia Sophia would be cool as hell though.
     
  2. Memphus

    Memphus Chieftain

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    game will be over before cooperations....

    also i will argue that state property is still more viable.
     
  3. 1889

    1889 Mayor of H-Marker Lake

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    Agreed, unless there will be a huge delay in getting sailing I'd rather not explore with Work Boats.
     
  4. Krill

    Krill Chieftain

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    Something else we may want to consider is that we may start running into otehr teams now, in which case we may want to start claiming our border. For example, the plains hill with the corn and banana looks to be a very nice production city in the medium and long term, and fits in with our dot map. We may want to consider contingency plans for getting a settler and some units down there asap if we find that there is another team within settling distance of that land.

    Spoiler :
     
  5. Viva_Chingon

    Viva_Chingon Condition 1

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    Then let's wait on assigning the second scientist specialist until after it won't pop before the GP...although, personally, I think the GS would be more valuable before but would postpone the GP until way later than the other way around so we should probably go GP>GS.

    Have we talked settling vs. bulbing? (IRT GS)

    If that's the case I think we need to discuss what that'll do to our budget? I would also like to see what the land to the SW of Unnamed City looks like before we go over-extending ourselves in one direction.
     
  6. Krill

    Krill Chieftain

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    Where are we going to get a GS from?
     
  7. Viva_Chingon

    Viva_Chingon Condition 1

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    We talked of building a Library in one of those cities earlier...forgot which one. I figured it might come from there?

    But it seems to me the best place to do that would be in Unnamed City.
     
  8. Krill

    Krill Chieftain

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    City 3 (Jade Jew is currently winning 5-2 but has 2 days left) won't likely be at size 6 until turn 85-90, so it'd be close if we went for a GS out of there before a GP. It'd also damage our GNP, as we really want that city to be working cottages asap in preparion for moving the palace there in time for bureaucracy, if we really want to abuse bureau (Though I think for the 200 hammers a palace costs economically it is a nobrainer), that is, and it would definately make it harder to tech in the next 40 turns. And taking into account IW research time (circa 10 turns), needing to build a library in there, well, it's possible, definitely if we get a sugar chopped and irrigated in time.
     
  9. Memphus

    Memphus Chieftain

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    we get a GS from the GL ;)
     
  10. Viva_Chingon

    Viva_Chingon Condition 1

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    Jade Jew...I think that should be the name!

    When can we get Lit by if we assume that we want IW, Sailing and possibly something like archery first?

    You mentioned IW in 10 turns ATM...and how long does Sailing take to research ATM? I'm kinda thinking we might wanna go IW first if it's only 10 turns IOT chop out Jade Jew.
     
  11. Krill

    Krill Chieftain

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    Well, we could, quite easily I imagine, construct a method to get a GE in IS for the pyramids, which we could build in City 3, and if we pick up a religion by turn 105 we could then get a temple in CK for a priest to get 5gpp/t GP points for a preist by turn 125, meanwhile going to lit, getting the GL in IS by turn 110 if we really pushed it and no teams screwed us over by 1) beating us to the oracle and 2) beating us to (a) religion.
     
  12. Krill

    Krill Chieftain

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    We need archery when we have copper and horses easily accessible? Probably best to trade for it tbh.

    Lit, if we beelined it, t100? total guess, but assuming we don't get screwed about with in the next 40 turns we could get the GL by turn 110, depending on the city we wanted it in (IS seems the best option tbh, or possibly the city 4 site if we could get a forge in there and were running OR or had maths, we could chop it out).

    I am honestly pulling numbers out of my arse. Completely unoptimised, ignoring possible tech trades, barb attacks, city maintenence etc. We'll be able to get more solid numbers by the end of t55 (PS MEmphus, when the oracle has fallen can you update the simulation for worker and unit moves? I'll update the map, but I don;t know what you are doing with the workers so I can;t update it, adn I don;t see any point in doing it until either we or another team, have the oracle).
     
  13. Viva_Chingon

    Viva_Chingon Condition 1

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    Don't follow w/the GE. Are you saying build Pyramids in CK or IS? What would we use him for...GL?

    I was just throwing Archery in as a wildcard.
     
  14. Krill

    Krill Chieftain

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    The GE idea was purely meant as an illustration (and an ironic point that we can simulate that far into the future).

    We could get a GE out of IS, assuming we get a forge in there by EOT 70, to start running an engineer in there EOT t71. Which might be very difficult considering it only has 2 mines, but working the wheat and both mines it makes 11hpt, enough for a 11 turn forge, built t66. We could use it for whatever we wanted, and it was just an idea, mainly as a mental exercise. I didn't think a GS was possible, but looks like it is, albeit seems more costly in terms of lost gold, whereas IS is just working hills and food, so the loss of 2 hammers or 1food/1hammer isn;t that big of a deal for a "free" wonder. It's a more valuble scenario now that we aren't certain to require teh GP first for a shrine by t105.

    Depending on if we get the Gold hooked up, we can get IS working 4 grass hills, 2 plains hills, plains wheat, fish+lighthouse, irrigated grassland, engineer, and the city tile, for a size 10 city (EDIT: can't count) making 25 hammers without the forge, 31 with, for a 12 turn GL build, 11 turns with 9 hammer overflow from previous build, or 10 turn build with forge+OR, 9 turn with 17 hammer overflow (doable). The Gl is pretty buildable in IS without chops or GE burn, IMO.
     
  15. azzaman333

    azzaman333 meh

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    Archery is neseccary for Horse Archers. Axes and Maces are all well and good, but Horse Archers are going to be important for killing stacks of seige.
     
  16. Krill

    Krill Chieftain

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    We may also want to reconsider the site for city 4; we don;t have and most likely won;t have enough axes to found a city for the southern wheat/horses/sugar area for a good 15-20 turns. We could build the north western fish/sheep city, and that would both fogbust that area, and could hit size 6 without a forge with only the gems and ivory (and the forge wouldn't take that long to build at size 6 considering it has fish/sheep and a load of hills if we wanted). It could work the costal tiles and fish at size 6 (not even the sheep, it doesn't need a lighthouse at size 6 to work all coast tiles, it hits 0fpt at size 6, with a lighthouse it would make an extra 6fpt, so it would be capable of pushing out slow workers whilst in commerce configuation) for a base of 19 commerce without collosus, 25 with, and only requires 100 hammers for the settler, 30 hammers for the work boat and (about) 27 worker turns to get all of the improvements up and running (including roads to the city). It also has enough production to even provide miltary units in a pinch if we don't want it on commerce duty, capable of making 18 hpt at size 6, working 3 plains hills and a grasshill, and both food resources. Pretty versetile city IMO, and one we shoudl get up and running asap I think, even taking into account forges. We also need the sheep for health in IS.

    EDIT: Sorry Azza, spent the past 10 minutes working out that post. Yes, we want archery and HBR, but more importantly when do we want them? We'll want them for when we get horses, which we don't know when we'll get. Which why I said before I was basically pulling the numbers out of my arse, working off very basic calculations (not even back of the napkin calculations).
     
  17. Memphus

    Memphus Chieftain

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    yeah city city #4 should be up there....and get it going. more border pops = better LoS once we are over the mountains we have great tactical advantage.
     
  18. azzaman333

    azzaman333 meh

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    Archery/HBR isn't a priority at the moment, but once we have the Horses city, we'll want Horse Archers and (with Construction) Elephants for active defense.

    Will city4 be built before we have IW? If so, I agree with the Sheep to the north
     
  19. Viva_Chingon

    Viva_Chingon Condition 1

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    Can we have a screen shot taken of all of the potential city sites to work with?
     
  20. Krill

    Krill Chieftain

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    There it is. The sheep/fish site isn;t quite visible, it's 6 tiles north of CK. EDIT please note that picture has City 3 one tile north of it's actual location.

    Spoiler :
     

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