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General Politics Thread

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Berzerker, Dec 10, 2020.

  1. Samson

    Samson Deity

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    Bellingcat say that the letter is a draft: "A draft version of a letter seen by Bellingcat", and they are very clear that the allegations are exactly that "Unpublished OPCW Douma Correspondence Raises Doubts about Transparency" "This was done, alleged ‘Alex’, in order to frame the Syrian government".

    But certainly, take it with as big a pinch of salt as you like, as with anything else. They are very good at referencing their sources, and most of what they publish is publically available, including all the data in the article I posted.
     
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  2. innonimatu

    innonimatu Deity

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    I's appealing, especially because so much put into it makes sense in the face of the absurdity seen in other media. It's effective to denounce those absurdities and it appeals to everyone with some common sense.

    These sites have all hit upon the same model: bash the wokist absurdities, a very easy thing to do, using a small team of writers putting out reasonably long pieces. The pieces all start with easy denunciations of the absurdities of wokism. But towards the end many, most of those I have been seeing, deliver the payload: inject a neoliberal slant with "freedom" meaning market-style competition and "freedom from government".
    The pieces use two models: personal testimonies about the damage of wokism (emotional hit, more general appeal), and academic-style long dissertations about the history and philosophy involved - these are for converting the young members of the PMC (and those who think they should be in the PMC). Think university students, young adults who are looking for cultivating "intellectual depth", their first encounters with politics and philosophy.

    So the pro-corporate sector of society covers all the field: the packaged propaganda for quick consumption through wokism, and the "intellectual stuff" though the denunciation of wokism! The left is now residual in both fields, the easy and the intellectual. And this second one is very damaging to its prospects because it is designed to hit at that point in people's lives is where political opinions usually "set".
    First keep your targets distracted in the teen phase* through action propaganda (wokism specializes in these calls for action, whether "save the earth protests" or "racism everywhere" or whatever), the "set" them into the actually desired mould when they get into the "seeking for depth" phase of one's life. Bonus point for exploiting one to more easily achieve the other!

    * teen acting apparently extends to the late 20s now...

    I'm not saying that there is one conspiracy to manipulate people. I'll just pointing out how people who think strategically about political influence can score. Lots of groups conspire, every political party or actually factions inside each, and it's obvious which groups are winning within the current media environment.

    The left, if it is to counter this, has to get into the game of being on the side of common sense to attract people looking about how the world really works, in that later state of life.
    But the institutional left shies away from denouncing the absurdities of wokism. Lets it pass off as left, lends it support instead of attacking it! Seeks to build upon that rotten foundation and invariably fails and collapses. It's a disaster and can only be overcome by ditching the idiots who are now managing this institutional left.
    In the US the democrats (including its DSA appendix) are hopeless, in the UK Labour is hopeless. They will continue to be trounced. Either by the "centre" (neoliberals) or by an even more "conservative" reaction. There are several kinds of conservatism though, which is why I'm curious about who are the groups organizing these sites. Where this may be going. I don't think this is Breitbart or even Bannon types. If it is they have refined their act.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2021
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  3. Farm Boy

    Farm Boy The long wait

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    Well, people grow up slower than they used to, socially. It's weird. We focus so hard on protecting rights that sometimes I see that being the justification for arguing against things that specifically protect young people's rights. Such as allowing them to marry each other, overriding parental veto, if they present themselves before a judge and ask for it. Some perverse sort of "doing what I tell you is what you want to do." And, "Your monetary/contractual rights are more important than living your life as a life." Super ****ed up in the head that is.
     
  4. EnglishEdward

    EnglishEdward Deity

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    I suspect that there are many American conservatives who really don't like Donald Trump, Breitbart or Bannon.

    Now he is gone, from the white house, facebook and twitter at least; it is their opportunity to set their stall and rally.

    Their stall being maybe traditional values of family, education, hard work, private religion ,
    self reliance, small business, small government, sobrietary and politeness etc etc.

    I am not sure how much of it is corporately funded.

    No doubt some of them are, but some seem almost hostile to big corporates and while they are
    not left wing themselves, they seem almost sympathetic to the left in some things.

    Anyway I am trying to triangulate between that video and the Ted Cruz speech.
     
  5. Samson

    Samson Deity

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    You would really have thought that there is a significant constituency of "sensible conservatives", who like low taxes and cheap petrol but also rule of law, democracy and rationality in their leaders. You also may expect them to be the most reliable voters, and most generous campaign contributors. Just the sort of people who would like Liz Cheney and hate Q anon.

    It seems the current GOP is doing their best to exclude those people in favour of of the loonie fringe. I would love to think they are shooting themselves in the foot and dooming the republicans to a generation of irrelevance, but I suspect that may not be the case.
     
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  6. Joij21

    Joij21 Emperor

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    While expelling the moderates may make the party more populist (and thus gain more voters), recently the moderates have now been threatening to create their own party. That would still split the party if it does happen, and then neither Republican faction would get elected.

    It's ironic, because for the longest time everyone thought Trump would be the one making his own party, especially after losing the last election and blaming the moderates for not helping him overturn the results. Now it seems the opposite has happened, he's now quite comfortable with the party and has become it's defacto leader. The moderates themselves have become so frustrated now that they're calling it "the Party of Trump" and are now thinking of leaving to create their own party of moderates. Something that a few months ago was unthinkable for them to do (especially when you consider these same moderates were the ones rebuking Trump that under no circumstances should the party be split).
     
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  7. EgonSpengler

    EgonSpengler Deity

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    I would have. I did. It sure seems like I was wrong, doesn't it?

    Can't happen soon enough, imo.
     
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  8. Farm Boy

    Farm Boy The long wait

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    No, they're just all voting Democratic at the moment. You shouldn't get hopeful. That party is a fantastic match for them too.
     
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  9. Joij21

    Joij21 Emperor

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    I'm not sure if the Republican moderates make up a significant part of the Democrat voting base. So if they make their own party I doubt it would cut into Democrat voters to such a significant degree that they would be in jeopardy like the Republicans.
     
  10. innonimatu

    innonimatu Deity

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    I suspect they are because time and again I'm noticing a neoliberal payload starting at about two-thirds of the lengthy essays posted on these sites. The typical "freedom through markets" and "all regulation is bad" slant, though never done crassly. That piece about science, which I linked to also, was only one example. The common-sense position the text opens with and develops is, in my suspicion, the bait. Get people to agree with you: "this guy is one of us", then people will follow where you later lead. Old trick in the book.

    In an era where there is widespread lack of sobriety indeed on the mainstream media, it's easy to pull this off. And it grabs a demographic different from that which Bannon targeted.

    Looking at the US: It's true that this "sober" faction of neoliberalism has its policies reasonably safe as the faction of the democrats currently in power. So what if the republicans go populist, one party is as good a vehicle for power as the other - they switch. Meaning that they can easily switch away at any time.

    Remember whet the predictions in the UK were that the tories would split because of brexit and collapse? I remember. Never believed them!
     
  11. EnglishEdward

    EnglishEdward Deity

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    I'll take your word for it. I have not read enough of these essays to statistically identify such commonality.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2021
  12. Farm Boy

    Farm Boy The long wait

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    Kinzinger has been popping off. It's sort of fun to watch political interviewers for a minute.
     
  13. innonimatu

    innonimatu Deity

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    I don't have the evidence linking the dots on these, only noticing the similar approach and the proliferation of these sites at the same time. I very much suspect there is one organization coordinating and financing this. And I know it would politics as usual now, it's all done through hidden agendas and hidden financing to maintain ecosystems of demagogues. I don't have a problem with demagogues, professional politics are necessary. I do have a problem with hidden agendas.

    And it's not that "left" and "right" as they are presented in the media, by these groups, mean anything. Look at this piece, from a conservative publication, about the dark money behind another constellation of websites and "local initiatives". In most countries the people who are winning from the status quo finance the "parties of government", and collect on the debt when that people get elected. The corruption comes from being able to hide it. And it provides a career path for so many, both the managing of these networks, and the work or manufacturing and spreading the narratives to win each election.
    What the piece gets wrong is saying that case is the billionaires financing "the left" through the foundations they control. It irks me that "the left" is being talked about as receiving this corporate investment. There is no organized left in the US, if there were it would be anti-corporate monopolies. The billionaires are not giving money away, they're getting even richer through investments while pretending to be "philanthropists". An organized left would not be receiving money from those sources, it would be a target to take down! There are politicians who personally tend left, or at least tend populist, as in stand against aspects of the status quo. But so many end up being co-opted into collaborating for the sake of getting the funding. It takes an "extremist" to really refuse to be bribed when bribery seems the only way to success in an election. It's not ending until most voters decide to vote for "extremists" indeed.
     
  14. Farm Boy

    Farm Boy The long wait

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    Once something is a public utility here, effective monopoly is established. Seems reasonably consistent with our more liberal schools of thought. Granted, my quasi governmental gas company has failed to update my billing method for five months straight at this point because, well, that's how things work once you have no alternative. They've had the service address wrong for well over a decade. If you piss them off, they'll find thier competency when it comes to disconnecting you. Tested that one too. There's a "reconnect" fee.
     
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  15. Kaitzilla

    Kaitzilla Lord Croissant

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    Infrastructure is starting to become a political issue in the U.S. this week.

    A major ransomware attack from Russian group DarkSide shut down 45% of the fuel to the east coast of the U.S for a few days until $5 million was paid.
    It is the Colonial Pipeline which is back in service.
    One would think something important like that would be on a private network, but the internet is so convenient.

    Major fuel shortages due to panic buying, especially in the nation's capital.
    Thankfully they will be temporary and last only a few days.
    https://wtop.com/local/2021/05/panic-buying-continues-as-colonial-restarts-pipeline-operations/



    Next, a major bridge in Memphis Tennessee was shut down after a massive crack/fracture was found that could plunge the whole bridge into the Mississippi River at any moment.
    This has caused a major river blockade to form on the U.S.A.'s most massive river, with over 800 river barges being towed by 40+ boats stuck waiting.
    1 barge is like 50 tractor trailer trucks hauling stuff.
    https://www.cnn.com/2021/05/13/us/memphis-crack-hernando-de-soto-bridge-thursday/index.html

     
    Last edited: May 14, 2021
  16. Samson

    Samson Deity

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    I do not get how this happens these days. Spinning rust is really cheap, and file systems that do not overwrite stuff, just mark it as old exist (journaling file systems, but there is a special word for the correct ones). If your data has any value it should be on something like that, and it is just a case of reverting to an old version and go from there.
     
  17. Kaitzilla

    Kaitzilla Lord Croissant

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    Apparently DarkSide is a ransomware service and one of its customers is the one who clobbered Colonial Pipeline.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/thomas...-370-million-ransomware-game/?sh=50bfa4387595
    How exactly the hack happened can only be speculated so far.
     
  18. Samson

    Samson Deity

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    I know the basics of how ransomware works, but on a system that you can always go back to the state any bit of it was at any point in the last month then it cannot really hurt you. It costs a bit more because you have to have enough hard disks so that you keep a months worth of data, but hards are really cheap these days, it would be insignificant for a company like this. We have them at work, running on this sort of kit. Our data is quite valuable, being results from scientific experiments and code and stuff, but it is not the US running out of fuel expensive.
     
  19. Farm Boy

    Farm Boy The long wait

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    Oh that is going to fudge with the basis of grains. Not the speculation, but actual delivery contracts. Worse, probably. It'll bid out rail and truck if prices get high enough. That'll snarl consumer goods up some, too.
     
  20. Birdjaguar

    Birdjaguar Hanafubuki Super Moderator Supporter

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    Trump Weighing Online Partners

    Ex-president, sidelined over the Jan. 6 riot, is wooed by outlets and is considering several
    BY KEACH HAGEY

     

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