General Politics Thread

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Berzerker, Dec 10, 2020.

  1. Berzerker

    Berzerker Deity

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    'Karen is a pejorative slang term for an obnoxious, angry, entitled, and often racist middle-aged white woman who uses her privilege to get her way or police other people's behaviors.'

    This Karen was wearing a gorilla mask and throwing eggs at a black man for thinking wrong. If she was a Republican and Elder was a Democrat the woke crowd would be outraged. The Democrats running the country are more conservative than me.

    Where did I say Trump's photo-op at the church was good and fine? And from what I saw the protesters were moved because contractors were replacing/repairing fences before Trump went to the church. I dont like anyone throwing eggs at people nor do I like the woke double standard this incident exposes.

    Would it be racial if she was a Republican and Elder was a Democrat?

    If it wasn't murder why would I say the murder wasn't bad? You accused me of saying something I never said, maybe you're overplaying it.
     
  2. Drakle

    Drakle Emperor

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    @Lexicus Well, this argument won't go anywhere. You are simply going to engage in both sides nonsense whenever pressed. Or just dismiss real possibilities as fanfiction. Apparently, the only way to stop the Nazis was a completely unrealistic Communist revolution. The Nazis totally didn't have hundreds of specific contingent events to support their lead up, and then WW2 starting, when their crash militarisation program was basically ready, but everybody else was well behind the 8 ball. The Italians weren't ready on paper until 1941-43, which is why Mussonli's entry was so stupid. Even if they had their gear, their army was still overexpanded and had terrible morale. France wasn't confident on a full-on Saarland offensive until 1941-1942 after the war had already started, they certainly weren't going to start one willy nill. Britain was also mid expansion, which they and France had only kicked up, because of Germany. France and Britain indulged Hitler Germany's, it absolutely was not the same blood lust as 1914 Europe. Which was also avoidable. The Soviets armaments ready date was more 1944-45, I've seen some estimates that are even 46-48. If there wasn't a General European war kicking off next door, they likely would have kept waiting, particularly since their economy wasn't doing great, and if there isn't a pressing need, they would have had to divert some energy from war-making capacity to civilian uses. They also only started the ball rolling once Germany grabbed everybody's attention. Same for Japan. They were attacking China but only felt confident to expand the war outward once Europe was in full-on war mode. Maybe they get desperate later, but that's a colonial war, not a general European war. WW2 in Europe really revolved around the Nazis in Germany.

    But this discussion is going nowhere. Liberal Democracy, isn't just marginally better than Authoritarian Communism, it's far better. Flattening everything as equally bad, or only marginally better isn't savvy politics. It's South Park tier nonsense. You haven't provided any reason for your ideology, just endless Perfect Solution Fallacy arguments. Wow, Liberal Democracy hasn't solved every problem. Guess it sucks, maybe you should try something far worse, which has no history of ever working.

    And yeah, the democracies of Britain, France and Italy not being very democratic which is why they acted like that, is an important point, which is why I made it. The reason America is in such a state is a lack of Democracy. If a majority of the vote, led to a majority in the Senate, House and Presidency, then the GOP in its current form wouldn't be able to survive. Their craziness is only maintained by the system being stacked in their favour. They haven't won the popular vote, for the Senate, across the Three Senate class average, since the 90s. Or the Presidency since 2004. Liberal Democracies get better, with more voter participation, and with results not distorted. The reason those states could get away with wars of aggression was a lack of Democratic accountability.

    Yes, I know full well that 'Liberals', as in the more historical sense, supported Mussolini Fascism. Okay, and. My position is that Authoritarianism of all stripes should be resisted.


    When did I say that it was good. Also, here is a parroted lie about it, by Trump's defenders. Man, you are a walking parody.

    Can't remember your own post? Or read my quote tweet? Gears not turning in your head?


    Anyway, how about you and all the other Republicans stop engaging in nakedly partisan identity politics, and actually justify why you support a lunatic like Elder.

    Who I should note, is already engaging in Stop the Steal nonsense.

    https://twitter.com/FrankLuntz/status/1437571557023313921



    There are no results, for tests to be used on. But their base will believe anything. Apparently, it's just impossible for a Governor with majority approval ratings, in a State that Democrats win by blowout double digits, to win again against a far-right loon.

    The GOP is objectively against Democracy. It's a fascist Party.

    Anyway, it seems we are in the End Game, for if Manchin and Sinema want to fiddle while Rome is burning, or not

    https://www.rollingstone.com/politi...ing-rights-corruption-manchin-sinema-1224269/

    They already had to add Voter ID to this, to get Manchin to support it, he better break the filibuster, when he falls on his face trying to get Republican votes.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2021
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  3. Lexicus

    Lexicus Deity

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    Never said it was the only way. I do agree that the KPD screwed up badly by not doing a popular front for example.

    It is certainly quasi- or protofascist. I don't agree it is, as a whole, fascist full stop...yet.

    I mean, I would say the problems liberal democracy may prove unable to solve are fairly consequential, but sure. I also do not believe Soviet-style Communism is the solution to any of our problems in the US today.
     
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  4. Drakle

    Drakle Emperor

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    Then why did you keep arguing against me, that was my entire point.
     
  5. Gorbles

    Gorbles Load Balanced

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    I wasn't talking about any person throwing an egg. I was talking about your use of woke and the fact that Elder is frequently criticised by people of colour. Either engage with my argument, or don't bother :)
     
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  6. Drakle

    Drakle Emperor

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    Anyway, my bet is that Newsom doesn't just beat the recall, but does so by double digits. I expect a 15-20 point besting of it, with possibility for higher.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2021
  7. Lexicus

    Lexicus Deity

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    Seen Elder is already whining about fraud before the polls close so things must look grim for him...
     
  8. Drakle

    Drakle Emperor

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    And it's already a blowout win for no. Running ahead of his 2018 win and Biden's win currently (early vote is more Dem favourable, so will drop back to those levels, or a tad lower).

    Also, Larry Elder's brand of crazy is clearly what the California GOP wants. He is getting 40 ish per cent of the votes, of people who bothered to choose a replacement, nobody else is even close. The safe Republican choice, a moderate Mayor, Kevin. Faulconer is barely cracking 10% currently. That's who they wanted for 2022, and now he has been humiliated, by being beaten by Uncle Ruckus.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2021
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  9. FriendlyFire

    FriendlyFire Codex WMDicanious

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    Its just copied from Lin Woods Trump election law suite that was thrown out already.
    Most likely its to fund raise money from their base
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2021
  10. amadeus

    amadeus ▲ Quiddity Crunch ▲

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    A brief thought on libertarianism and the coronavirus vaccine: liberty is meant to produce a “spontaneous order,” this is well-documented in libertarian political theory. What liberty is not is synonymous with chaos, which is a breakdown of the social order regardless of state intervention.

    As such, Somalia is not a “libertarian” state because there are preconditions that are not being met: some security of one’s life and property. This is not a racial issue, but it may be cultural—Weimar Germany experienced chaos even though they had a much freer society, albeit briefly, than under the Kaiser and the Nazis.

    Thus, a vaccine mandate is not so much anti-liberty as it may be in solidifying the necessary preconditions; its uncontrolled spread has resulted not yet in a total breakdown of social order, but is enough of a negative influence to justify only those measures radical enough to bring about a return to normalcy.
     
  11. Farm Boy

    Farm Boy The long wait

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    We're still taking about a vaccine that the majority of eligible people are happy to take, and that has not been approved as legal to distribute to a significant portion of the (American)population that remains unvaccinated, that being children. I don't always agree with him, but if you're running afoul of El_Mach's negative liberty triggers, while he's quoting the science, you're probably on skeezy ground, at a minimum, and evil ground at a definite maybe.

    He's softened my stance. I don't know why all the due animal trials wouldn't be done either. Do we have a shortage of lab rats? I want my vaccines to have had all the requisite animal trials done, if practicable. Are we being lazy? And I'm one of them so called fascist sympathizers around here. Or whatever foreigners call American local politics from thousands of miles away instead of from the town hall meetings.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2021
  12. Drakle

    Drakle Emperor

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    https://twitter.com/JStein_WaPo/status/1437891185385820161

    Vaccination
    Also of 65+ who are super vulnerable to covid.

    7% aren't vaccinated at all
    another 10% haven't gotten their second shot
    17% vulnerable old people is a huge population. And it's distributed very unevenly, with these people primarily in the South and rural areas.

    According to one estimate, there are 56 Million people in the US over 65. 17% is 9.52 Million.

    Of 12 and Up, who can get vaccinated
    26% haven't been vaccinated at all
    Another 11% haven't gotten their second shot
    Again, distributed unevenly.

    The US is racking up +1000 deaths a day for a reason.

    In terms of the G7, the US is second last, with Japan about to shot past them.



    Most of these are older than the US with fewer children who can't get vaccinated.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2021
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  13. amadeus

    amadeus ▲ Quiddity Crunch ▲

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    The problem is one of deontological vs. consequentialist libertarianism; the former, could they present a solution that was internally consistent? Not under our current framework, because the system as-is subsidizes, via the state, risk-takers and punishes the risk-averse—when the reality should resemble the opposite in a libertarian society.
     
  14. Farm Boy

    Farm Boy The long wait

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    c'est la vie. Ah, that's progress(risk), that's incentivized. I whine about it all the time. Usually when it comes to conservation.
     
  15. Samson

    Samson Deity

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    Is the bolded true generally of libertarians? They do not support limit companies and bankruptcy?
     
  16. Samson

    Samson Deity

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    It looks closer to 30 points:

    With more than 60 percent of the votes tallied, NBC, CNN and Fox News said that Newsom was set to prevail, with two thirds voting against the recall effort.

    “It’s not even close,” Dan Morain, a former editorial page editor at the Sacramento Bee, told Al Jazeera. “They (Republicans) were selling something that the vast majority of Californians simply would not buy.”​
     
  17. amadeus

    amadeus ▲ Quiddity Crunch ▲

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    I can’t speak on behalf of anyone but myself but I would view bankruptcy as a matter to be settled between the contracting parties; both the creditors and debtors are probably going to be aware there is some risk of default and price that into any agreements.

    I don’t have the hard numbers with me, but I’m guessing that most business bankruptcies don’t result in liquidation but a restructuring of debts to keep the business viable (where possible) so that the debts can be repaid.
     
  18. Samson

    Samson Deity

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    I am sure there are loads that go unreported, but going by the news companies are failing every week leaving the creditors out of pocket while the rich owners keep all the money they have taken from the business. I have always thought limited companies was an intensional mechanism to encourage risky behaviour, as the economy works better on aggregate when people take risks (in theory, according to some theories).
     
  19. EnglishEdward

    EnglishEdward Deity

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    I don't think that Larry Elder was a bad candidate; his big mistake was probably letting the
    local GOP cage him into an anti-vaccination position that was always going to be a vote loser.
     
  20. Drakle

    Drakle Emperor

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    That number might go down. But, yeah I don't know why I hedged down.

    Yes, clearly the candidate you want running in a state that voted for the Incumbent Democratic President by a 29.2% margin. Exit Polls have him negative approval by more than a majority of voters. He went from unknown outside conservative circles, to hated.

    Also, why do you think he was 'fenced in'. He is a kook on every other issue.


    Anyway hmm, I wonder what these maps mean.





    Every map, ends up being the same map, no matter what it shows.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2021
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